Advice on a Stone Russian Imperial Stout PM?

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muenchk

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I'm about to embark on my first ever Russian Imperial Stout. Heck, it's only my 3rd brew. The first was an extract +grain Belgian white and the second an extract +grain Trappist Ale. Both turned out fine. And I love Stone RIS...so what the heck. I got the recipe from BYO magazine and wanted to know if anyone has any hints.

I've got 3 main questions.

1- Do I really have to boil the DME in 6 gallons of water? Can't I just boil in my regular 3 gallons and then add cold water in the 6.5 gal carboy?
2- If I make a 3qt starter, can I just pitch the whole thing? Or should I strain of the wort and just pitch the yeast
3- Can I aerate the starter? ie, shake the crap out of the 3 quart starter right before pitching? Or will it damage the yeast somehow?
4- I got Crystal 40 instead of Amber Malt, then realized Amber Malt is just 2-row baked. Should I use the Crystal or will it change the taste dramatically.
5- Any advice!! It's one heck of a OG!

Here is the recipe
Russian Imperial Stout
PM
OG- 1.096, FG- 1.020
IBU= 90+, SRM 74, ABV 10%

9 lbs of Light DME
2 lbs of amber malt
1.25 roasted barley
8 oz black malt
30 AAU Warrior Hops (60 mins)
WLP002 (English Ale Yeast) – 3qt starter
7/8 cup corn sugar- Priming

PM grains at 150 in 6qts water for 45 minutes
Add water to make 6 gals
Add DME, bring to boil
Aerate, pitch yeast.
Ferment at 68deg
 
I have the AG version of this in a closet right now waiting for winter. I don't know much about Partial mash brewing but for the starter, I would actually wait until you do your brew and take 3L of the actual wort and let your yeast eat that for 1-2 days and then you can pitch the whole thing when your ready.

In the mean time you can stabilize the temp of your fermentor and get it ready. I would actually suggest making a bigger starter because with a large percentage of your fermentables coming from extract you will need all the help you can get to get down to 1.020, especially if you plan to use WLP002.

I mashed at 149-150 and used about a 4-4.5L starter and went from 1.095 to 1.020 with WLP002.
 
You might want to make a pale ale and pitch this on the yeast cake; thats what I did for my RIS.

As for the PM and boil volume go as big as you can and keep in mind 9 lbs of DME is going to take up a LOT of room in the boil kettle.
 
Thanks for the help, all.

human_brewing...is your RIS bottled in the closet? Or are you're going to make it in the winter? I had never thought of doing a starter with the actual wort. It kinda makes sense, I guess. The rest of the wort just sits in the primary until the starter is ready, then?

RC and deepsouth...thanks. I had completely ignored the fact that 9lbs of dme is going to take up so much space,

I also read somewhere that White Labs recommends late additions a few days after the fermentation has kicked in. It somehow helps attenuation?? I can't find the reco on their site.

This late adding might be the thing that works for me. Any idea how best to do it? Should I just brew half the wort, chuck it in, then a few days later do the same?

thanks again!
 
i'd kill the flame with about 20 minutes left in the boil and then add it, stir it up and crank the heat back on for 20 minutes.

if it were a lighter colored beer, i'd add it at the very end.
 
Or go for a 2 pot boil or a split boil. boil as much as you can with 1/2 the DME and hops add that to the primary then second boil the rest of the DME for 15 mins and add it.
 
Don't do a limited boil. Their RIS has close to 100 IBUs. Even if you do half the boil, and add the rest of the extract at the end to keep your utilization high, you'll dilute to 50 IBUs (since 100 is about the soluble limit), and then your beer will finish sweeter than the real thing. I think the 6G boil is pretty key.
 
Maybe I'm just being a cheapa$$ and should just fork over the money for the bigger pot. It's about $70 for a 7.5 gallon pot. I'm hoping this is big enough??

I don't want to reduce the IBU's...although to be honest I don't understand why it would do so. I'll just trust you on it.

What about the Multiple Step Fermentation that White Labs supposedly recommends? Adding more wort as the days go on?

Thanks again for all the help.
 
I noticed you've been doing extract brews. How are you boiling your wort? If you're boiling on the stove in your kitchen, odds are that you aren't going to be able to get 6 gallons to a rolling boil. Best bet in that case is to do a split boil in two pots on different burners.
 
ChshreCat, yup, I've been doing extract +grain on the stove in a 5 gallon pot.

I had no idea I needed more power to get a 6gallon to boil. Splitting sounds good...but will I run into the issue mentioned before (diluting my IBU's to 50?) or if I do two exact boils, splitting the ingredients in half, with 3 gallons in each, will I be fine?

I just heard on another post that an RIS should really sit in the bottle for a few months...so I'm thinking of doing this pretty soon. Maybe Friday if I can convince my wife to go out with the girls or something...AND if I can do the splitting thing you recommend without diluting the IBU's.
 
If you split everything 50/50 between two pots, including putting half of each hop addition in each pot, it should come out pretty much the same as it would with a full boil.

What they're referring to in diluting the hops is that there is a maximum amount of hop bitterness that can be dissolved in your wort (according to the popular theory) of about 100 IBU's. If you are doing a partial boil of a beer that is going to end up high in IBU's, then you could fall short because of this.

Say you are boiling half volume and topping up with an equal amount of water afterwards. You can throw all the hops in the world in that boil and you'll only end up with 100 IBU's in your fermenter. Then when you top up with an equal amount of water, it will be at 50 IBU's. If you were making a 75 IBU beer, you can see the problem.

Not everyone buys in to the 100 IBU limit, mind you, but it's a good idea to keep it in mind.
 
If you split everything 50/50 between two pots, including putting half of each hop addition in each pot, it should come out pretty much the same as it would with a full boil.

What they're referring to in diluting the hops is that there is a maximum amount of hop bitterness that can be dissolved in your wort (according to the popular theory) of about 100 IBU's. If you are doing a partial boil of a beer that is going to end up high in IBU's, then you could fall short because of this.

Say you are boiling half volume and topping up with an equal amount of water afterwards. You can throw all the hops in the world in that boil and you'll only end up with 100 IBU's in your fermenter. Then when you top up with an equal amount of water, it will be at 50 IBU's. If you were making a 75 IBU beer, you can see the problem.

Not everyone buys in to the 100 IBU limit, mind you, but it's a good idea to keep it in mind.


Correct. If it's really a stone RIS clone, I think you limit your accuracy by smaller boil followed by dilution. Splitting into 2 boils totaling 7-8 gallons, though, is fine.
 
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