Guess my Water

I decided to start paying attention to my water so I bought some pH strips (generic colorphast ones) and tested the pH of my last mash...4.6 This was for a pale ale, (5kg (11lbs) german pale male, 500g (1.1lbs) munich and 1kg (2.2lbs) caramel).
While I wait for my test results (water test results that is) anybody want to throw some wild guesses at my water profile?

4.6 is about right, isn't it? Water is usually 7-7.2, but grain is acidic, mash ought to be lower than 4.8?

I ddi have trouble witha primer though. I had made some Invert/Candy sugar with citric acid. It didn't kick off the yeast. So I bought some test strips. I had to dilute the starter 4:1 to get a reading of 4, so it must have been like PH 2? I guess I acid washed that vial of Cal V? Anybody have a program for the PH math?

I've often wondered how you can test the pH of a mash with pH strips. I would have thought that the color of the mash would severely interfere with the readings from the pH strips.

-a.

I don't know much about water profiles, but I'm going to guess that you're uber-soft.

the_bird said:

I don't know much about water profiles, but I'm going to guess that you're uber-soft.

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*insert flacid member joke here*

That's what I'm thinking. Too bad I like brewing dark ales and the like. I'm playing around with bicarbonate to adjust. But I'm finding the papers iffy in their readings.

We'll see if the efficiency changes on this batch.

I tried to do a google search for a water quality profile for ya but no luck . . . .
What I did find out is the water in your area is the worlds best for making sake though

宮水, Miya-mizu, Temple Water.
Great sake museum here too. No micros though... yet.

I never trust those paper ph test strips. When I tried them I did 3 tests in a row and every one said the ph was different. I don't know what to believe. I just figure if the water doesn't taste like acid or on the other hand slime like texture, then it has to be good enough.

casebrew said:

4.6 is about right, isn't it? Water is usually 7-7.2, but grain is acidic, mash ought to be lower than 4.8?

I ddi have trouble witha primer though. I had made some Invert/Candy sugar with citric acid. It didn't kick off the yeast. So I bought some test strips. I had to dilute the starter 4:1 to get a reading of 4, so it must have been like PH 2? I guess I acid washed that vial of Cal V? Anybody have a program for the PH math?

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Nope - and thinking water is "usually" 7-7.2 is kinda risky if you are trying to make a pale ale. San Antonio water has a ph of 7.9, my well water is 9.6. Totally sucks for making a pale ale, SA's water is GREAT for making dark beers though.

Where did you get the idea ph needed to be lower than 4.8? The lower the ph goes the more like acid your water becomes, the higher it goes the alkiline your water becomes. If your waters ph was 2 (or 4) when you put yeast in it, you put your yeast in acid, no wonder it didn't start, you killed it. Mash ph is a pretty small scale depending on style of beer (pale ale or dark like a stout).

Try here for ph spreedsheets and some reading, but you must know your waters profile to really use it. Get it from your water company. Tell them you want/need the following information, it's about all you really need to worry about;

Calcium(Ca): 4.0 ppm
Magnesium(Mg): 1.0 ppm
Sodium(Na): 10.0 ppm
Sulfate(SO4): 8.0 ppm
Bicarbonate(HCO3): 10.0 ppm
PH: 7.9 PH

Good luck with your brewing in acid with modified malts.

pH strips don't tell you anything able water composition, other than pH. Hard water can make it difficult to change the pH.

When I brewed in Oakland, my brewbuddy's GF read the pH for us. I can't read the strips myself and so now I use pH 5.2 for mashing and sparge water.

david_42 said:

pH strips don't tell you anything able water composition, other than pH. Hard water can make it difficult to change the pH.

When I brewed in Oakland, my brewbuddy's GF read the pH for us. I can't read the strips myself and so now I use pH 5.2 for mashing and sparge water.

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Color blind?

How do you like the 5.2?

No, but the narrow range strips turn shades of brown.

pH 5.2 is the final solution. It increased my efficiency a couple points and zero tannins.

Your water PH will be different than your mash PH and is less important. The PH of the mash is what you need to worry about and you cannot test that until you mash.
How To Brew gives some information on estimating what your mash will be given the type of grain used etc but it just an estimation.
Your water composition is important and you would do well to find out exactly what it is. Trying to make adjustments to the water chemistry without knowing what needs to be adjusted and by how much may not do much good and may make it worse.
PH5.2 will help with the PH of the mash but it will not correct mineral excesses or deficiencies in the water. You need to adjust those beforehand.
Promash does have a calculator you can use to determine what amount of what chemical you need to add to get your water to match that of the style of beer you want to make. Again this will require you know exactly what you water chemistry is.
Bottom line, you need to contact your water supplier and get a report on the mineral content or have a sample analyzed. This is true for bottled water as well. If you are using distilled or RO you will need to add chemicals as well. Promash will take care of that too.
Ward Labs will do the testing and they are very helpfull if you have questions.
Darrell

casebrew said:

4.6 is about right, isn't it? Water is usually 7-7.2, but grain is acidic, mash ought to be lower than 4.8?

I ddi have trouble witha primer though. I had made some Invert/Candy sugar with citric acid. It didn't kick off the yeast. So I bought some test strips. I had to dilute the starter 4:1 to get a reading of 4, so it must have been like PH 2? I guess I acid washed that vial of Cal V? Anybody have a program for the PH math?

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A "proper" mash should have a mash PH of between 5 and 5.5 at mash temps. Your boiled wort will get a lower PH.
The PH test strips weren't very accurate (at least the two types I did try) so I bought a PH meter.
5.2 PH stabalizer will work for certain mashes and not as well for others due to the actual minerals in the mash that may buffer the PH.
The colour of your wort don't affect the colour change in your test strips.
Before correcting the mash with salts, it would be wise to find out what your water contains as so not to add too much of a salt which could adversely affect the taste of your beer.

boo boo said:

it would be wise to find out what your water contains as so not to add too much of a salt which could adversely affect the taste of your beer.

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Like adding salt if the sodium level in your water is already high, and wondering why your beer taste like you made it with sea water