Cocoa Kona Stout - Advice Please

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ApothecaryBrewing

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Howdy! This is my first attempt at an All-Grain Stout. I typically don't like stouts but wanted to try my hand and something similar to Founder's Breakfast Stout. A little stronger with a lot of flavor. Please let me know what you think and if the flavorings or any ingredient should be tweaked.

Batch Size: 5.5 gallons
Target OG: 1.076
Target FG: 1.019
IBU: 54
SRM: 50+
Yeast: US-05
Efficiency: 70%

Ingredients:
Grist---------------
  • 12# Maris Otter
  • 1.5# Flaked Oats
  • 1# Chocolate Malt
  • 1# Flaked Barley
  • 0.75# Midnight Wheat
  • 0.75# Roasted Barley
  • 0.75# Crystal 120
Hops-------------
  • 1 oz. Nugget @ 60min
  • 2 oz. Willamette @ 15 min.
Misc--------------
  • 6 oz. Unsweetened Cocoa Powder @ 10min
  • 2 oz. Kona Coffee Grounds @ Flame-Out
  • 2 oz. Kona Coffee @ Bottling
  • 0.25 oz Chocolate Extract @ Bottling
  • 0.25 oz. Vanilla Extract @ Bottling

Mash at 154F for 60 minutes (I have heard adding some cocoa powder here could be a good thing... thoughts??)

This will only be my 4th AG batch so any help is greatly appreciated... I also have never added this many flavor components to a beer.
 
well this is a little ridiculous... I guess if this was an IPA recipe this post would have 50 pages of people arguing hop additions...

derp.
 
Looks cool to me. that is a lot of dark malts going in. I have never added more than about 1/4 lb of chocolate. But I have not made something like this, but think I might borrow from your recipe and see what happens.

What is your mash set up like and do you buy the grains already crushed? I had a HUGE jump in efficiency once I bought a barley crusher.
 
Ha! I feel ya.
I can't offer advice because I've only done 1 all grain batch so far but this sounds good to me. I was actually thinking of doing a stout because my Mother-In-Law came back from Nashville and couldn't stop talking about a chocolate banana stout she had from a local brewery there(name?). And this is a person that I have never seen drink a beer! :confused:

Good luck, let us know how it turns out if you brew it.
 
Yeah there are a lot of dark malts. I wanted some roasted character without hitting that bitterness level that they sometimes give off. That is why I went for midnight wheat and a little roasted barley. The chocolate could probably be throttled back a little but I don't want to lose too much of that flavor.
 
I am not an expert in breakfast stouts, but it looks like you are close to some of the clones on here. I think it will depend on your taste and your audience. I made a brown porter that I liked, but it was pretty roasty. I was just making it for me though, and didn't really care about style. What matters is what I learned from it though. I'd just scale back just a 1/4 -1/8 lb on all the roasted, or take some of the flaked redundancies out, then you can always go further with the next one. Happy Brewing!

Are you using a program to do your recipes? If not I can put them in my brewersfriend and send you the stats.
 
So I took a look at Yooper's recipe and made some changes. I had originally worked off of a Founder's Breakfast Stout clone recipe but it is probably good to take something from a couple of sources.

Here is the recipe as it stands now:
Target OG: 1.061
Target FG: 1.015
Batch Size: 5.5 gallons
Efficiency: 70%
IBU: 52 or so
SRM: 40+ Black

Malts
  • 10# Maris Otter
  • 1# Flaked Oats
  • 0.75# Flaked Barley
  • 0.75# Crystal 80
  • 0.5# Midnight Wheat
  • 0.5# Pale Chocolate 200L
  • 0.5# Victory (I thought this was a good idea in Yooper's for that nutty toasty addition)
  • 0.25# Roasted Barley
Hops
  • 1 oz. Nugget @ 60min
  • 1oz. Willamette @ 15min

Pitch with US-05 x 2
 
I use BeerSmith at home and Hopville at work (since it is available online)

I throttled back the roast a bit and added some mid level roasted malts in for more flavor and less color and roast character. As for the flaked adjuncts... I used oats for the mouthfeel but I haven't read anywhere that they will aid with the creamy head of the beer so that is why the flaked barley is there. I have heard oats will add a creaminess to the feel of the beer but that is it where as flaked barley will do a little of that but really help with the head of the beer. I figured a little of both for good measure.
 
Also for adding the coffee, cocoa and vanilla my plans are as follows:

  • Add 6 oz of unsweetened cocoa powder at about 5 minutes in the boil
  • cold brew about 1 quart of kona coffee with 2 oz. of cocoa powder thrown in for good measure
  • Use 1-2 vanilla beans, cut up and scraped, in a muslin bag in secondary for 1 week
  • boil cold brewed coffee/cocoa mixture, add priming sugar and add that at the time of bottling

From all my reading, this seems the best way to ensure:
  1. Good cocoa flavor
  2. Coffee aroma and flavor without the oils or bitterness from hot brewing it
  3. a nice touch of vanilla to accent the chocolate flavors

thoughts?
 
You plan looks good. You may want to consider cocoa nibs, as they are easier to handle than cocoa powder.

Also with the coffee I would add a little, take a sample, then continue adding until desired. Although that may be hard to judge in the secondary or during bottling.

I might try your updated grain bill and up the MO as well, making it a Imperial Stout and keeping the hops the same!

Please keep us updated on how it went!
 
There seems to be a lot of mixed opinions on the use of powder or nibs. I have heard nibs contain the oils so they can kill head retention. I think I am just going to try the powder and see what it does for the flavor... Worst case scenario its an experiment and I learn from it.
 
For those that care, I brewed this up on Saturday. Tasted and smelled amazing out of the tun and kettle. I pitched about 1.5 packs of US-05 into it and it is currently gurgling away.

I ended up substituting the Crystal 80 for Crystal 60 and adding 0.25# of Rice Hulls since I was worried about the Flaked Adjuncts sticking things up... no issues though.

The final recipes was:
Malts
  • 10# Maris Otter
  • 1# Flaked Oats
  • 0.75# Flaked Barley
  • 0.75# Crystal 60
  • 0.5# Midnight Wheat
  • 0.5# Pale Chocolate 200L
  • 0.5# Victory (I thought this was a good idea in Yooper's for that nutty toasty addition)
  • 0.25# Roasted Barley
  • 0.25# Rice Hulls
Hops
  • 1 oz. Nugget @ 60min
  • 1oz. Willamette @ 15min

I hit 1.068 for an OG which put me around 77% efficiency, my highest yet. So now we wait.
 
This batch is a dud. Got infected with whatever turns things to vinegar. Tastes terrible... dumping it soon... just haven't worked up the heart to do so.

Better luck next time.
 
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