cleaning bottles

Anyone have tips on cleaning bottles?

Typically I will rinse the bottles thoroughly after I've poured a brew and then drain them upside down. Then I store them upside down in a box until needed. To sterilize, I just put them in the dishwasher before I bottle.

At one point or another I used a bottle washer to scrub out the bottles I have, so I'm pretty certain they were all clean to begin with. The rinsing after emptying should be enough since I know they haven't had anything else in them since they were thoroughly cleaned.

But I'm about to get another 50 dirty bottles (empties from a party a friend recently had) and I'm not really relishing the idea of scrubbing out that many bottles. I'd prefer to buy something like oxy-clean or b-bright to use, but I'm not sure if they would be as effective or if they would save me time over what I do now.

Any thoughts? Suggestions?

Get a large tub/cooler and soak them in hot water and oxyclean for 24 hrs
Rinse with a water yet, dry then sanitise.

Works for me. Gets the labels off too.

sigaas said:

Anyone have tips on cleaning bottles?

Typically I will rinse the bottles thoroughly after I've poured a brew and then drain them upside down. Then I store them upside down in a box until needed. To sterilize, I just put them in the dishwasher before I bottle.

At one point or another I used a bottle washer to scrub out the bottles I have, so I'm pretty certain they were all clean to begin with. The rinsing after emptying should be enough since I know they haven't had anything else in them since they were thoroughly cleaned.

But I'm about to get another 50 dirty bottles (empties from a party a friend recently had) and I'm not really relishing the idea of scrubbing out that many bottles. I'd prefer to buy something like oxy-clean or b-bright to use, but I'm not sure if they would be as effective or if they would save me time over what I do now.

Any thoughts? Suggestions?

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A grungy bottle may very well require a little more effort than just soaking it in some kind of cleaner. A little investment in time/muscle is something that will pay off big in the end.

A side note: you can't 'sterilize' anything in a dishwasher; it doesn't get anywhere near hot enough. Some folks have got lucky SANITIZING in them (I don't and will never trust a home dishwasher to do this no matter what anybody tells me) but nobody will ever sterilize anyting in one.

I have 3 bottle/carboy brushes and they are still in their wrappers.

My lazy (energy efficient) process :

1. Look in bottle for signs of mould. If mould, put too one side for "later"
2. Jet wash (very good investment) insuring all insides cleaned
3. Scrub with brush
4. Jet wash again
5. Drain

6. Fill a 5 gallon barrel with sterilisation solution.
7. Dunk bottles in four at a time fill them up and put in plastic crates (in bath)
8. Leave for required time (dependant on solution used)
9. Put bottle tree in bath and put bottles straight on.
10. Bottle the lovely liquid.
11. store
12. drink
13. goto 1.

P.S. I leave the lables on.

Typically I soak in Oxyclean shortly after emptying the bottle, usually only for an hour or so (Oxyclean loses its effectiveness after that). This cleans it pretty well and takes all but the most stubborn labels off. Then I store the bottles in a box until botttling day.

On bottling day I fill my bucket with water and Iodophor and let the bottle sit in the solution for 3 minutes each (I typically have 6 in the bucket at a time). Then I place them upside down on paper towels in sanitized dish washing trays I bought just for bottling (only a few dollars at Target, much cheaper than a bottling tree, check my pics). By the time the last bottles are coming out of the bucket the first ones are dry and ready to be filled. So far it has worked out great.

If you have a large basement sink or a plastic tub fill it about 3/4 full and add 2 TBS of bleach. Take each bottle and hold it under water until it's full. Add water as necessary until the tub if filled with bottles. Let soak overnight.

I cut the loop off of one of my bottle washers and inserted the brush into my drill. I use this to scrub nasty returns I get from my friends (even though I ask them to rinse them 3 times...they insist they did and I know they lied...).

Rinse with hot water and use a bottle washer to rinse out the insides. Place bottle on drying tree.

orfy said:

Get a large tub/cooler and soak them in hot water and oxyclean for 24 hrs
Rinse with a water yet, dry then sanitise.

Works for me. Gets the labels off too.

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Oxyclean works for me. It will also remove labels. On bottling day I will still wash them in the sink with dish soap, rinse, put in sanitizer for a couple minutes, then stand up in dishwasher. I bottle on the open dishwasher door.

All I do is add a tiny drop of detergent into a freshly emptied bottle, swirl (and shake) with some water, empty and then run the hot tap water into it until all the suds come out (you'll see them progress up the neck until the whole bottle is just filled with clear water). I then drain them and give a sniff to make sure no residue is left. The day before brew day I load the dishwasher (without soap) and run the sanitize cycle (bottles facing down). It works great imo. Everything comes out when it hasn't had the chance to dry or grow molds.

I'd soak in a good cleaner like oxy clean for a day or so and then use the jet wash on any bottles that aren't clean already to remove any loosened material. If anything is left after the jet wash use your bottle brush.

I'd never use dish soap as it is very difficult to get off and the oxy clean will do just as good a job of removing organic junk. Use a no rinse sanitizer before bottling and you're way ahead of anyone using soap or detergent, plus you'll have better head and we all like that.

I rinse my bottles once after I finish them and store them upright. On bottling day, I Run them in the dishwasher (no JetDry) and then sanitize them with Starsan. I've never had a problem with my bottled beer and they always come out sparkling clean. If I do end up with returns that are grungy, I just put a teaspoon of Oxyclean in and fill with water. This is how I clean my keggle (albeit with a bit more oxyclean) and it works wonderfully. I had some scorch marks some time ago and the oxyclean removed them all.

Hopfan said:

I rinse my bottles once after I finish them and store them upright. On bottling day, I Run them in the dishwasher (no JetDry) and then sanitize them with Starsan. I've never had a problem with my bottled beer and they always come out sparkling clean. If I do end up with returns that are grungy, I just put a teaspoon of Oxyclean in and fill with water. This is how I clean my keggle (albeit with a bit more oxyclean) and it works wonderfully. I had some scorch marks some time ago and the oxyclean removed them all.

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Why run them through a dishwasher cycle? If they aren't dirty it's a waste of time; if they are dirty you won't get water up into the bottle to clean them (the design of the bottle and the way dishwashers work prevent the water stream from getting up into the bottle) and you are wasting your time.

I of course rinse out after drinking.
When I'm ready to bottle, I gather enough bottles and look through each at a light to see if they are clean. Then I rinse with hot water using my faucet bottle washer. Lots will disagree about the adequacy of my next step but it has worked for the last 6 or so batches.
I have enough cartons for all my bottles. I take a just laundered hand towel from my wife's collection and put it in the bottom of the carton. First I spray the carton and dividers with Starsan. After the hot rinse I immerse in a bucket of Star San, shake the bottle and let the solution drain out and put them in the carton upside down. I haven't had any sour beers yet and I've done this as long as 3 or 4 days before bottling.
If I get bottles with labels I soak for 2 or 3 days in a solution of 1 cup household ammonia in 5 gal of water.

bikebryan said:

Why run them through a dishwasher cycle? If they aren't dirty it's a waste of time; if they are dirty you won't get water up into the bottle to clean them (the design of the bottle and the way dishwashers work prevent the water stream from getting up into the bottle) and you are wasting your time.

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I use Onestep in the detergent cup and when I pull the bottles out, they are always wet on the inside. I have to assume that the water is getting in there along with the Onestep and I then spray Starsan in them using the Alvinatore sulfiter. It may be overkill, but I feel comfortable with the process and it seems to work. I'm sure I could skip the dishwasher step, but I do all my other setups while the cycle is running and it doesn't hurt.

what if I soak them in starsan for a few minutes then to get rid of the bottles, I just do a quick rinse from my kitchen tap?? would I just be allowing nasties from the tap to contaminate the bottle or would I be ok? or couldn't I just then do a quick spray of starsan after rinsing?

I have tried several different methods and it seems I do something different each time. Last time I used my oven slowly bringing the bottles up to 350F, then rest for 60 minutes, then slowly back to room temp. Put a piece of foil over the top of each bottle while they are in the oven and crimp it down after it comes out. Sterile until I take of the foil. Thanks to Palmer's book for the info. I also rinse before hand though to get off anything that has built up.

Like I said I have only done this one time, seemed like it worked. I used these bottles for a cider that I had made. As I was bottling I noticed an odd smell. Don't know if it was something in the cider or the bottles from the way I "cooked" them. Anyone know about what I'm talkin about?

I came up with a real handy brush for cleaning the bottom of my bottles. I had a piece of aluminum tubing laying around. It's about 3/8 in inside diameter. I cut some 2" lengths of heavy weedeater line and filled one end. leaving about one inch of line hanging out the end of the tube I smacked the end flat with a hammer. Works real good!

being a noob i am not sure what my opinion is worth but i can tell ya i got the same situation with used bottles. a buddy in a local beer dist has been saving all his green flippies and a few other styles for me.
I devised a simple meathod for cleaning them (simple for me anyways) in the garage I have a bench set up. I use a shallow rubbermade tote as a catch and a drill press. I know it sounds like overkill or even perhaps stupid but what I do is soak the bottles overnight in b-brite and hot water (for as long as it stays hot anyways) to remove heavy debris, labels, molds etc....... then i clipped the end off the bottling brush and slid it into the drill press chuck and tighted.... after removing the bottles from the soaking tub I leave a bit of b-brite inside slip the bottle upand turn on the press....using duct tape as a washer of sorts to make sureI dont chip the bottle mouth on the bottom of the chuck....all drips and discarded b-brite from that process is caught in the drip pan...the bottles are then soaked in clean water, then rinised and ready to go.
the reason i do it this way is i have a minor problem with hands and they cramp up badly when hold the bottles (occupational hazzard I assume, they call it hammer hands I am a carpenter). and being a bit pressed for time and having a drill press i never use it just made good sense to make it work in my favor....ill post a pic the next time i have it out and set up...its nifty and get the job done nicely especially if you have alot of bottles to do at one time.
anthony

bikebryan said:

Why run them through a dishwasher cycle? If they aren't dirty it's a waste of time; if they are dirty you won't get water up into the bottle to clean them (the design of the bottle and the way dishwashers work prevent the water stream from getting up into the bottle) and you are wasting your time.

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Theory: If the bottles are clean you can use the sterilize cycle on your so equipped dishwasher to sterilize (on mine anti-bacteria cycle). The hot water is NOt what sterilizes the bottles, it's the extra hot drying cycle.

The Blichmann Beer Gun people recommend this procedure in their documentation.

I think that this all goes back to the sanitized/sterilize definitions. We can never have a truly sterile environment in any of our practices (lab guys that use the autoclave at work: keep it down for now.) but we can santize and keep risks at a miniumum.

I agree that if you are using another product (say starsan) and the dishwasher then you are wastiung time.


AS for pre-cleaning:
When I'm done with a bottle, I rinse it out.
I have a 21 gallon rubbermaid trash bin that I throw the bottles in and soak in a mixture of Oxyclean and Water overnight. It removes the labels and glue and any beer/gunk residue.

Since I sanitize my bottling bucket with iodine solution, I use that water in my bottles, letting them sit while I siphon the beer from the carboy into the bottling bucket. I've also done the dishwasher as well with no problems. I think the key is to be clean...but being super clean is probably not necessary.

olllllo said:

Theory: If the bottles are clean you can use the sterilize cycle on your so equipped dishwasher to sterilize (on mine anti-bacteria cycle). The hot water is NOt what sterilizes the bottles, it's the extra hot drying cycle.

The Blichmann Beer Gun people recommend this procedure in their documentation.

I think that this all goes back to the sanitized/sterilize definitions. We can never have a truly sterile environment in any of our practices (lab guys that use the autoclave at work: keep it down for now.) but we can santize and keep risks at a miniumum.

I agree that if you are using another product (say starsan) and the dishwasher then you are wastiung time.

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NO dishwasher is going to be able to sterilize ANYTHING. I know you meant sanitize, but then you go and mention the difference. As for how dishwashers sanitize, it does matter what is wet and what isn't. Sanitizing in home dishwashers is done by raising the heat in the box enough to cause moisture on the contents to 'steam' off. That means that only the areas that are wet are actually undergoing good sanitization. The design of beer bottles prevents a good stream of water from getting up inside to thoroughly coat the bottle. Could the whole interior be getting wet? Maybe. If you trust that, fine. It seems to work for some folks. Me, I will never trust it.

I turned on my dishwasher last night at the same time I started sanitizing my bottles. I had all my bottles sanitized and filled/capped/put in boxes before the dishwasher cycle had finished.

Regardless, if you are going to sanitize with a no-rinse sanitizer anyway, AND the bottles have already been cleaned, why waste time/water/money running them in a dishwasher cycle?

We're going to have to disagree.

I'll cite Palmer and go away.

Table 5 - SanitizersSanitizers

Star San™
2 tablespoons per 5 gallons
Can be used via immersion or spraying. Will sanitize clean surfaces in 30 seconds. Allow to drain before use; does not need to be rinsed.

Iodophor
12.5 - 25 ppm
1 tablespoon per 5 gallons = 12.5 ppm.
Iodophor will sanitize in 10 minutes at 12.5 ppm and does not need to be rinsed. Allow to drain before use.

Bleach
1 tablespoon per gallon.
Bleach will sanitize equipment in 20 minutes. It does not have to be rinsed, but probably should be to prevent chlorophenol flavors.

Dishwasher
Full wash and Heat Dry cycle without detergent.
Bottles must be clean before being put in dishwasher for sanitizing. Place upside down on rack.

Oven
340°F for 1 hour
Renders bottles sterile, not just sanitized. Allow bottles to cool slowly to prevent thermal shock and cracking


http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter2-2-3.html

^ someone must be a jeeper....

I am baking my bottles right now at 350* for 1hr20min, figure it will take 20' for the bottles to get to 350*...

Dunked them in a bucket with some oxyclean, labels peeled right off after 5', soaked another few mins, and the glue dissolves right off. I noticed though that the oxyclean would lose its effectiveness after about 15', just added a bit more. Rinsed the outsides and bottle washed the insides, figured oxyclean can't be good for you...then into the oven.

One question though, i bought a large supply of bombers from a guy, and about 1/2 of them are rolling rock bottles with painted labels...anyone ever tried to bake bottles with paint? Should I avoid this?

I baked a Stone IPA bottle with a label which is painted on. Still looks like a label to me.

olllllo said:

We're going to have to disagree.

I'll cite Palmer and go away.

Table 5 - SanitizersSanitizers

Star San™
2 tablespoons per 5 gallons
Can be used via immersion or spraying. Will sanitize clean surfaces in 30 seconds. Allow to drain before use; does not need to be rinsed.

Iodophor
12.5 - 25 ppm
1 tablespoon per 5 gallons = 12.5 ppm.
Iodophor will sanitize in 10 minutes at 12.5 ppm and does not need to be rinsed. Allow to drain before use.

Bleach
1 tablespoon per gallon.
Bleach will sanitize equipment in 20 minutes. It does not have to be rinsed, but probably should be to prevent chlorophenol flavors.

Dishwasher
Full wash and Heat Dry cycle without detergent.
Bottles must be clean before being put in dishwasher for sanitizing. Place upside down on rack.

Oven
340°F for 1 hour
Renders bottles sterile, not just sanitized. Allow bottles to cool slowly to prevent thermal shock and cracking


http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter2-2-3.html

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Yes, I've read this too. I don't believe everything I read. I know how dishwashers work. I've worked as a food service manager for a bit. I know how commercial dishwashers sanitize and I know how home units do it. I know how steam autoclaves do it. A home dishwasher is not meant for food grade sanitizing in general.

As I said, it works for some people and they trust it. More power to them. Knowing how it works makes it not an option for me. Further, it takes too long. I can sanitize two and a half cases with iodophor, have the beer bottled, capped and boxed, about 30 minutes before the dishwasher has been through an entire cycle and items have cooled down enough to use.

bikebryan said:

Yes, I've read this too. I don't believe everything I read. I know how dishwashers work. I've worked as a food service manager for a bit. I know how commercial dishwashers sanitize and I know how home units do it. I know how steam autoclaves do it. A home dishwasher is not meant for food grade sanitizing in general.

As I said, it works for some people and they trust it. More power to them. Knowing how it works makes it not an option for me. Further, it takes too long. I can sanitize two and a half cases with iodophor, have the beer bottled, capped and boxed, about 30 minutes before the dishwasher has been through an entire cycle and items have cooled down enough to use.

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Kind of like sausage and law making as they say.
I guess if the practice is flawed one hopes that you're ruining 1 or maybe 2 bottles in a batch if there is a problem at all.

Hey, If you're happy with you're method, it works and you don't see anything better, then why change?

If my bottles have labels, I soak them in a solution of 1 cup household ammonia in 5 gal water. After a couple days the labels have either floated off or they slide right off.
I examine the bottom of my bottles against a bright light since most of the grunge will be on the bottoms. Tried a new trick the other day for dirty bottles - mixed up some strong bleach solution and poured 1/4 to 1/2 cup into each bottle. After about 1/2 hour poured the bleach solution out, scrubbed w/a bottle brush, rinsed thoroughly and sanitized. (I use StarSan)

I'm thinking about visiting the neighborhood bar to see if I can get bottles. I have to admit, after watching what people put in their empty bottles makes me cringe a bit, so I'm figuring any bottles that have unidentifiable contents will go straight to recycling.

I want to make sure what I have left is totally and completely clean. Baking in the oven sounds like a good idea. I'm assuming the washed bottles go in the oven before it's turned on?

Others apparantly go to recycling centers to pick up bottles. I'd love to hear what they do to prep the bottles for use.

Always rinse bottle after pouring beer in glass!!

On bottling day I do a hot water rinse with the faucet bottle washer. And then sanitize with Iodophor and a Sanitizer Injector and place the bottles upside down to drain. I've made a wooden board with holes large enough that the bottle necks fit through, so no contact with the wooden surface. Two to three squirts of sanitizer and the inside is sanitized. I can sanitize a whole batch with about a pint of Idophor and in about 10 minutes. I usually add a few drops part way through the process as I can see the Iodophor is loosing color.

For bottles with labels Oxyclean overnight and then rinse out the inside. Might have to lightly scrub the glue off, but too bad.