Modular Electric Brewery

Minor update:

I brewed a 10 gallon batch of American Amber this weekend and the system performed beautifully. Mash in temperature for 15 gallons was reached in about 40 minutes, and the recirculation went very well. I had about a 1F differential between the tanks, and that is without any insulation on the MLT (it will be on there soon, though)

I also tried something new this week and really liked it. I conditioned the malt, which only took about 5-10 extra minutes before the brew day started. I used about 2% of the total grain weight as a guide for how much water to add.

My last batch I did not condition the malt and crushed at 0.037" and was 18% off of my theoretical maximum efficiency (actual 72%, theoretical 89%). This week I conditioned and crushed at 0.031". It left a flour with nearly entirely intact husks. I was 3% off of my theoretical maximum efficiency (actual 83%, theoretical 86%). I was also able to recirc at a decent clip without any sticking of the mash or rice hulls. I am not going to chase after efficiency, but it taught me about my system and a little more about brewing.

The theoretical maximum for a no sparge system is based on 100% conversion and is limited by lauter efficiency, which decreases as the wort moves to higher specific gravities. Assuming that lauter efficiency was at its theoretical maximum (a reasonable assumption for this system), for the last batch I achieved 81%conversion efficiency, and for the conditioned batch this week I was at 97% conversion efficiency. It is amazing to me what a single parameter like crush can do to overall brewhouse performance.

Joshua

Sounds great! I have been watching your progress, as I am in the final designing my rig as we speak
That info on conditioning the malt is very interesting.

New Forum. Excellent.

I'm not too far from you, up in Indy. When I get some cash together I'll be hitting you up for advice. In the meantime, if you have some homebrewing stuff that needs a new home (*wink-wink*), give me a chance to make an offer.

very cool!

Thanks.

It is working really well. I added a bottom drain to the boil kettle, and have been playing with some things to shorten brew day even more. Had a nice, leisurely, brew day this weekend and was cleaned up in 3:40. Worked great.

I have a 15 gal BCS Controlled RIMs .. but I really enjoy brewing small seasonal beers. Using cornies for vessels is a great idea. Why did you cut the tops off? I'd think it would help keep the heat in, and there are already 2 posts you could use. Also, by using a keg parka you could probably get away with only one element. Sorry, I'm an engineer .. I can't help but see things and trying to improve them .. I can't help it, don't take it personal. Great build!

Thanks for the compliments. Where can I find your build?

Using cornies was simply a function of them being the most compact and cheapest stainless vessels around. I cut the tops off because I cannot get my arm into a corny keg to reach the bottom, and I wanted to be able to do that for cleaning.

It is quite possible to brew on a single 2kW element, but not having to wait, and being ale to more convincingly step mash is very nice. I typically insulate both vessels for brewing, there are just no photographs of that.

I am actually in the middle of a controls redesign, and will post some more when I get around to getting that done. The big system is the one that gets a lot more use now, and I want to add capacity for a second large element. It is amazing how not waiting for heating can save time through a whole brew day. I had one recently that was under 4 hours and it made me very happy.

Joshua

Love ska!!!

My build has yet to materialize on the forums .. stay tuned.

I assumed cleaning and arms length was the reason for cutting the tops off. I'm not worried about cleaning .. pbw and saniclean work wonders. No matter how hard I pull my arm it won't get any longer though I am hoping I can figure out a device that would reach to the bottom and hold the elements. That way I could leave the top in tact. I'm wondering if having the top on and pressurizing would help bring up temps faster. I know this would be dangerous, so probably wouldn't be a good idea .. however with the pressure relief valve and monitoring could be made safe.

I am all about saving time .. I've got 3 kids under 5 and a wife .. I barely have time to do anything.

I brew alot of small batches of Mead, Cider and Wine. I'd like to start brewing more small batches of beer.

The guys at Ska were awesome. They sold me two kegs after contacting them through probrewer. They just stuck fedex labels on the outside of the kegs and shipped them to my door. The Fedex guy was amused.

I would not pressurize the vessels. It is not going to get you there any faster than just setting a lit on top.

For speed, I really recommend the recirculating no sparge system, and adequately powering the system. The recirculating no sparge with the electric makes it really easy to brew and makes it easy to have portions of the brew day unattended (water coming up to temp, mashing, portions of the boil if you use anti-foam). Making sure you are adequately powered is vital as well. The less time you spend in transitions, the better; there is nothing at all gained from taking longer to com up to mash in or to a boil. Are you going for 5 gallons or 10?

Joshua,
Couple questions about your process...
- So you don't sparge, total boil volume goes into the BK/HLT right away?
- You recirc just the MLT first to set the grainbed?
- Once set (runnings clear), you swap hoses (QD's?) and recirc through the BK?
- If you are moving around hoses, do you think one could get away with just a single pump initially?

BTW - great job on the compact footprint. Just the ideas I've been looking for.

Thanks.

JonesCreek said:

Joshua,
Couple questions about your process...
- So you don't sparge, total boil volume goes into the BK/HLT right away?
- You recirc just the MLT first to set the grainbed?
- Once set (runnings clear), you swap hoses (QD's?) and recirc through the BK?
- If you are moving around hoses, do you think one could get away with just a single pump initially?

BTW - great job on the compact footprint. Just the ideas I've been looking for.

Thanks.

Click to expand...

The total volume initially goes directly into the BK/HLT. It gets heated to strike temperature, and then I mash in with a portion of that water (usually about 8 of 14-15 gallons). I then leave it at temperature for 20 minutes. At that point I recirculate back on itself until I am free of debris (1-2 minutes). I then take the output hose from the MLT and put it in the BK. The MLT feeds the boil kettle through the pump, and the BK gravity feeds back into the MLT. It is now recirculating and the BK is controlling the overall system temperature using its PID controller. When you want to mash out, just change the temperature on the PID and wait 15-20 minutes. When you want to fill the BK, just close the BK side valve and it will fill up.

You can certainly get away with one pump. The pump on the boil kettle is just extra. It is nice to have for whirlpooling, but is by no means needed.

Thanks. I have really enjoyed the compact system. It was a fun build and there are a lot of ideas that were from, or worked out with, people on this forum.

If you have any other questions, just let me know.

Joshua

Hope you don't mind the additional questions. Your compact design rocks and I am trying to piece together a parts list. With possibly even fewer moving/external parts.

When you whirlpool, which port feeds the pump?

What would you think about having a "side" pick-up tube on the internal end of the BK to MT drain? When trying to whirlpool, attach the output of the pump to that and run reverse flow to get circulation.

Thanks,
Todd.

Ask as many questions as you like.

I have changed the way that I whirlpool and drain the kettle since the photographs were taken. I now have a bottom drain that feeds the pump on the BK. The whirlpooling motion is only used for chilling, not for settling hop material or trub. When it is cooled, I then pump it out through the bottom drain into a nylon paint strainer over my fermenter. This saves me about 30 minutes, and I cant tell a difference in the finished product. I also get a better yield on my finished product.

The side pickup is a fine idea, and it would do you very well if you were whirlpooling. I would not implement it at this point on my system, because I am not.

I would say, though, that the bottom drain is a must for any tank. It makes cleaning so very easy. A hose drops from the bottom drain into a bucket, everything gets washed out, and the bucket gets dumped. Done.

Any chance you could post an updated pic?

I will try and get some updated photographs this weekend.

Reading over your write-up again. You mentioned that one of the kegs is set up with a bottom drain. Are both?
Would you set up both that way if you could do it over? If so, would you flip the keg, cut the actual bottom and use the existing bung as the bottom drain?

Thanks again,
Todd.

I have now set up both of the kegs with a bottom drain. It makes cleaning very nice, and fully emptying the kegs with a gravity feed possible.

And yes, if I were to do it again I would flip the keg and use the sanke fitting as the bottom drain. I did not know about that when I built the system.

Where are you at in your system build?

I've got two kegs. One untouched, one I acquired with the top cut out already; and my 10gal round cooler MT that I was planning to still use for that purpose.

Main elec power is in place. I have a project box/control panel on the way.

Still piecing together/deciding on exactly how I want the keggle set up (ports, probes, elem, etc.) Single pump, 1 1/2 tier based on your design.

In my head, I know what needs to be done during the different steps of the brewing process, just how to best set it up. Whirl-pooling, side pickup vs center bottom; soldered vs welded vs weldless; etc. You can only cut or drill once!

I think I have actually read over too many post and am trying to combine the best of too many systems. This is a good thing (learning from others), but to a point.

I was originally thinking about both ports on the HLT/BK to be side pickups pointing the same direction. That way you could re-circ as you bring up to a boil, and then whirl-pool when complete. Just change the QD's.

Then I read some posts on using the existing bung as a bottom center drain. Wonder how that would work with this setup? Whirl-pool then filter, kinda defeats the purpose, doesn't it?

Have you run into any problems "sucking" wort from under the mash back up to the HLT/BK? Do you think some sort of false bottom a must (more than a stainless braid)?

I appreciate your responses. It is still the main design I'm going after.

Todd.

I have a bottom center drain on both kettles. They are the primary drains hooked up to the pumps, and I think they work great. Having another port is not an issue, though. You just plug it up when not in use.

If you go slowly with the pump under the mash, there is no issue with sticking the mash. I have yet to do it, including some very high percentage wheat batches. I do use rice hulls as insurance.

As for the whirlpool, I have that fancy whirlpool arm that works quite well and I never end up using it. I simply place the hose from the outlet of the pump into the keg against one wall. It spins everything just fine. Then in stead of letting it settle, I rack out as soon as it is cold through a filter bag. Done quickly and easily. I would not whirlpool and then filter; pick the one you like and go with that.

Joshua

Do you think that you get less efficiency mashing and recirculating the full volume of boil water (no mash) as opposed to somehow using a temporary third vessel as a holding tank to sparge?

I'm just not grasping the concept that not sparging is that much less effective. Possibly need to mash a little longer? But if your mash and sparge normally takes 60/30 mins (90 total), why wouldn't a no sparge for 90 or even 120 mins, ramping up the temp to 170 for the last 30 be equivalent?

Todd.

Dude....how in the heck did you get the rubber off the cornies? I tried everything, even an angle grinder, and it just resulted in billows of foul white smoke and a black gritty mess....I finally gave up so I could reassess....my garage smells like a drag race.