Wiring for 120v system

I've been using a Counter Top Brutus (a la jkarp) for brewing over the last couple of years with GREAT success. I'm now prepared to move my brewing into a dedicated space, so I wanted to do it up a little "fancier" than the standard outlets and light switches I've been using.

I've consulted many of the diagrams provided by P-J (and spoken with P-J himself [Thanks, P-J!]) and I've come up with a wiring plan. I think I've got it all sorted, but I'd like a few more experienced eyes to look things over for me. All switches are from Auber with the exception of the main power key lock.

One thing I'm not real clear on is the element indicator light. I don't really want to put in a 22mm indicator (from automationdirect.com), but I haven't found a good replacement as of yet. (I know it's redundant, but I've burnt elements in the past and I want to know for sure when the element has power.)

At this time I don't have any plans on upgrading to a larger system, but I am planning the wiring and some of the more expensive components for that possibility. I already own the PID and the SSR.

I appreciate it a great deal.

I'm planning a similar 120v system, and your diagram looks pretty much the same as what I was going to do. One thing I notice (after I re-read your post and realized you meant to oversize things) was you have a 1A fuse on the PID power line where I'm planning on a 0.25A fuse for that spot. I don't have the timer or alarm, though; I'm putting the PID, a power indicator lamp, and a 120v fan on that line. Max draw on those three things together is something like 0.18A.

I also have a plain 30A toggle switch instead of the contactor. You can't upgrade much on the 120V contactor you have in there, so you may want to pay for the bigger (240V) contactor or go with the cheaper toggle switch.

Search amazon for 120 volt led indicator lights. Less than $3. They are small and don't use hardly any power.

yjfun said:

Search amazon for 120 volt led indicator lights. Less than $3. They are small and don't use hardly any power.

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or you can get them from radio shack.

abarnett said:

I'm planning a similar 120v system, and your diagram looks pretty much the same as what I was going to do. One thing I notice (after I re-read your post and realized you meant to oversize things) was you have a 1A fuse on the PID power line where I'm planning on a 0.25A fuse for that spot. I don't have the timer or alarm, though; I'm putting the PID, a power indicator lamp, and a 120v fan on that line. Max draw on those three things together is something like 0.18A.

I also have a plain 30A toggle switch instead of the contactor. You can't upgrade much on the 120V contactor you have in there, so you may want to pay for the bigger (240V) contactor or go with the cheaper toggle switch.

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The voltage of the coil on the contactor does not need to be any greater than 120v. It's isolated from the load current; it's only activating the magnet that closes the contacts. My home central air conditioning unit has a 24v coil contactor that switches a lot more current than 24v.

That's my understanding, but I'm not an electrician by any means.

I don't want to switch to a simple toggle. I like the redundancy built into the illuminated switches and the element indicator. I also like the look, which is of value to me.

I'll re-examine the fuse size. I hadn't really given that much thought as I simply copied that fuse value from another build.

Thanks for taking a look. I appreciate the input.

yjfun said:

Search amazon for 120 volt led indicator lights. Less than $3. They are small and don't use hardly any power.

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Thanks. I don't know why I never think of Amazon for stuff like this. They have everything...

A4J said:

or you can get them from radio shack.

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Thanks. I never think of them anymore since they're basically a cell phone store here. I'll give them a look next time at the dreaded mall.

AScott said:

Thanks. I don't know why I never think of Amazon for stuff like this. They have everything...



Thanks. I never think of them anymore since they're basically a cell phone store here. I'll give them a look next time at the dreaded mall.

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I've used these:
120-Volt Neon Green Lamp (2-Pack) - RadioShack.com

and these:
120-Volt Neon Red Jumbo Lamp Assembly - RadioShack.com

Both work great on 120V...the red ones are a nice size with the 22mm switches we all love, I think:


(Red lights are in between the green and red pushbuttons on the right).

shortyjacobs said:

I've used these:
120-Volt Neon Green Lamp (2-Pack) - RadioShack.com

and these:
120-Volt Neon Red Jumbo Lamp Assembly - RadioShack.com

Both work great on 120V...the red ones are a nice size with the 22mm switches we all love, I think:

(Red lights are in between the green and red pushbuttons on the right).

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Nice panel!

I just saw those in my cursory search of the site. I'm a bit concerned about the negative reviews on all of the lights at the Shack. It's a very limited number of reviews, though. Probably inexpensive enough to at least give them a try.

Hrm, odd. Who writes reviews for lights? . I honestly never looked. I can say that both the green and red ones I linked to were plenty bright. I mean, they aren't flashlights, but it was very clear they were on, more than bright enough for me.

Another crappy cell pic, if that helps:

shortyjacobs said:

Hrm, odd. Who writes reviews for lights? . I honestly never looked. I can say that both the green and red ones I linked to were plenty bright. I mean, they aren't flashlights, but it was very clear they were on, more than bright enough for me.

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Mine are bright too. I have the green ones and the amber ones. The review on radio shack says they dim after 6 months. I've only had mine for a month.

btw, i have mine wired at the element (instead of before the outlet like in the OP) so that i know the heating element is actually getting power (for some reason mine keep getting unplugged).

A4J said:

Mine are bright too. I have the green ones and the amber ones. The review on radio shack says they dim after 6 months. I've only had mine for a month.

btw, i have mine wired at the element (instead of before the outlet like in the OP) so that i know the heating element is actually getting power (for some reason mine keep getting unplugged).

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Can you clarify how you have them wired? Do you have the element in a box like the Electric Brewery method?

I already have my element potted in epoxy, so there's really no elegant way I could put the light any closer to the element without replacing the element. It sounds like a good idea, though.

Don't forget to go through basic brewing if you use amazon!! I try to remember...

AScott said:

Can you clarify how you have them wired? Do you have the element in a box like the Electric Brewery method?

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Not exactly, but it's the same idea. I used a pvc end cap instead. I'll take a pic when I get home.

Here's a crappy cell phone pic. I still need to seal it but you get the idea.

A4J said:

View attachment 42464

Here's a crappy cell phone pic. I still need to seal it but you get the idea.

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Thanks for the pic. That's a good idea.

AScott said:

The voltage of the coil on the contactor does not need to be any greater than 120v. It's isolated from the load current; it's only activating the magnet that closes the contacts. My home central air conditioning unit has a 24v coil contactor that switches a lot more current than 24v.

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Yeah, sorry... I meant to put the amp rating in there (...loooong day at work...). Assuming you're going to upgrade, it will probably be to something larger than 30A. If so, you might want to save the money now and go with a simple switch -- or get a 40A (or larger) contactor now so you won't have to buy two of them.

But I understand the appeal of blinky-lights. I wish I had the budget to do a full Kal-style build, but alas...

Good luck with your build, and let us know how it turns out!

abarnett said:

Yeah, sorry... I meant to put the amp rating in there (...loooong day at work...). Assuming you're going to upgrade, it will probably be to something larger than 30A. If so, you might want to save the money now and go with a simple switch -- or get a 40A (or larger) contactor now so you won't have to buy two of them.

But I understand the appeal of blinky-lights. I wish I had the budget to do a full Kal-style build, but alas...

Good luck with your build, and let us know how it turns out!

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I will likely change to a 40A contactor once I get going. I'm fairly certain I can get by with a 30A even if I upgrade in the future. For now, I'm brewing 3.5 gallon batches. I do not have the space or the consumption capabilities to brew more than 5 gallon batches. A little overkill never hurt anything, though.

Thanks for taking the time to respond. I appreciate it.

I am an electrician and your understanding of how the coil works on a contactor is correct. The coil voltage has nothing to do with the amp capacity of the contactor itself. I would caution however about going with too large of a contactor because they can wear out quicker. All the parts are larger and heavier including the return springs that break the connection when the coil becomes de-energized. This just translates into more wear and tear on the unit (even in a low load situation) when it's not necessary.

yjfun said:

I am an electrician and your understanding of how the coil works on a contactor is correct. The coil voltage has nothing to do with the amp capacity of the contactor itself. I would caution however about going with too large of a contactor because they can wear out quicker. All the parts are larger and heavier including the return springs that break the connection when the coil becomes de-energized. This just translates into more wear and tear on the unit (even in a low load situation) when it's not necessary.

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That's good to know and I never would have thought about it in those terms. Thanks for your input.

AScott,

I have to apologize to you for my lack of a response to your build. I'm so sorry for that. Please give me a little more time before you finalize your plan.

I have had a real problem with my computer system in that it would not boot up in normal mode - only in safe mode. With that, I've been having severe problems going on with my mission of providing reasonable support to you and other members here.

Please give me some time to get my situation figured out and resolved. I'm MORE than willing to help and support you in your adventure.

Ok? Please?

P-J

P-J said:

AScott,

I have to apologize to you for my lack of a response to your build. I'm so sorry for that. Please give me a little more time before you finalize your plan.

I have had a real problem with my computer system in that it would not boot up in normal mode - only in safe mode. With that, I've been having severe problems going on with my mission of providing reasonable support to you and other members here.

Please give me some time to get my situation figured out and resolved. I'm MORE than willing to help and support you in your adventure.

Ok? Please?

P-J

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Not a problem, P-J. I appreciate the help you've already given me a great deal. Without your guidance, I would not have gotten as far as I am at this point.

You've got my e-mail address.

Nice to see you on this thread P-J you're schematics help out everyone alot. Thank you.

I went poking around in my main electrical panel yesterday to find a nice surprise. I found that one of the breakers was not hooked up to anything!? So I ordered a 20A GFI breaker to put into the panel and I'll be able to forgo the spa panel for now.

I was VERY tempted to go up to a 220v system (it was a 220v breaker), but decided the added cost of the parts, condensation control, and buying new, larger vessels just wasn't worth it right now. I'm pretty happy doing 3.5-4 gallon batches.

I'll save that big upgrade until I'm able to figure out a way to get water to the garage in the winter (not a trivial task up here in northern MN).

I'm putting my parts lists together. I can't wait to get started on the actual build.