Does all grain brewing become expesive

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lovebrewin

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Does it start to become expensive when doing all grain brewing and mashes and the like? As opposed to just buying you favorite commercial beer...
Not that I give a **** cos it's a hobby and the beer tastes better anyway. Just wondering that's all.
What is everyone's typical per bottle price
 
I jumped to all grain about 2 years ago And learned very quickly that you can spend a couple hundred or a few thousand on equipment. Once you get past that, then, definitely, you can make beer cheaper than commercial beer. They way I look at it is: it's a hobby where you are going to sink money into it, but you get something back other than just enjoyment.

Brew on!
 
If you buy it a little at a time it's not so bad, it took me a long time to make a brew stand but now that I have it, it's my pride and joy. If you buy one cheep six pack of craft beer it's about ten bucks. If I run 3 ten gallon batches in a day (about 6 cases) or about 24 six packs or $240 worth of beer that I don't have to buy. Great for partys and as gifts. But yes I just spent 400$ on pumps and 450$ on grain, hops, and cleaners in a groop buy, but I'm set for the next year.
 
Write off equipment costs as toys if you're not brewing for a living.

All-grain is certainly cheaper than extract, even more so if you go bulk and skip the kits.

I can probably make an all-grain batch using bulk grain and hops for half the price of your extract kit shipped.

If you have a kit you'd like me to compare prices to, let me know.
 
Definately cheeper. I spend an average of $20 ($27 if I buy yeast) on 5 gals. That yeilds about 23 bottles (22 oz bottles). So, thats less than $1 per 22 oz bottle. Most 22s cost about $3-4. Overall, its about a quarter of the price of buying.

I like to pretend that I didn't spend a bunch of dough on my equipment (I did say pretend, right?). And I like to pretend that my wife doesn't know either :mug:

If you factor in time (approx 8 hours per batch from firing the burners to tapping.the keg) then the cost goes up, of course. But, hey, it's a hobby, so I don't count MY time.

Dang...But this is begging me to calculate some Break-even points and Co
 
Definately cheeper. I spend an average of $20 ($27 if I buy yeast) on 5 gals. That yeilds about 23 bottles (22 oz bottles). So, thats less than $1 per 22 oz bottle. Most 22s cost about $3-4. Overall, its about a quarter of the price of buying.

I like to pretend that I didn't spend a bunch of dough on my equipment (I did say pretend, right?). And I like to pretend that my wife doesn't know either :mug:

If you factor in time (approx 8 hours per batch from firing the burners to tapping.the keg) then the cost goes up, of course. But, hey, it's a hobby, so I don't count MY time.

Dang...But This is begging me to calculate a Break-even point, variable costs, fixed costs, etc., etc... ok, time to dust off the old text books. I will charge my hours for that. :)

~Cheers!
 
Whoa, that was a bit of a rant. The homebrew is kicking in
 
Now that I've started buying my grain in bulk, toast my own grains for specialties, and am farming yeast my costs have dropped considerably. It's down to at least 50% the cost of extract per batch if not more depending on what I'm brewing.
 
Only if you have an addiction for constantly upgrading your brewing setup

That's pretty much the biggest cost is equipment but I make due with pretty cheap stuff and brew beer that I am very proud of. If I had the money to spend I would probably upgrade some stuff like tossing out my immersion chiller for starters but I can definitely live without. Like I said, I am spending less on ingredients and still brewing better beer than I did with extract.

DISCLAIMER: I am NOT wanting to start a flame war over AG vs Extract with my statements. You can make awesome beer with extracts, as did I. I am just saying I enjoy having more control over the ingredients and I feel I enjoy my beer more as a result. That is all! :D
 
I know I'm new to the all grain setup. I have only actually done one beer using all grain and that beer is in the secondary still, for me I don't think its going to be more money per bottle.
I honestly can say I don't even factor in the costs of making the beer. I really enjoy knowing I brewed it.
Don't get me wrong I'm the cheapest guy on the whole site probably, so cost for me is more of the fun factor.
I'll use an example, what I mean is you can go to the movies and spend money on popcorn, candy, soda, and nachos. Or you can save money and buy the dvd and watch it at home. End result is you saw the movie for both correct but which was a better experience?

If you're someone who does like movies my example may not work for you.
 
I know I'm new to the all grain setup. I have only actually done one beer using all grain and that beer is in the secondary still, for me I don't think its going to be more money per bottle.
I honestly can say I don't even factor in the costs of making the beer. I really enjoy knowing I brewed it.
Don't get me wrong I'm the cheapest guy on the whole site probably, so cost for me is more of the fun factor.
I'll use an example, what I mean is you can go to the movies and spend money on popcorn, candy, soda, and nachos. Or you can save money and buy the dvd and watch it at home. End result is you saw the movie for both correct but which was a better experience?

If you're someone who does like movies my example may not work for you.

Considering I have a home theater with a decent 5.1, leather movie theater seating, active 3D glasses that don't give headaches, all the junk food I can eat at a fraction of the cost, the opportunity to pause for a bathroom break, no undesirables to ruin the experience and won't be taken to jail for getting too frisky...

...definitely better at home.
 
If you ignore a whole lot of costs, then you can "save" money brewing beer.

Realistically? eh? When you sit down and look at how much you can spend on gadgets plus all the hidden costs (gas, electricity, water) plus all the extra beer you'll probably drink....... Obviously it is possible to make cheaper beer, but most people end up spending on lots of toys. You also end up giving some away and sharing a lot more. Those aren't bad things, but they do add to the overall costs for most people.

But yeah, you "can" brew AG beer pretty cheap. All the other stuff is optional.
 
That depends on what you are comparing it to. I spend $20-$35 on a batch depending on the style and usually get 45-50 12oz bottles. Cheaper than a 30 pack of Busch Light?? Not always. Cheaper than the equivalent quality of beer? Absolutely.:tank:
 
You need different or more equipment, so you will have to spend $....therefore it is expensive. Like other have said, you could get away initially with $200 or so for more stuff. But it's like being a crack addict, you start buying more & more stuff. First it's a bigger boil pot, then a bigger mash tun, then a pump, then a counter flow chiller, then a chest freezer with a thermostat so you can lager....then u convert the chest freezer into a kegerator which is another can of worms (kegs, taps,CO2, etc). oh, then you have to buy another chest freezer to lager again cuz you made a kegerator out of the last one.....
It's simple to follow how I progressed. Wouldn't change a thing, though. Love it.
 
I went from extract full boil to all grain (BIAB) and it didn't cost me more because I made it work with the equipment I already had. The ingredients cost less so for me it was a cost saver.
 
Sweet as that all sounds great!!! Well yeh I'd love to give it a go one day but I think I will have to do a lot more study on the process of the all grain brew!!! Got any links to all grain brewing methods??
 
Sweet as that all sounds great!!! Well yeh I'd love to give it a go one day but I think I will have to do a lot more study on the process of the all grain brew!!! Got any links to all grain brewing methods??
it's the same as extract except you make a mash.

to make a mash you soak grains at a specific temperature for a specific time. usually an hour @ 153F but different recipes will change this. same with how much water you use for this.

as far as figuring out how much water to use and what temperature you need to settle at 153F there's tons of calculators online.

imo just jump in. that's what i did. never brewed extract before, just read up on all grain a bit and went to it.
 
All-Grain brewing can be cheap or expensive in the same way that fishing can be cheap or expensive.

If you are content to stand on the bank with rod in hand - you'll do well and catch fish.

And then there's this:
Edgewater-388-Center-Console-Fishing-Boat-.jpg
 
If you brew with that All Grain equipment often the cost of equipment per batch diminishes quickly. You shouldn't ever compare the cost of your homebrew to commercial mass produced beer, you are producing craft beer. A 6-pack of good craft beer often runs $8-12 around where I live, if I compare my similar quality homebrew to that, I've recuperated my equipment costs very quickly. The added advantage is that I'm drinking beer that has exactly the bitterness, aroma, flavor and yeast profiles that I selected.
 
If you brew with that All Grain equipment often the cost of equipment per batch diminishes quickly. You shouldn't ever compare the cost of your homebrew to commercial mass produced beer, you are producing craft beer. A 6-pack of good craft beer often runs $8-12 around where I live, if I compare my similar quality homebrew to that, I've recuperated my equipment costs very quickly. The added advantage is that I'm drinking beer that has exactly the bitterness, aroma, flavor and yeast profiles that I selected.

I've bought $8 22oz bombers without blinking.

Thought I haven't been able to produce anything coming close to them yet.
 
Once you buy/make the extra equipment needed, then it becomes cheaper, because the most expensive material the grain, is cheaper than buying extract, extract is more expensive because you're paying a maltser to do what we who all grain brew do ourselves extract the sugar from the grain. Especially if you buy bulk. And with AG you don't need the ferrarri of equipment unless you want it.

You basically need to upgrade to full boils if you haven't already (unless you're doing 1 gallon or 2.5 gallon batches,) which would mean usually a turkey fryer (and many of us start with the 7.5 gallon kettle that comes with the fryer, though you could spen more for a larger kettle) you then need to upgrade how you cool a full boil if you don't already have some form of a chiller. Because it's much harder to rapidly cool 5 gallons that it is to cool 2.5 gallons. And you need some way to convert the grain to your own extract, which can be as simple as Brew in a bag, with a muslin bag, it can be done zapap which is two buckets nested within each other with holes in one of them, it can be done in some way that involves heating the grain in a pot or kettle (Either in the stove or over or in some form of direct fire type method) or a converted beverage cooler.

How much money you want to put into it is really up to you.....You can do all grain on the cheap or you can spend 5 grand on a system, or somewhere in between.

If you already have most everything from already brewing extract except for example a Turkey Fryer, Wort Chiller & Beverage cooler Mash tun, you will only need to spend 25-30 for a turkey fryer, if you check the sales flyers or craigslist, and wort chiller if you don't have a cheap source for copper tubing will be 50-60, and And a 5 or 10 gallon cooler with either store bought modification or done with the countless plans on here, 50-60 as well. So for about 150.00 on top of all your regular brewing gear you can brew allgrain.

I helped a guy put together an ag system who never brewed before (so he needed everything from tubing to fermenters, a hydromter, etch) for EXACTLY 500.00 buying everything stock from the homebrewshop and hd for the turkey fryer. That was without making anything or shopping around or buying used, he had a 500 gift card from his FIL for Christmas, and in a day we got him up and running.

I buy bulk grain through a buy we do on here, 35 bucks for a 55 pound sack of two row. If I use 10 pounds of base malt per batch of beer that's 10 batches of beer for 35 in just base malt. I remember paying anywhere from 35-50 bucks for one extract recipe's worth of extract alone. So you can see that is a substantial savings. I still obviously need to pay for hops, and yeast, and unless I make my own specialty grains from the base malt, I still need those extra grains. But you can also buy hops and specialty grain in bulk to which further reduces your cost. And you can recycle/harvest your yeast as well.

So you can easily go from 50-60 dollars for an extract with grains kit for under 30 bucks for brewing an ag recipe....even cheaper. I think the cheapest AG batches I've brewed have cost me less than 10 bucks.
 
Write off equipment costs as toys if you're not brewing for a living.

All-grain is certainly cheaper than extract, even more so if you go bulk and skip the kits.

I can probably make an all-grain batch using bulk grain and hops for half the price of your extract kit shipped.

If you have a kit you'd like me to compare prices to, let me know.

To brew cheaper:

Make friends with your Local Micro and ask them if they will add a couple bags to their next order for you. They don't do it for non-regulars because they also know the guys at your LHBS and don't want to screw them

OR at your Local Brew Club put together a group purchase.
 
You can go as big as you like or not. My first batch of beer with the grain cost me 70 bucks to brew. I had pots and a old cooler that I used so my costs were not much at first.

Since then I have bought a 10 gallon round cooler so I can do 10 gallon batches and was given a keg to use for a brew pot. I guess the total cost of everything I have bought is well under 300 bucks in equipment so far. Is my beer bad for it....Well no it is pretty fine beer and my cooler is the first one kicked every Friday at beer and cigar night.

I love some Bush lite beer and brew a similar ale to Bush lite. That beer runs me under 10 bucks in grain and yeast. I also brew a Porter that I love that runs considerable more. All told though over time I have saved way more brewing my own beer rather than buying it.
 
One thing no one here has mentioned, unless I skimmed over it, is you can start with BIAB (brew in a bag). It is what I'm doing now, and it is a very cheap and easy way to step into all-grain. You don't NEED to spend thousands of dollars on equipment, like many people do. I'm sure these guys make great beer and such, but I can't afford that. This is a very forgiving hobby, and you can spend as much or as little as you want. Precision matters if you want to make consistent great beer. If you just want to make good beer, and don't care if one batch tastes a little different than the last, it's okay, you don't have to be as precise. I have definitely made back my investments (maybe even twice or more over) in equipment compared to buying craft beer, and I'm only 18 batches in. My AG batches are typically $20-$30.

When I make my weekly trip to the LHBS, I typically spend more for ~10 beers than I do for all the ingredients for my 5 gallon batch. It doesn't help that I live in Beer City, USA and my LHBS is one of the best craft beer stores in the area, and always has awesome new/limited run beer coming in.
 
One thing no one here has mentioned, unless I skimmed over it, is you can start with BIAB (brew in a bag). .

You skimmed over it. ;)

Revvy said:
And you need some way to convert the grain to your own extract, which can be as simple as Brew in a bag, with a muslin bag, it can be done zapap which is two buckets nested within each other with holes in one of them, it can be done in some way that involves heating the grain in a pot or kettle (Either in the stove or over or in some form of direct fire type method) or a converted beverage cooler.
 
I think you can absolutely make AG brewing "cost effective" but I also think the folks who have kinda made this point are even more accurate... and that is, if you're brewing to save money, you're in it for the wrong reasons.

I don't care how many bulk grain buys someone gets in on or how ghetto their set up is... it's not a "cheap" hobby and you are always going to be buying random stuff whether it is a $6 hydrometer to replace the one you just broke, or some star-san, or a new carboy, etc. etc... and the amount you're going to "save" on each case is going to take forever to make up for the costs... not to mention the big chunks of time you're going to spend doing it. Take ANY kind of "dollars per hour" estimate on what your time is worth to you and you blow any savings on AG brewing out the window.

Just my opinion but people should brew because they simply enjoy doing it, learning how to make "better beer", enjoy the fruits of their own labors, etc.... because again, I just don't see the "I'm going to save so much money!" argument as a realistic one.

Again... can you make it "cost effective"... absolutely and our esteemed colleague Revvy just talked about that but... I dunno... I think saving money is the wrong reason for doing it.
 
I think a lot of the expense has to do with what type of brewer you are.

If all you're in it for is to brew occasionally and have beer you can say you brewed yourself, you can get away with a simple, inexpensive stove-top setup.

If you like to brew often and get into seriously improving the beer you are making, you probably need to invest a little more to streamline your process and provide a little more control.

If you have buddies over a lot and fly through the beer you make you may have to invest a little more to increase your capacity.

If you are into hobbies for the gadgets and equipment (home-brewing seems to attract an above average percentage of engineer and DYI types) you may invest more to facilitate that part of the hobby.

As folks have correctly pointed out, you don't have to spend a ton of money to brew great beer and you won't necessarily brew great beer just because you spend a ton of money.

Like sweatpants, home-brewing flexes to accomodate our personal dimensions.
 
I picked up the stuff for my next brew--a parti-gyle of two Scottish Ales that included 28 lbs of base malt. I picked everything up at my LHBS for about $44. When you consider it is about four cases of beer that would commercially cost me $80 plus dollars then it sounds like I'm saving a lot. However, when you could the man hours formulating a recipe, studying books, articles and podcasts to make sure everything is being done right and the multiple tries taken to dial in a recipe, along with extra equipment bought throughout brewing then it is not really something I do to save money. I get pleasure out of spending those man hours in my hobby. I enjoy looking for, building, or buying the next best toy for brewing. I get pleasure from tasting my own beer that I made or having my friends compliment it that any cost is worth it.

One does not start wood working because they want good furniture cheap. One does not raise their own meat because it will be cheaper. One does these things because they want quality and because they believe they can do it well and enjoy doing it.

The promise of cheap beer may bring someone into the hobby, but it will not keep them in it for long.
 
That is not ghetto, TYVM.

You have a nice burner stand, a custom handmade hardwood mash paddle, a perfectly good milk crate and the same Craftsman clamping table thing I have. You mash turn even has a nice ball-valve.

This is ghetto.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/ghetto-brew-kit-369699/

Actually the burner stand is a 20 dollar turkey fryer closeout, the mash paddle is I think pine, made by a friend. That is not a craftsman it's a 15.00 POS from harbor frieght. the milk crate I stole from a homeless beggar on the side of the road( JK) And the mash tun was made from the cheap and easy thread. I still maintain it's ghetto.
 
I buy bulk grain through a buy we do on here, 35 bucks for a 55 pound sack of two row. If I use 10 pounds of base malt per batch of beer that's 10 batches of beer for 35 in just base malt.

Actually, that would be 5 and a half batches for $35.:mug:
 
For my last 5 gallon batch, It'll cost me 61 Cents per 12oz beer poured. Not bad at all.
 
How can you take in to account any kind of workhours into a HOBBY? When you look at your cable bill, do you include the 136 hours you spent watching TV last month? If so, watching TV has to be probably the most expensive hobby ever. :)
 
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