High Gravity Fermentation

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bootney

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My current beer is northern brewer double ipa with 1.5# of orange blossom added, and two packages of wyeast 1056 american ale. It's been 12 days since brewing day and fermentation appears to be according to plan. The starting gravity was 1.120, and now here are my concerns:

The original recipe was suppose to be 1.086 and now should I have concerns about the yeast stalling due to the alcohol being to high?

I plan to rack this to a 5 gallon carboy for clearing after it's been in the primary fermenter for three weeks. I also plan to dry hop one week before bottling. How long should this clear in my 2nd carboy and at what temperature?

Last question is about priming solution. I usually use two thirds cup of sugar but have read with higher gravity batches I should decrease priming sugar to either one quarter or one half cup sugar to avoid increased sweetness. I do intend to add another package of yeast at bottling to insure carbonation.

Any tips would be appreciated. Thanks.
 
1.120 OG IPA? Wow, that's pretty high. You mentioned 2 packages of the yeast, so I am assuming you didn't use a starter. In that case, the yeast was not enough and you may have issues with attenuation. If they stall out early (it's hard to say what your FG will be without a recipe) you can add a package of some champagne yeast which has a high alcohol tolerance. IIRC the 1056 has a decent alcohol tolerance but not 1.120.

As far as the bottling sugar, if you are confident that it is 100% done fermenting, add the normal amount. I think people would add less because they are worried it isn't done fermenting and they will get bottle bombs.
 
Thanks for the reply. This was an extract recipe that called for 12# of pilsen and I added the 1.5# honey as an experiment. The original gravity was suppose to be 1.086, and now it's sitting at 1.120. It appears that I underestimated the effect the honey had on the gravity. The yeast was an Activator slap pack and the fermentation does not appear to be outside of the norm.

The main reason why I thought this would be alright is that northern brewers barley wine recipe had a slightly higher gravity but used the same yeast and suggested using another pack at bottling.

The reason why I used two packs was based of a suggestion from a friend. So any ideas on what to expect here?
 
Carnie,

Yes this is a five gallon batch. I just put the recipie through a gravity calculator and it said on the high end it should be 1.101 for starting gravity and final should be around 1.027. Maybe I made a mistake in my reading of the hydrometer, but I remember looking at the reading saying to myself well that's quite a bit higher than I anticipated and logged the measurement on my computer.

Thank you for the replies. What's done is done, and after doing some reading on yeast with high gravity I started worrying about the possibility of this batch having an incomplete ferment. So I would assume I hope for the final gravity to be in that 1.027 range and chalk it up as an error in my initial measurement.

Now lets assume the worst and the final gravity is no where near that number what are my options? The first reply suggested using a different kind of yeast.
 
Well, if the yeast stalls I would say it is most likely due to the alcohol content. Because of that, warming it up or swirling the carboy wouldn't do anything. You will probably need to pitch a more alcohol tolerant yeast to finish it. But first let it finish up. If the gravity comes near what you expect, then you should be fine.
 
wow, that is going to be like rocket fuel if you try and drink it with a normal IIPA timeline. I would let it be, maybe warm it up a bit and leave it. Check the gravity and get back but I wouldn't do anything until you know it has stopped and may be a while with that kind of gravity.
 
Sounds like a plan to me. I'll check the gravity next Thursday and hope for it to be in that range. I'll post what I come up with in this thread. Thanks for the insight.
 
I did some more reading on wyeastlab.com regarding high gravity batches. It mentions that one needs one million cells per millileter per degree plato. It goes on to state that for a 5 gallon wort that a single package of activator gives about 6 million cells per millileter. So technically I should have used 4 to 5 packages of activator for this batch?

I know I'm getting somewhat ahead of myself here, but it appears the only high gravity yeast that wyeast makes is the 3787 Trappist High Gravity which is tolerant up to 14%. So if I have an incomplete ferment could this be a viable option to finish it off? The issue I see with adding more yeast to this batch is not having enough oxygen for it to finish the job.
 
Just a little update here in that I have increased the temp to 66° and the airlock bubbles about once every 40 seconds and I'm 12 days post brewing. To me it seems everything is going well without checking the gravity.

I'd like to ask a few questions about using a yeast starter as well as incorporate the understanding above taken from wyeast's web site suggesting that one package of activator would be a suitable amount for six degrees plato. This beer I'm brewing assuming my initial gravity was correct would have a plato of 28.

So per the web site I should have used 5 packages of activator. Now if I were to use a starter would I do that with just one package of activator or more. I guess I was under the assumption that if the activator was given time to swell that would be my starter.

Thanks in advance.
 
Was the extract used dry or liquid? It sounds like the original recipe called for liquid, but by your numbers it sounds like you used dry.

If your wort was sufficiently aerated, then you might be OK on reaching close to your target FG, but with that much extract I wouldn't be surprised if it was a bit higher.
 
I used liquid extract. It appears where I may have put myself at risk is by over looking the use of a yeast starter and that was a newbie mistake on my part. I did splash the wort for a minute prior to pitching, and from what I've read that should have been sufficient.

What make things more confusing is what is printed on wyeastlab.com concerning a single activator package being only to handle a plato of 6 degrees. Now maybe that is concerning a package that was not used in a starter, either or it still didn't create a clear picture as to how much yeast was appropriate for a high gravity batch and what is the best approach to take to make sure one's batch reaches full fermentation. Would a single package of american ale activator be able to handle a gravity of 1.120 if it was in a starter two days before pitching.
 
You asked about the 3787 High Gravity Trappist yeast. This is not something you want to use since it is a Belgian strain. Unless you want to make a Belgian IPA, that is :)
 
I used liquid extract. It appears where I may have put myself at risk is by over looking the use of a yeast starter and that was a newbie mistake on my part. I did splash the wort for a minute prior to pitching, and from what I've read that should have been sufficient.

What make things more confusing is what is printed on wyeastlab.com concerning a single activator package being only to handle a plato of 6 degrees. Now maybe that is concerning a package that was not used in a starter, either or it still didn't create a clear picture as to how much yeast was appropriate for a high gravity batch and what is the best approach to take to make sure one's batch reaches full fermentation. Would a single package of american ale activator be able to handle a gravity of 1.120 if it was in a starter two days before pitching.

If you used LME there's no way your OG is 1.120 at 5 gallons. It should be around 1.09.

As for pitching information, I'd check this out: http://www.mrmalty.com/pitching.php , and then the pitching calculator link along with it to calculate what would have been the proper amount.
 
bk,

I was curious to see if that was an option and I don't want to make a Belgian IPA so thanks for the reply.

dcp,

I agree with what you came up with for an original gravity. Now something I did not specify was steeping the honey post boil for 5 minutes as well as not filtering out the hop pellets. Would this perhaps cause an elevated gravity? I wouldn't think so as it was only five ounces of hops. Just throwing that out there, and certainly not ruling out that I just botched my starting gravity reading.

Thanks again to all of those who have replied.
 
I'd start with raising the temp into the low 70's, don't rack it. I wouldn't have any problems letting it sit for 6 weeks. In the meantime start another brew using WY 1056. If the double ipa hasn't progressed by the time the other batch is done, rack it on that yeast cake.
 
Here's and update for those interested:

Today is two weeks post brewing day and the airlock had one bubble every two minutes so I decided to take a gravity reading, and here is what I got: 1.022 at 68 degrees - corrected for temp at 1.023 - Much to my excitement I believe this batch has gotten down to levels that most recipe calculators expected the original recipe to reach. I must have botched my initial reading of 1.120 Not sure how that happen but it did.

So here's my plan and let me know what you think. I'll check the gravity tomorrow and Monday, and if it's consistent I'll plan to rack it to my 5 gallon carboy for clearing as well as for eventual dry hopping. After tasting the sample of what I measured there is potential for this batch it's just going to need a long time which was to be expected at least from what I've read. So what should I expect for clearing time? I was thinking 6 months at the most, and at least 3 weeks in bottles before cracking it open.

I've also been doing some reading on cold crashing while clearing. Would that be recommended or not and if so at what temp?

Thanks in advance for the responses.
 
1.023 is pretty good. I'd say it's probably done fermenting. As far as time in the secondary, 6 months is quite awhile. If you let it sit in the secondary for more than 2 months you will need to repitch yeast when you bottle it. I would give it a few weeks in the secondary and let it mellow out in the bottles. It's easier (for me) to forget about a beer and let it age if it is in bottles that I can just tuck away for a few months.
 
Jay,

Come on now do you think I'd go though that process and not sample? :) I did state that I tried it in my post however. It has potential as the base malt and bitterness are there right when you take the sip. The after taste is pretty much dominated by the orange blossom. I'm hoping overtime it will mellow out as it's a bit over the top.

I know there have been some concerns over my initial gravity reading but assume that was correct and going off of my current gravity the abv is at 13% and to me I feel it is close to it because it does have a slight "alcohol" flavor to it but what would I expect right?

I'll try this recipe again I'll just back off the honey and maybe try 0.5# and see what happens. This was the reason why I was thinking of an extended clearing to give it time to settle, and then add more yeast come bottling time.

The clearing stage for this is the biggest question mark for me in that there are so many opinions out there on what would be appropriate for clearing time but most of that pertains to low gravity batches. Where I came up six months was from a northern brewer barley wine recipe which had a similar starting gravity as this batch.

BK and Jay thanks for adding to this thread.
 
I think I figured out where I got the high original gravity from and it was an error on my part. I did a 2.5 gallon wort and then added water to it in the carboy and I don't think I blended the water with the concentrated wort well enough which lead to the higher OG. BK I'm going to take your advice and rack this to the secondary this weekend and let it hangout in the secondary for a couple of months then bottle.

I put this recipe through a calculator again and it should have had an OG between 1.087 to 1.101. The final was suppose to be 1.021 to 1.026, and I ended up with 1.023. So I think I can expect that it reached full fermentation. Now time to wait and see what this batch taste like come the end of July.

Thanks for the assistance on this batch.
 
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