PVC Tower Cooling Solution

The faucet is actually cold to the touch now so it appears to be working well. But the foam expanded more then I thought, had to cut some out when it cured. I then used pipe insulation cut up to go up past the barb and the shank.

I'm pouring Sam Adams Oktoberfest through 10 ft line 13psi @ 38 degrees. It pours a beautiful beer. Unfortunately I think Sam Adams has really gone down hill since its become so popular, it almost tastes like a generic Coors product.

In reference to the Sam Adams taste, I retract my comment. I think I rushed the test and didn't give the keg time to settle, now it tastes pretty good. Definately not Spaten but tasty.

Next up, some loal Weyerbacher suds!

tnaratil said:

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Did you have a small child sit in the kegerator to take this picture?!? I may have to call CPS on you

I came across this thread while searching on Google for info on creating a forced air system for my tower. Great info!

I wasn't able to find any at Home Depot's website.

Question: where can I obtain a copper plate?

That was the beer fairy that took that. When it arrives to take the stress from the day away and rejuvenate my soul it also used its digital cam to take a pic for me.


From what I heard unless your unit is out in some high temps you shouldn't really need plate unless there is major clearance issues. Because copper in my area 18071 is freaking expensive, people are tearing it out of everything.

My faucet was cold with just the T and copper tubes I added the extra piece just to be safe. I did this mod for 4 bucks, pipe was laying around basement, T splitter .85, expanding foam $3.

babalu87 said:

I just use ice but mine is a daily/weekend use item

Its pretty popular at campgrounds

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Love this. Got plans anywhere? or at least an equipment list?

I just found this thread and am going to try this method to help solve my foam issue. Here is my question, it seems that all the pictures posted have homemade towers with vinyl beer lines running all the way up to the top. I have a Perlick tower and it has a metal beer line that i connect my beer line to. The metal line hangs down in the fridge about 3-4".

What do you think the best method of installing the copper would be? Slide a piece around the metal line? OR get 5-6 pieces of copper tubing and place them around the metal line so it has the copper tubing around it 360deg?

I have mine a full 30" per beer line, as deep as I could get in fridge all the way up to just below shanks. Copper pipes keeps tower nice and cool, but no sweating issue.

One thing I have learned is that you want your beer line running "uphill" all the way to the faucet. If not, any air that is trapped in there or co2 out of solution will foam when it gets to the faucet. If everything is uphill that co2 will all be at the faucet from the get go and there won't be any foaming from that.

How do you keep your beer lines running uphill when you are using a mini fridge and a 10ft beer line? I actually think the stainless steel beer line in my tower is below the outlet on my pin locks.

I have my beer line coiled up on to of my keg, but there are still low spots where air/co2 collect.

posting so I remember to use this in my tower......

Somebody mentioned using a gel ice pack.

Does this work?

does this work well? seems like the simplest solution.

just received a kegerator as a gift going to do this soon!

starrfish said:

I have mine a full 30" per beer line, as deep as I could get in fridge all the way up to just below shanks. Copper pipes keeps tower nice and cool, but no sweating issue.

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15 months later, this STILL works really well, no fan needed. Just remember heat rises, copper conducts, you want your pipes as low as possible to pull as much cold upward as possible, and 2 pipes are better than 1 large because it gives more surface area.

I'm glad I found this post before I built my Danby Kegerator. I used 1/2 pipe, nice close fit to the tower hoses, then jacketed with foam plumbing tube inside the tower. Bundled with tie wraps, a nice snug fit that stays in the tower all by itself. Can't wait to try it out.

A little spray foam insulation will glue those copper lines in place and add to the insulation value.

Can't wait to do this on my keezer build.
Any idea that saves money on electricity is a great idea! Believe me, I need it, my two boys only know how to turn lights ON!!!!

I'm a long time lurker on these forums, but decided to give a few pics of my recent "tower cooling" with copper. A little about my setup- My tower sits on top of a bar counter while the kegerator is below, so there is a gap of about 2" that I have foam insulation around. I've always had a problem with wild beer and always suspected it was a temperature issue since the tower got almost no cooling from the kegerator.

So... I found this forum and great suggestion on a Google search.


When I originally added the copper pipes, I had about 2" sticking into the fridge and the rest was in the tower. I found, however, that the temp of the copper in the tower was 10-15 degrees cooler than the fridge temperature. I then added a couple of t-joints and extended the pipe an additional 5" towards the back. The temperature of the copper inside the tower is now 2 degrees cooler than the fridge AND the copper did not take up more precious cargo space inside the kegerator. I also insulated the copper with foam noodle and 2 1/2" PVC pipe around the foam. All pieces were purchased for less than $20. Here are a few pics of my setup:











Goodbye wild, foamy pours. No more wasting the first 4 ozs off my tap!

Cheers!

stenbough, Glad to see just the copper worked out for you. A lot less hassle than fans IMO.

I had to join after I saw this thread. Just bought an under counter model and have been reading up on mods to do. The copper seems to be exactly what I am looking for. Just a quick question if you don't mind. The lines/copper tubing going up through the counter, is it just straight up in into the tower or is there any pvc pipe from the kegerator through the counter and into the tower???

Can't wait to get mine finished, just a week away!!!!

Very informative thread,
Thanks
Brick

Anyone have their kegerator outside and use copper? I'm I'm fl and it can get up there in outside temps. Does I work in the heat of summer?

The black plastic pipe is called ABS and is available at most home building supply centers.

My tower is copper cooled also in the same way as the other posters, works great for me

Has anyone tried soldering the copper tube to the taps and connecting the flex beer lines to the copper inside the kegerator? I think this would be nicer and I could run hard lines back to the hinge (of the keezer I'm planning to build). Anyone see a problem with this idea?

crider said:

Has anyone tried soldering the copper tube to the taps and connecting the flex beer lines to the copper inside the kegerator? I think this would be nicer and I could run hard lines back to the hinge (of the keezer I'm planning to build). Anyone see a problem with this idea?

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As long as you can solder copper to whatever metal the connection tube is

Does anyone know if there are any dangers to having beer plumbed directly into copper pipe? IIRC beer is mildly accidic (carbonic acid at least), and dissolves copper. Albeit very slowly, I justdon't remember wether copper poisoning could be a factor...I'm sure someone more informed than me will chime in here

I was worried about this but I saw this article

http://morebeer.com/brewingtechniques/library/backissues/issue4.5/miller.html

Great idea! Question: I am about to to a build which will be built into my cabinets and the tower will be on the counter top. The height is not a huge difference but it is higher than just coming straight out of the top of the fridge. It's 4" higher. Would this application work in your opinion?

Hi All,
I was wondering if anyone used this method when their fridge was in the basement and the tower was on the first floor ( counter height)? I am planning on building a tower made of copper at my kitchen sink, but my mini fridge needs to be in the basement for space issues ( small house). I would appreciate any feedback on this. Thanks in advance.

Cheers,
Kev

What I'm not understanding is what holds the copper pipe in place? Is it just the foam insulation and friction?

You got it, friction. The beverage tubing has a small clearance through the copper pipe and the foam insulation also keeps it anchored.

I built my kegerator yesterday and used the copper pipe. The space between my mini fridge and the top of the counter top is about 4 inches which I used a piece of galvanized pipe. So far it is a success. No foamy beer pretty consistant temp. Thanks for the post. I used a small piece of electrical tape to hold the pipe in place.

Guys,

Figured I'd post my pics of this project I just did. I built this kegerator a couple years ago and figured I'd add this modification instead of the fan route. (I also removed my temp sensor which was connected directly to the back coolant plate and left it hanging on the bottom, much better control of temps which will get your beer cooler without a wide range like hey its 40 then a small nudge of the knob and now its 25! haha)


Here's what I picked up: 4' of 1/2" copper pipe (type L cause it was cheaper), 2 - 1/2" pipe T's, 2 - 1/2" elbows, and spray foam.

Luckily I was able to have the guy at the shop cut the pipe for me so I just bought a reamer to remove the burrs. My pipe lengths were 2 - 14" pieces, and 4 - 5.5" pieces.

I had to remove the top connections due to the keg connectors to tube connection having some kind of crimped clamp instead of a pipe clamp (not a big deal just more work). Added plastic wrap on the ends of the beers lines and just slid them up the copper pipe (remember to add the 1/2" T connection on the bottom!) and installed the beer line back onto the metal tube fitting then back onto the tap shank. Notice there's rubber bands in-between the pipe and the tubes, this is to hold them in place while I sprayed the foam and it set. I also manipulated the beer lines so that the pipes stayed away from the edges and didn't move during the set-up time. Then I started from the bottom and sprayed foam until the bottom was filled and then filled the top. Here's where you should be cautious; DO NOT COMPLETELY FILL THE TOWER WITH FOAM! What I mean by this is leave a good 1-2" of the copper exposed to allow for the foam to expand and NOT GO PAST the copper pipe. You want the tops exposed to keep that small pocket of air cooled as well. Yes you can trim back the foam however it's just an extra pain especially when it gets around your tube clamp (want to make sure you have access to those if you ever have to remove the line in the future).

I currently have my too kegs (dark cherry lager and canadian blonde XXX X= increased alcohol content) chillin there then will start carbonating soon. I should have some results in 2 weeks.

bradsul said:

Yes that is true. Space considerations and clearance don't allow that in my case. But there is also less than 1C differential between the temperature of the copper in my fridge and at the top of the tower so I'm not worried about it in my case.

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Can someone see if they can tell where I went wrong? I'm on my third attempt at a copper pipe setup on my new kegerator... and am running out of money and patients on getting a perfect pour every time.

I have two pieces of 1/2" copper pipe running up as close as possible to the shank, and as far into the kegerator as possible. I have wrapped each pipe in PVC pipe insulation tape, wrapped that in the best foam insulation I could find, then wrapped that again in the PVC pipe insulation tape. I left a lot of extra foam at the top, to fill the entire void between my shanks and the cap on the tower, and have the insulation going down to right where the pipes enter the kegerator. The pipes extend down 5-6" then I have a T connection where a ridiculous amount of copper extends back to the cooling plate and then across it to the fan. I couldn't fit more copper, or more insulation. There is no exposed copper anywhere outside of the fridge.

Brad, how are you only seeing 1C (I assume that's one degree?) difference from the inside of the kegerator and the top of the tower. I'm reading 34 degrees inside, and 58 degrees at the top... I saw it drop to about 48 up top, when I turned on "Deep Chill" (just the fan staying on and trying to cool to 32) and ran it all night, but my salesman said it can freeze my keg.

I JUST learned as much as I was able to comprehend on "balancing my system" and I have 40" of 3/16" ID vinyl beer line, at 8psi, with and Stone IPA (2.3 CO2 volume?)... STILL getting a gnarly first pour. I cannot figure out what I'm doing wrong.

Anyone seeing a flaw in my system? If so, please dumb down your answer as much as possible I'm just an alcoholic, and not a pro, on this most nobel quest.

Thanks

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Looks like more than enough copper to me.

When I had one of these fridges, I filled my entire tower (except the top few inches) with expanding foam, this provided the insulation needed and glued the copper in place. I used some flexible foam sheets to fill the void at the top so I could access and change the lines if needed.

Also 40" lines are not long enough, I use 10 feet of 3/16" lines.

I only insulate a thin sheet around the inside of the tower and use a small fan to blow cool air up into the tower
I have no issues at all

problem I see is that you have insulated the entire top from getting cooling from the bottom

look at it like this, the void in the top is being affected by the mass of the metal around it, all of that metal is being heated by the outside ambient temperature and the only thing cooling down is the copper line and the beer coming up from the bottom. you are using only convection as there is no air flow in there. so as the amount of mass in contact of the warm air is significantly higher than the amount of mass in contact with the cool air below the warm air wins out. take this with the fact that warm air rises and cold air lowers you can see why the top is not cooling, Now if you were to remove the insulation from around the pipes coming from below, and insulate around the inside of the tower leaving enough room for air to flow, then find a way to recirculate the air in the tower you will be introducing more cool air around the beer lines and cooling them off, once you hit the faucets there is not much you can do as the mass of metal is going to over come efforts from below, unless you have a near constant flow rate of cool beer those faucets will remain warm
Towers with a top box are designed to have the max amount of air flow around the beer lines to keep the beer cool, simple tube towers do not have that luxury so you need to move the air faster to keep more cooling air around the lines.

Yeah. Can't speak on the cooling since I have a remote glycol setup but even when I had my keezer I never ran less than 10' of line and always had a perfect pour


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The issue is the line length. You should be running at about 12psi on your CO2 to keep your beer carbed properly. To do this you need to be running lines at around 10 feet. Once you do it, you will know why people always have this response to "foamy beer that is not overcarbed"


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