New Automated Brew Rig

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Gripped

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Location
manhattan
The Beginnings

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Inaugural brew day on the new system coming shortly. If anybody has questions about this build or interested in additional details of the components I will be more than happy to share. It has been about a year in the making so far.

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Sweet Jesus... I don't even know what's going on in that box. I'm guessing you hit play and 4 hours later you have fermenting wort? Nice build man.
 
Temp control for HLT and Boil, valve control for each vessel, interface is completely wireless via ipad/iphone. I still have piping for water in through carbon filter and supply to heat exchanger. You cant take all of the fun out of brewing by automating everything but it certainly will make brew days a bit easier. Of course I always enjoy these too.

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I am using a BCS 462 for the IO and 8 channel relay for all of the low volt output, 2 channel relay for 110 volt pump control, and two solid state relays for the heating elements. In terms of automation its mostly temp control and pump control. Depending upon how detailed you want to get with the BCS it can be one touch, but really its more about making an awesome brew rig than making good beer. Frankly you can make great beer with a cooler and a decent pot as long as you keep good records and keep sanitary conditions.
 
Very, Very Nice Electrical Panel Layout, Especially The Panduit Wire Ducting,
Super Clean & Ease Of Maintenance Troubleshooting
Your Attention To Details Show, Outstanding, Thank's For Posting!
 
Still have a bunch of wires to land in that little box but hopefully it still looks as clean when it is complete
 
Software? are you writing your own "heat curve and time tables?" Ipad, touch phone.. meaning android software like on my google tablet?? (I'm a older guy) I have my "megasquirt fuel injection" connected to the android and I thought that was cool, you outdone that by a long shot. I'm going to have to read up on that hardware. Very interesting.

Very neat system, "showboating", nice fab shop.. you can't see the floor in mine.

Even the wiring, the "loops" on top of the SSR's show a "old school" touch, enough wire to pull it down and reconnect if that connection burns off.
 
I certainly don't have the chops to write the software that comes with the BCS http://www.embeddedcontrolconcepts.com/

The system is controlled entirely by tablet or device that can log into a wireless access point.

I have been doing a little programming with an arduino in an attempt to integrate volume control into the system.

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valve control for each vessel

Will you be able to feather the valves? Pretty sure the Dout on the BCS are just +12V/0V. IMHO being able to control flow through a HERMS is pretty important during recirculation unless you want a stuck mash. Curious how you're dealing with this. . . :eek:
 
Suggestion?

A mash screen like a collander, a stainless float valve, this will "disperse" the flow over the top of the grain bed. It could only flow as fast as the holes allowed across the grain.

You're doing what I'd like to be.. but.. we all travel down our own path, and I have other priorities. Maybe I can drag along behind your achiements thou?

COMPUTER data acquisition?, saving the "heat", "Time" into graphs.. results with products and "types" so you can actually make a heat curve.. I've done that for carpet mill yarn production machinery and diagnosed "what was going wrong" during the failures later in dying colors..( I got a salary position & executive parking slot there for my old oil leaker 1958 Harley, and/or truck.)

SO, regardless of "type of equipment" if you followed a "heat curve, time length, did the same ingredients" you'd have the same results.. RIGHT?? or am I a newbie lost in the darkness of brewing magic??
 
Very nice! Love how you got it down to 4 automated valves.
I',m in the process of figuring out my flow control. Can you explain how yours is going to work? Are you using bottom drains in all three vessels? Will the pump prime coming from the plate chiller? When the Wort is cool, will you just take that second hose off the BK and put it in the fermenter?
 
Will you be able to feather the valves? Pretty sure the Dout on the BCS are just +12V/0V. IMHO being able to control flow through a HERMS is pretty important during recirculation unless you want a stuck mash. Curious how you're dealing with this. . . :eek:

Currently I have a stainless hand valve to control flow for sparging. You are correct the digital outputs on the BCS are on/off and would require a float switch or flow monitor for control. Possibly in the future.
 
Suggestion?

A mash screen like a collander, a stainless float valve, this will "disperse" the flow over the top of the grain bed. It could only flow as fast as the holes allowed across the grain.

You're doing what I'd like to be.. but.. we all travel down our own path, and I have other priorities. Maybe I can drag along behind your achiements thou?

COMPUTER data acquisition?, saving the "heat", "Time" into graphs.. results with products and "types" so you can actually make a heat curve.. I've done that for carpet mill yarn production machinery and diagnosed "what was going wrong" during the failures later in dying colors..( I got a salary position & executive parking slot there for my old oil leaker 1958 Harley, and/or truck.)

SO, regardless of "type of equipment" if you followed a "heat curve, time length, did the same ingredients" you'd have the same results.. RIGHT?? or am I a newbie lost in the darkness of brewing magic??


I will be able to have data acquisition to retain temp profiles of each brew. I am hoping that having the bit of automation will enable me to produce brews that are consistent. Of course controlling fermentation is as or more important. I suppose a temp controlled fermentation chamber or fermentor is the next step.

I have a jacketed hopper I would like to turn into a fermentor in the future. I will keep you up to date on that project as it develops.

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Very nice! Love how you got it down to 4 automated valves.
I',m in the process of figuring out my flow control. Can you explain how yours is going to work? Are you using bottom drains in all three vessels? Will the pump prime coming from the plate chiller? When the Wort is cool, will you just take that second hose off the BK and put it in the fermenter?

I have two additional solenoid valves that control water into the HLT and through the plate chiller. I will post up the progress once it is plumbed.

All three vessels have bottom drains, the HLT and Boil kettle have offset drains so I can create a whirlpool without pulling out too much of the cold break into the fermentor. The mash tun has a center drain under the false bottom.

I hope the pump will prime from the boil kettle, I will find out when I do the first wet test of the system.

When the wort is cool I will just break the tri clamp connection and move it into the fermentor. Very insightful questions, looks like you understand the flow of the system pretty well.
 
Will you be able to feather the valves? Pretty sure the Dout on the BCS are just +12V/0V. IMHO being able to control flow through a HERMS is pretty important during recirculation unless you want a stuck mash. Curious how you're dealing with this. . . :eek:

Currently I have a stainless hand valve to control flow for sparging. You are correct the digital outputs on the BCS are on/off and would require a float switch or flow monitor for control. Possibly in the future.

Have you thought about pump motor control, automating a PWM for the pump to control the flow instead of a manual valve?
Since you are doing something with the Arduino for flow/volume sensing I though this could be added into that module with a switch for full power or sparging rate.
 
Have you thought about pump motor control, automating a PWM for the pump to control the flow instead of a manual valve?
Since you are doing something with the Arduino for flow/volume sensing I though this could be added into that module with a switch for full power or sparging rate.

That is something that is great about Arduino, PWM is something I've been thinking about utilizing for flow control. I have a ways to go to figure out how to integrate the Arduino with the BCS. The BCS allows for digital inputs but no analog inputs. I'm not sure how to make this happen.
 
That is something that is great about Arduino, PWM is something I've been thinking about utilizing for flow control. I have a ways to go to figure out how to integrate the Arduino with the BCS. The BCS allows for digital inputs but no analog inputs. I'm not sure how to make this happen.

In terms of the flow control it would be "relatively" simple if you were using the Arduino for 2 speed control - Digital output from BCS to Arduino to signal "sparge mode" - Arduino reduces the PWM to a set point (or if getting flash a set flowrate with feedback from the flowmeter).
How are you intergrating the volume measurement back into the BCS, that would be what I would struggle with.

I have a chopper Router speed controller that I bought off ebay that I want to trial PWM my pump next brewday. At the moment my pump is very oversized since the supplier messed up and to compensate for being out of stock they offered to send me the next pump up, which ended up with going from a 40W to a 80W pump! Throtling with a ball valve has my valve almost shut to get a slow flow, PWM might give me the flexibility I need as when the motor slows down the pump will slow exponetially. Hopefully going do to 80% should get me sparging well.
 
In terms of the flow control it would be "relatively" simple if you were using the Arduino for 2 speed control - Digital output from BCS to Arduino to signal "sparge mode" - Arduino reduces the PWM to a set point (or if getting flash a set flowrate with feedback from the flowmeter).
How are you intergrating the volume measurement back into the BCS, that would be what I would struggle with.

I have a chopper Router speed controller that I bought off ebay that I want to trial PWM my pump next brewday. At the moment my pump is very oversized since the supplier messed up and to compensate for being out of stock they offered to send me the next pump up, which ended up with going from a 40W to a 80W pump! Throtling with a ball valve has my valve almost shut to get a slow flow, PWM might give me the flexibility I need as when the motor slows down the pump will slow exponetially. Hopefully going do to 80% should get me sparging well.

I don't have the volume control integrated yet. I have tried connecting the BCS to the Arduino through a digital input but it is still on/off control. I would prefer if I could control pump output via voltage control, however I am not sure it is possible. That is one of the drawbacks of using BCS, no PWM input for volume control. I considered using cheap load cells but that is quite a ways down the road. The flow meter could utilize a digital output to determine flow rate, but its going to take a bit of programming that I haven't even begun to think about. I think that that ball valve throttling is ideal however the valves I have do not support positional control and are 12v open and 0v closed.
 
every dc motor "can be a servo" if you just add a digital encoder feedback to the motor shaft. I made a 1/2 hp 90 volt motor into a servo here. Several window motors from autos.. (toys). You don't need a quadrature since "direction of pump is known by polarity". It could be a magnet and a hall effect sensor.

Gecko, or "ardino cpu" (spelling) could do pulse feedback-motor rpm control.

(neat looking fermenter) Some days I can see to tig weld, other days just piss me off. I worked in my shop for 2 hours today.
 
every dc motor "can be a servo" if you just add a digital encoder feedback to the motor shaft. I made a 1/2 hp 90 volt motor into a servo here. Several window motors from autos.. (toys). You don't need a quadrature since "direction of pump is known by polarity". It could be a magnet and a hall effect sensor.

Gecko, or "ardino cpu" (spelling) could do pulse feedback-motor rpm control.

(neat looking fermenter) Some days I can see to tig weld, other days just piss me off. I worked in my shop for 2 hours today.

Some of that is far over my head. I know that the flow sensor I am using is in essence a hall effect senor measuring rpm of the impeller. The pumps I am using are 115v AC motors with a mag drive impeller head. Since the pump is magnetic driven I believe you can restrict outflow. I don't know if it is possible to utilize a frequency drive on a single phase motor like these?

The fermentor is another project for later, something I found from a stainless scrap dealer who deals in food processing equipment. Most of the raw materials used in this build were purchased by the lb as scrap.

Glad to hear that you are getting some time in working in your shop. This project has taken quite a while as motivation ebbs and flows at times.
 
There is such a thing as a single phase frequency drive, but I think it just simulates three phase to the motor. I don't believe there is such a thing for a single phase motor. If you had the 240v single phase, maybe there's some voodoo there to make it work. As far as restricting flow with some sort of control valve; what options do you have? I work in a chemical plant, so I see all kinds of control valves, but I don't know what is available to home brewers. If the control board only does digital outputs, maybe you could use parallel solenoid valves of different sizes. Kind of a high/low speed flow. Just an idea.
 
Nice setup... stay with controlling flow by restricting output, centrifugal pumps work best that way, if you have a positive displacement pump, such as a flexible impeller pump, then you use speed control... I suggest jogging the valve by removing the constant power and only adding power in short pulses to move it either way.. use low-pressure switches like those on a hot tub rims heater tube to detect flow... are you on the BCS forum? oh, just looked and saw your post there... again, nice setup!
 
Subbed, this is exactly what I'd like to build in the very near future. I especially love the weld-in tippy dump on your tun. How do you keep a small amount of grain from building up at the lip or do you just not care at that point and go in the old-fashioned way with a scoop (aka hand) and clean it out manually like all the poorsies out there?
 
Subbed, this is exactly what I'd like to build in the very near future. I especially love the weld-in tippy dump on your tun. How do you keep a small amount of grain from building up at the lip or do you just not care at that point and go in the old-fashioned way with a scoop (aka hand) and clean it out manually like all the poorsies out there?

The mash tun does have a lip on it and I imagine I will just scoop it out with my hand. The tippy dump is designed so I can break the tri clamp connections and lift the tun off the stand if I need.
 
What are those motorcycle pipes coming out the side of the control box for?

Haaaa those kick ass headers coming off the control panel are my way of limiting the number of penetrations I had to make in the panel. They are 2" stainless scrap tubing, I am going to pull my low volt wires through one and my high volt wires for the pumps through the other.
 
What did you do for boxes around the heating elements?

I haven't made the cable connections yet but I have some large heat shrink that fits around the connections and the element, I will post up some pics once I have them finished.
 
Advice from a old electrician?

Heat shrink, thou great at sealing things up sometimes.. When you place it "around" a connection that has a screw terminal, as it tightens, it can loosen the lugs. Since it is closed up? you can not retighten them, (Cutting it off to tighten and you must determ one end to slip a new piece on) over a period of time it loosens more and heats up burning the connection. (This is from experience working with 25-100hp floating aeration pumps in sewage plants) Horrible job, real Sh****, I had child support to pay.

I'd be more tempted to get a " round exterior" cast electrical box, cut a hole fitting the threads on the back side and if you have "room" on the bung tighten up against it with a lock nut. If you have the tap-equipment put threads in it.. (sell a few to pay for the tap) Turn the cable-flex junction down, water don't normally run UP. CGB, Rubber cord grip, thou not water tight, can be drip tight.. OR coated flex with water tight connectors.

OF COURSE, you could take the "encapsulating" castable polymer approach, and take a form (coke bottle) and fill it with the polymer around the element connections, as it hardens it seals up and "will never" come loose, off again.. the cable and element are considered throw aways when they fail, if they fail. If you do this? you should go on and "cast some image" there on the polymer, perhaps a art deco?? (doll head, cat-dog, toy?)

HEY. Check out the fermentation "beer bug" on the other posts.. Might fit right into your line of work and automation scheme. All that shiny stainless is just crying for a colored LED string light show too.. sparkly.. (from a large child in GA) I love sparkly.
 
Advice from a old electrician?

Heat shrink, thou great at sealing things up sometimes.. When you place it "around" a connection that has a screw terminal, as it tightens, it can loosen the lugs. Since it is closed up? you can not retighten them, (Cutting it off to tighten and you must determ one end to slip a new piece on) over a period of time it loosens more and heats up burning the connection. (This is from experience working with 25-100hp floating aeration pumps in sewage plants) Horrible job, real Sh****, I had child support to pay.

I'd be more tempted to get a " round exterior" cast electrical box, cut a hole fitting the threads on the back side and if you have "room" on the bung tighten up against it with a lock nut. If you have the tap-equipment put threads in it.. (sell a few to pay for the tap) Turn the cable-flex junction down, water don't normally run UP. CGB, Rubber cord grip, thou not water tight, can be drip tight.. OR coated flex with water tight connectors.

OF COURSE, you could take the "encapsulating" castable polymer approach, and take a form (coke bottle) and fill it with the polymer around the element connections, as it hardens it seals up and "will never" come loose, off again.. the cable and element are considered throw aways when they fail, if they fail. If you do this? you should go on and "cast some image" there on the polymer, perhaps a art deco?? (doll head, cat-dog, toy?)

HEY. Check out the fermentation "beer bug" on the other posts.. Might fit right into your line of work and automation scheme. All that shiny stainless is just crying for a colored LED string light show too.. sparkly.. (from a large child in GA) I love sparkly.

Excellent idea on encapsulation! What kind of polymer resin would you suggest?
 
(Probably more info than you want??)

I encapsulated pc boards with synair castable polymer ( 1990s Chattanooga Tn). They only want to sell it in 55 gallon drums now thou, you can buy from a hobby dealer who dips you a smaller portion out.. bare metal foil? was one such place.. 50/50 mix by volume, less than 1% shrinkage. Rockwell 80-93 hard (by memory), you can drill and tap it.

Dascar plastics RP-40 is a castable resin. I've saw it used in Underwater robotics to seal cables to joints. No personal experience with it.

THE synair, I first cast it in the 80s making tattoo machine frames, when the catalyst "breaks" and heats up, (I had this in a rubber mold) it smokes, starts turning white, remembering my "DON"T MIX acids" training I turned and ran from the room expecting the explosion to occur, it didn't. It can be startling when it hardens. It happens fast if you don't have it out of the mixing cups it is "there".

There is "no" cleaning a pc board off for a minor repair, and if you didn't get the flux off the solder joints, they corrode even under the sealant. (or a electrical connection)
I'd send you a cup, but it has a shelf life and mine expired. Went hard without the catalyst.
 
Love it! Two questions: What thought process did you go through for the choice of controllers. (BCS vs Brewtroller) and second, where did you source the project box to contain all that ugly/beautiful electronics? Please don't tell me it was a fabrication... I want to start my build with the controller/ valves etc while I'm still working out of state and living in an apartment, so fabricating a box will be difficult but I'm having a hard time finding larger project boxes.
 
Love it! Two questions: What thought process did you go through for the choice of controllers. (BCS vs Brewtroller) and second, where did you source the project box to contain all that ugly/beautiful electronics? Please don't tell me it was a fabrication... I want to start my build with the controller/ valves etc while I'm still working out of state and living in an apartment, so fabricating a box will be difficult but I'm having a hard time finding larger project boxes.

The BCS is pretty straight forward, I looked into the Brewtroller and the newest version is nice with DIN rail mount enclosure and all of the new generation components look very PLC like. I think the ultimate decision was the web interface of the BCS.

The enclosure is a Wiegmann electrical enclosure 16"X18"X6", I went with a pretty small enclosure and barely could fit everything in, I just rattle can painted it after making all of the penetrations.
 
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