Why do some of my beers foam so wildly?

Hi, everyone,

With all of five brews under my belt (hey, you've got to start somewhere) I have noticed that some of my beer bottles foam rather excessively when I open them. So far all my beers are bottle conditioned, and most of them have come out quite well, with the beer being clear and the sedimentation staying at the bottom of the bottle.

However, sometimes I will open a bottle (carefully) and immediately the foam will rise out of the bottle, and the carbon dioxide come out of solution so vigorously that it stirs up all the yeast from the bottom of the bottle. This happens (as far as I can see) randomly, with one bottle being fine, and another bottle (same size, same temperature, same brew, same amount of carbonation, same careful way of opening the bottle) being "wild".

What causes this? I have a suspicion that solids in the beer may have something to do with it, since my first full mash brew (which has a few issues with excessive trub ending up in the fermenter) is more prone to excessive foaming upon opening the bottle than are kit brews and partial mash brews. Still, I opened a bottle of my Belgian strong ale this afternoon, and much to my surprise it foamed so strongly that practically all the yeast was lifted from the bottom. None of the bottles from that batch have done anything like that so far.

I know that over-carbonation is the first common suspect in this case, but trust me, all bottles have the same amount (within small tolerances of course) of carbonation.

What's happening here? Any ideas?

Cheers!

// FvW

How long is the beer in the primary? With you saying the taste is fine, my guess is that fermentation is not yet complete and continues in the bottles. Another idea might be you're adding too much priming sugar without realizing it.

Brent

I would think that random foaming bottles would very likely occur because of an uneven mix of the priming sugar in the fermented beer. Gently stir the mixture so as to keep the oxygen absorption to a minimum, then immediately bottle.

Like unionrdr suggests by asking his questions, I see 3 different reasons that could explain this:

* you do not let the bottle rest in the fridge for enough time. As a consequence, CO2 is not in solution quite yet, and will get out as soon as you open the bottle.
* you did not mix evenly the priming sugar, or did not add the same amount of priming sugar in each bottle.
* you have an infection in some bottles, that keeps fermenting them and adding more CO2 that need be. Even though it is possible, this is unlikely if you followed common sanitation practices.

So, which one do you think it is in your case ?

unionrdr said:

How are you priming them,& how much? Do you give them enough fridge time to get the gas into solution? How's your sanitation?

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Priming: either 5ml of sugar per litre, or according to http://www.brewery.org/library/YPrimerMH.html. In any case, all bottles from a single batch are primed identically. Some foam, most don't.

Fridge time: several days.

Sanitation: as good as I can get it without using boiling caustic soda solutions or similar heroic measures. So far I haven't had any infections yet.

// FvW

birvine said:

How long is the beer in the primary? With you saying the taste is fine, my guess is that fermentation is not yet complete and continues in the bottles. Another idea might be you're adding too much priming sugar without realizing it.

Brent

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Either one week in primary and two in secondary, or at least two weeks in primary. In any case, over-carbonation due to significant fermentation taking place in the bottle should result in most (instead of just some) bottles turning into gushers, shouldn't it?

// FvW

jroot said:

I would think that random foaming bottles would very likely occur because of an uneven mix of the priming sugar in the fermented beer. Gently stir the mixture so as to keep the oxygen absorption to a minimum, then immediately bottle.

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I prime by putting sugar into each bottle. And while there are of course tolerances, I am careful about measuring the amount of priming sugar as accurately and consistently as possible.

// FvW

mperceau said:

Like unionrdr suggests by asking his questions, I see 3 different reasons that could explain this:

* you do not let the bottle rest in the fridge for enough time. As a consequence, CO2 is not in solution quite yet, and will get out as soon as you open the bottle.
* you did not mix evenly the priming sugar, or did not add the same amount of priming sugar in each bottle.
* you have an infection in some bottles, that keeps fermenting them and adding more CO2 that need be. Even though it is possible, this is unlikely if you followed common sanitation practices.

So, which one do you think it is in your case ?

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Darned if I know. Just in case, I'll pay even more attention to sanitation when I bottle my next batch this afternoon and see what happens.

// FvW

Another possible cause that I've heard discussed in similar threads is the amount of sediment in the bottle. The sediment can provide nucleation sites for bubble formation. That could explain why some bottles foam and others don't. I suspect that this only an issue if the carbonation level is high to begin with, and the sediment just pushes things over the edge.

unionrdr said:

Instead of putting sugar in each bottle,get a bottling bucket. Then weigh the right amount of sugar to style with one of the on line priming calculators. Dissolve it in 2C of boiled water,chill to 70F or so,then add to bottling bucket & rack beer onto it. Give it a few gentle stirs so as not stir up foam. Aeration is bad at this point. Then bottle. Carbonation will be a lot more even,& excessive amounts of priming sugar is more easily avoided.

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Since the issue is sporadic, I am leaning toward variation in carbonation by priming bottles individually. By making a priming 'syrup' and carefully stirring it into the beer the conditioning will be more uniform and may solve your problem.

Brent

EDIT I just re-read this and it sounds confusing. I meant that I agree with uniondr - to bulk condition.

frankvw said:

I prime by putting sugar into each bottle. And while there are of course tolerances, I am careful about measuring the amount of priming sugar as accurately and consistently as possible.

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You might think you are being very consistent, but this can result in a lot more variation than you think. If you are just adding dry sugar, it may not dissolve at the same rate in each bottle, and will depend on how well it gets mixed in in each bottle.

What type of sugar. If it's sucrose (table sugar), and you use level teaspoons, you will use 120 grams for 5 gallons, or about 4,5 ozs, which is probably at the upper end. If some of them are slightly rounded, you are using too much sugar.

bartbert said:

Another possible cause that I've heard discussed in similar threads is the amount of sediment in the bottle. The sediment can provide nucleation sites for bubble formation. That could explain why some bottles foam and others don't.

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This too can cause a variation, but I suspect it's the rate of the sugar dissolving and variation in sugar amounts.

unionrdr said:

Instead of putting sugar in each bottle,get a bottling bucket. Then weigh the right amount of sugar to style with one of the on line priming calculators. Dissolve it in 2C of boiled water,chill to 70F or so,then add to bottling bucket & rack beer onto it. Give it a few gentle stirs so as not stir up foam. Aeration is bad at this point. Then bottle. Carbonation will be a lot more even,& excessive amounts of priming sugar is more easily avoided.

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Do it this way. I don't see a need to cool the sugar mixture, since it is such a small amount, and will cool very quickly when added to the beer.

I boil mine, and leave it on the side while I do everything else, and pour it in while racking to bottling bucket. Generally it is too hot to touch, which would put it around 150F. 2 cups = 1 pint. Once it is diluted with 3 pints of beer at 70 F, it will be down to 90 F; yeast will survive that no problem. 5 gallons = 40 pints; I don't think you will kill too many off.

The reason mine doesn't cool too much while I'm cleaning bottles, is because it is kept covered.

I've never had a problem carbing my beers.

unionrdr said:

Instead of putting sugar in each bottle,get a bottling bucket. Then weigh the right amount of sugar to style with one of the on line priming calculators. Dissolve it in 2C of boiled water,chill to 70F or so,then add to bottling bucket & rack beer onto it. Give it a few gentle stirs so as not stir up foam. Aeration is bad at this point. Then bottle. Carbonation will be a lot more even,& excessive amounts of priming sugar is more easily avoided.

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Hmmm.... that might not be a bad idea. I have lots of different sized bottles, and having to prime with 2.67ml of sugar in some of them is not always convenient. You may have a good point here. I'll give it a try!

// FvW

OK. Having read this I decided not to take any risks when I bottled my Belgian Barleywine Bombshell this afternoon. It's been in primary for a week and in secondary for 2 weeks, working itself up to close to 10% ABV, so I sort of want to make this one come out right.

I washed all bottles with a hot caustic soda solution, rinsed, sanitized and rinsed again with boiled water. Priming sugar according to the style (and Mark Hibbert's Primer on Priming) went into a bottling bucket (dissolved into a syrup) followed by the beer. I used a (sterilized) piece of PVC hose to fill up the bucket from the bottom up (so as to avoid aeration) and stirred gently. Buckets and all tools were all cleaned and sanitized thoroughly, and I have been absolutely anal about avoiding any form of contamination.

This one will need cellaring for at least 2 months (four is better) so time will tell if I've gotten it right this time.

Meanwhile, thanks for all the advice and your thoughts on the matter. If nothing else, I have been educated. Cheers!

// FvW

frankvw said:

OK. Belgian Barleywine Bombshell this afternoon.

This one will need cellaring for at least 2 months (four is better) so time will tell if I've gotten it right this time.



// FvW

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Recipe? Belgian yeast into a barleywine sounds exciting! Please share! :rockin: