I want my power to plug into my kettle, not the other way around...

Seems like the builds I've seen so far have X feet of chord coming out of their kettle then plugging into their control box.

I would like the disconnect to be at the kettle so I can clean the kettle out in my sink, versus cleaning in place. Sure I could still clean a kettle with x feet of chord hanging from it but this way would be less clumsy.

In this approach, I would have the power cord hard wired to the panel > then ~10' of chord > then a female plug (since hot can't be male's) > that connects to a 4" chord with male plug on the box attached to the kettle.

Am I missing some reason why more people don't do this. Maybe Kal will chime in

Very possible. Need a 'breakout' box of some sort to hold this connector.


4" (double device) weatheritite box would be best, but you might squeeze it into a single box.

'da Kid

hmmm...wonder what the depth is of that plug.

We routinely install them in these boxes:



That's the double (4") box. We will occasionally squeeze them into a single box. Nothing high voltage or amperage though. You will find readily available covers for the '4-square' box.

The inlet connector might be 1-1/2" deep. Some have wiring from the side.

'da Kid

You could just use male receptacle plug with a little pigtail , you don't have to have the mounted receptacle.

I built mine worth the cord coming out of the pot like most. its not that bad having the cord on there when I wash it and I usually can wrap it around the pot and tuck it in the handle to hold it out of the way. The reason I (and most others) build them that way is to have an airtight seal for the electrical connection. Once you put the plug at the pot end there its a chance for a short in the event of a boil over.

search for switchcraft connections here in the Elec Forum

I've designed mine with a pigtail.

I originally was going to use a Switchcraft connection, but the fins on the female side are just too small for my comfort level.

Mine has a 6' pigtail and it works great. I also wrap the cord around the pot and hook the plug-end under one of the handles when I wash the pot.

I like the smaller in price and size of the switchcraft and powercons, but looks lile they can be a bear to wire with 10 gaige wire. So, yeah.

Do you have any pics by chance?

I sure do.

Here's a yellow terminal thingy for size comparison. I've seen older builds that used the Switchcraft that the yellow terminal thingy fit snugly on the fins. Personally, my soldering skills have degraded to the point that there is no way I could solder 10g wire to those little things.

There are two versions...the one you have with .187" tabs and one with .25" tabs that fit those female connectors.

jbnla said:

I ordered the Moser HPCP41F1 for the panel and the tabs are very small in relation to the plug. On investigation I determined that the the tabs on the plug are .250 and on the panel I ordered is .187. I then found there is a panel with the same tabs as the plug (.250). It has the same number but with the 1 left off the end #HPCP41F. Did you use the smaller tabs in your panel and electric box ? They are rated the same just smaller.

Click to expand...

I would recommend going with NEMA locking plugs for the pigtails. They are beefier and certainly up to handling the current. Those switchcraft are sketchy and cheap versions of Neutrik connectors that explicitly state they are not to be used for AC mains. If you do have the switchcrafts, do not try to disconnect them while the power is live.

orangehero said:

I would recommend going with NEMA locking plugs for the pigtails. They are beefier and certainly up to handling the current. Those switchcraft are sketchy and cheap versions of Neutrik connectors that explicitly state they are not to be used for AC mains. If you do have the switchcrafts, do not try to disconnect them while the power is live.

Click to expand...

According to the specs on the Switchcrafts:

Voltage Rating: 1.5 kV
Current Rating: 50 A

And holding one next to one of the many Neutriks I have, they *feel* about the same.. ("Is it heavy? Then it's expensive. Put it down.").

But yeah.. I'm going to go with NEMA locking plugs for my pigtail.

Thanks brewmcq, I'm going to try the Switchcrafts. Going to put a female connector in the element box attached to my kettle, and a female connector on my control panel. The a 3' wire with males on each end between them.

Unlike Nemas the males dont have exposed hots.

Then Nema plugs where my control panel plugs into my spa panel.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f170/switchcrafts-plug-outlet-option-369044/

kevreh said:

Am I missing some reason why more people don't do this. Maybe Kal will chime in

Click to expand...

I designed my brewing process and room first, so:

(1) The HLT doesn't need to be moved or cleaned (ever) so once plugged in, it's done.

(2) The boil kettle is beside the sink so I tilt it in sideways and basically clean in place (CIP) without disconnecting any of the cables.

So I didn't go with disconnects at the kettles as I didn't need them, which reduces cost, gang box depth, etc.

(I only considered NEMA rated stuff so connectors like switchcraft were never something I looked at)

Good luck!

Kal

Thanks kal. Yeah, where I'm brewing I'll need to be able to move the kettle to the sink to clean then put away.

I forgot that I bought a male Nema plug last year (found in closet), just need the female panel mount. So I'll probably use that for my kettle to control panel connection. When cleaning and storing I'll wind up my ~3' of wire with plug from the kettle and velcro-wrap it to my kettle handle. Side note, all my power tools have the chords tied with the velcro-wrap, works nice.

I did this with my boil kettle. You can use Kal's element design and just change a few things to achieve what you want.

First, you need to use an extension ring for the two gang wet location box that protects the end of the heating element. Home Depot carries them.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Hubbell-...nsion-Ring-Gray-DE000S/202284518#.Uintu9Ksh8E

This ring give yous extra depth and allows you to mount the flanged inlet in the cover of the box.



Next you need an L6-30 twist lock flanged inlet. McMaster sells these.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#7162k13/=oe1wl9

Cut a 2 1/8" hole in the cover and mount the inlet. Then connect the wires from the inlet to the heating element and close it up.



Now, get yourself an L6-30 connector for your 10-3 cable and you're in business. McMaster to the rescue again.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#7162k54/=oe21fv





Casey

kevreh said:

Seems like the builds I've seen so far have X feet of chord coming out of their kettle then plugging into their control box.

I would like the disconnect to be at the kettle so I can clean the kettle out in my sink, versus cleaning in place. Sure I could still clean a kettle with x feet of chord hanging from it but this way would be less clumsy.

In this approach, I would have the power cord hard wired to the panel > then ~10' of chord > then a female plug (since hot can't be male's) > that connects to a 4" chord with male plug on the box attached to the kettle.

Am I missing some reason why more people don't do this. Maybe Kal will chime in

Click to expand...

Hey thanks for that detailed walk-through. Gotta love McMaster for one stop shopping. Look forward to your pics.


Thanks

I updated my post with some pictures. Then I realized, it wouldn't bump the update. So now, I'm replying...

Nice work squatch!
What do you have on the backside of the main wet location box and the kettle wall?

Thanks,
'da Kid

It's Kal's excellent design from his site. Here is a link.

http://theelectricbrewery.com/heating-elements?page=7

All I did was change how you get power to the element

Casey

The10mmKid said:

Nice work squatch!
What do you have on the backside of the main wet location box and the kettle wall?

Thanks,
'da Kid

Click to expand...

brewmcq said:

According to the specs on the Switchcrafts:

Voltage Rating: 1.5 kV
Current Rating: 50 A

And holding one next to one of the many Neutriks I have, they *feel* about the same.. ("Is it heavy? Then it's expensive. Put it down.").

But yeah.. I'm going to go with NEMA locking plugs for my pigtail.

Click to expand...

I wouldn't recommend using the switchcraft or the neutrik for this application. They are rated for speaker voltages and not intended for ac power. PowerCon connectors are designed and rated for AC applications. Both the SpeaKon and powerCon type connectors only carry an IP rating of IP20 and IP2X depending on if they are cable mount or panel mount configurations. That ratings means that they are not suitable for wet applications like are found in a brewhouse. Safety first!

Well, sorta true. There's another thread where someone wrote to the Switchcraft mfctr asking about 50a power and they said they would work fine. IIRC they didn't get approval because of how the handle power when plugged and unplugged live. I don't know.

I went with NEMA 3 and 4 prong plugs because a) I had one sitting around from when I first started this project 6 months ago and b) I scrounged a few things to return at Lowes, allowing me to get another plug. So now I have the male 4 prong plug to plug into the female on my power supply side, and the male 3 prong coming out of the kettle box.

Part-wise, I'm 80% there. Just need the female NEMAs, Spa Panel with GFCI (or GFCI in the house breaker), and parts to make power feed box for kettle.

My element had a thermostat box on the end of it that I repurposed to hold the nema plug. I have a removable jumper cord that Plugs in my GFCI and into the kettle. The element is screwed into a triclamp adapter. This allows the element to be easily removed for cleaning.



More pics can be found here:
Http://www.londonbrewers.ca/blog

The switchcraft plugs and outlets that I have used for the last 18 months were manufactured for power supply among other things, I'm still very happy I decided to incorporate them into my 30 amp system. I'm extremely happy that I can disconnect the power supply cord at the kettle, I highly recommend this whatever plug and outlet you go with.

I have a classified ad on here that has a bunch of these pairs for sale for cheap. They're 20 amp so it should work for most elements.

I bought a pair of the Switchcraft connectors to take a look but they are clearly not designed for power applications. Apart from anything else there is no way you could fit 10 AWG wires inside the case - they are simply too small. There is also the dangerous possibility of wiring them the wrong way around because they lack the usual markings for hot, neutral and ground.

I went with proper NEMA L6-30 plugs, connectors and receptacles and recommend everyone else to do the same. They are very robust and you can get a big discount buying them on ebay.

I very strongly advise against the Switchcraft connectors.

alien said:

I bought a pair of the Switchcraft connectors to take a look but they are clearly not designed for power applications. Apart from anything else there is no way you could fit 10 AWG wires inside the case - they are simply too small. There is also the dangerous possibility of wiring them the wrong way around because they lack the usual markings for hot, neutral and ground.

I went with proper NEMA L6-30 plugs, connectors and receptacles and recommend everyone else to do the same. They are very robust and you can get a big discount buying them on ebay.

I very strongly advise against the Switchcraft connectors.

Click to expand...

The other reason is that power connectors should have pins shaped so that the ground connects before the live and neutral makes contact - this means that if the appliance is faulty, you have a ground in place before the live is shorted to the case, which you may well be holding in order to plug the connector in. Speaker type connectors don't have this, and this is what was meant by them not getting approval because of how they handle power when plugged and unplugged while live.

The Neutrik powerCON True1 range is rated up to 16A and can be (dis)connected under load.

alien said:

I bought a pair of the Switchcraft connectors to take a look but they are clearly not designed for power applications. Apart from anything else there is no way you could fit 10 AWG wires inside the case - they are simply too small. There is also the dangerous possibility of wiring them the wrong way around because they lack the usual markings for hot, neutral and ground.

I went with proper NEMA L6-30 plugs, connectors and receptacles and recommend everyone else to do the same. They are very robust and you can get a big discount buying them on ebay.

I very strongly advise against the Switchcraft connectors.

Click to expand...

I must be a wizard. I got three 10ga wires to fit. I used 10/3 SOOW wire. Had to trim some of the rubber sheathing on the end down a bit in order to get the sheathing to fit inside the plug cover, but I got it.

One big thing is that I had to remove the plastic from the spade terminals, because the plastic housings were just too big for the space that the terminals needed to connect to. I solved that problem by removing the plastic covers of the spade terminals, then crimping the spade terminals on, then sliding a couple of layers of heat shrink tubing over the terminals and wiring, then soldering the terminals to the outlet, then sliding the shrink tubing down over the terminals and then applying heat to shrink the tubing.

Plugs work great for me, and I got away with using just an extension box for the place to plug into the pots, instead of having to use a full junction box plus an extension box.

My cables are connected to my control panel. I have 16 inch pigtails on my tri-clamp element adapters.

rossi46 said:

My cables are connected to my control panel. I have 16 inch pigtails on my tri-clamp element adapters.

Click to expand...

I like this element cover. Do you have better pictures or a write up of how you did it?

They are the element adapters from stilldragon.com

squatch said:

I did this with my boil kettle. You can use Kal's element design and just change a few things to achieve what you want.

Casey

Click to expand...

I really like this idea. I'm still in the planning stages for an electric build and I didn't like the idea of dragging cords around to clean my kettle/MT. I have no sink in the garage and have to use the hose on the side of the house to clean up. Thanks for the pics and links!