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claytontlewis

claytontlewis

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Hey guys,

I'm new to homebrewing and I think I've jumped in over my head a bit. I've got the equipment setup to do a full mash, and I bought the ingredients from a local homebrew store to make Lagunitas' Cappuchino Stout. I'll post the recipe below, but my problem is that I'm not fulling understanding it. I stopped by a brewery over the holidays and I think I've got a good handle on it now, but still missing a few points. If I'm right then I need to mash the grain at 155 for an hour and then remove the grains and add the hops at the indicated times. I don't understand the 0 minutes or dryhop ingredients and need to know how to add these. I also am unsure of how long it should be in the primary fermenter, the secondary, and bottle before drinking. Any help at all would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks in advance and I look forward to brewing.


>From BYO September 2005, Vol.11, no.5 (p.52)
Lagunitas Cappuccino Stout clone(5 gallon all-grain)
OG = 1.070
FG = 1.014
IBU = 52
SRM = 35
ABV = 7.2%

Ingredients:
10 lb 1oz 2-row pale malt
1 lb 12.5 oz wheat malt
1 lb 4.75 oz Crystal 609.5 oz chocolate malt
9.5 oz corn sugar
3 oz coffee

7.4 AAU Horizon (60 min) << 0.67 oz @ 11% AA
0.72 AAU Willamette (30 min) << 0.14 oz @ 5% AA
2.15 AAU Cascade (30 min) << 0.36 oz @ 6% AA
4.9 AAU Willamette (0 min) << 0.98 oz @ 5% AA
5.9 AAU Cascade (0 min) << 0.98 oz @ 6% AA
0.07 oz Willamette (dryhop)
0.08 oz Cascade (dryhop)

Wyeast 1056 American Ale yeast
0.75 cups corn sugar (for priming)

Step by Step:
Mash at 155ºF. Boil 60 minutes, adding corn sugar at beginning of boil. Ferment 70ºF. Brewcoffee and add in secondary.
 
Jump right in! I love it. Don't let anyone tell you not to. And relax if things don't go exactly as planned - you'll still have awesome beer.

Dryhopping is generally done after primary active fermentation is done, I'd give it a week or so. Reason being, delicate/volatile hop oils/aroma would be lost during vigorous, active fermentation. Some people add directly to their primary (after activity slows) and dry hop in there for a week or two, others transfer to a secondary and dry hop in there.

If it were me, I'd primary for 7-10 days, then dry hop for another 7-10 days, then bottle. Leave it in the bottle at room temp for ~3 weeks. You'll have bubbles/carbonation after a few days, but it takes longer for the CO2 to fully dissolve. Try one after a week - it'll be fizzy and harsh. Much better after 2-3 weeks. Since this is a higher-ABV beer, time is your friend. You'll lose hop freshness over time, but everything else should get better with age.

And one other thing - I'd try to ferment close to mid/low 60s...a basement or swamp cooler (essentially covered with wet towel) work well.

You're correct on the mash - 155 for 60 mins should be great. Don't worry if you're +/- a degree or two. The 0min addition is exactly that - throw it in when you turn off the flame. Thought being that boiling drives off delicate aromas, think instead of making "hop tea" in the warm sugar water.
 
The (minutes) notations are when you add these items. YOu're doing a 60-minute boil, and you use a countdown timer, so 30-min means add things at 30 minutes left during boil. 0 minutes means add at end of boil as you take off heat.

I dryhop at secondary, but you can do however you want. Primary/secondary time - I haven't done a stout, so can't really answer. For a 'typical' beer, a week in each or 2 weeks in secondary is the usual. Primary as long as your gravity is changing for sure. Secondary is an optional in my world, not sure with a stout.

Sorry I can't answer more...
 
zero min hops go in at the end of the boil right as you shut the burner off ... dry hops go in about 5 to 10 days before you bottle ... I'd just primary it for three weeks, dryhopping the last week of that, and then bottle ... you also might want to add the 9.5 oz. of suger to the primary after the fermentation has settled down a bit ... that will help the yeast work a little better IIRC .. sounds like a great beer ... good luck
 
Man you guys are fast.
claytontlewis said:
If I'm right then I need to mash the grain at 155 for an hour and then remove the grains and add the hops at the indicated times.
Click to expand...

Yes mash the grains at 155 for an hour. Then do a vorlauf which is a fancy name for recirulating some wort. To do this, assuming you are using a cooler with a some type of drain system just collect wort into a jug, it will be full of grain bits, gently pour (so you don't disturb the grain bed) that back into the mash, repeat process until the wort come out pretty much sediment free. This can take a while or be a fast process, just depends on your system.

Not sure if you plan to batch or fly sparge. If batch sparging just drain the wort from your mash into a brew kettle or bucket. Start slowly and gently increase the output. With my systems I usually open my valve about halfway and have a good steady flow. You'll just have to experiment with your system. Once it is drained add you sparge water mix everything up real well and do another vorlauf, once running clear, drain to boil kettle. Do this as many times as you recipe calls for
 
There are some great videos on you tube for all grain brewing. Are you batch or fly sparging?
 
Nice - jumping directly into the deep end with AG, I see!

First question: exactly WHAT equipment do you have on hand? Most specifically, what do you intend to mash in?

Traditional all grain methods are very similar to what you describe - but you mash the grains for 60 minutes, then extract the wort from the grains, rather than remove the grains from the wort, if you follow what I'm getting at.

Here's how I would approach it, which might help:
- I'd mash the grains @ 155, as you suggest, in my cooler mash tun.
- After 60 minutes, I'd drain all the liquid I could from that mash tun into my boil kettle.
- I aim to boil 7.5 or so gallons (I expect to boil off about 1.5 gallons). So I take a look at what volume I was able to extract from the mash, and subtract that from 7.5. This is my sparge volume.
- I heat that sparge volume up to about 180F, then add half of it to the mash tun, stir, wait 10 minutes or so, then drain into the boil kettle.
- I then add the second half of the sparge volume to the mash tun, stir, wait 10 minutes or so, then train into the boil kettle.
- I should now have about 7.5 gallons of wort in my kettle, and I bring that up to a boil
- Once I reach a boil, I give it a couple minutes, watching carefully for the hot break (it'll look like egg drop soup). Some folks scoop this out, I simply wait for it to happen and let it drop back into the kettle.
- Once the hot break is done, I set a timer for 60 minutes, and add my 60 minute hop addition
- When the timer reaches 30 minutes, I add the 30 minute hop addition
- When the timer reaches 0, I turn out the flame and add the 0 minute hop addition, whirlpool (stir it up fiarly rapidly) and let it stand, covered, for 10-15 minutes.
- After the 10-15 minutes, chill the wort, transfer to fermenter, and add the yeast

Give it whatever time it needs (yeast work on their own timetable, not yours!) for primary fermentation to complete. You'll know it's complete because your hydrometer (you have one, right? ;) ) will give you a consistent gravity reading for 3 days in a row. Typically, this will happen in 10-14 days, but it never hurts to give the beer an extra week or so past that point.

Only after primary fermentation is done do you add the dry hops. Some folks will add that to the primary fermenter, some will transfer the beer to a secondary vessel and add the dry hops there - do whichever works best for you. Let the beer sit with the dry hops for at least a few days (to be honest, I've only dry-hopped once, so I'm no authority when it comes to dry-hopping).

After those few days with the dry hops, go ahead and package your beer - whether you keg it, or add priming sugar and bottle. If you're bottle conditioning, give it 3 weeks at room temperature, then a couple days in the fridge for the CO2 to dissolve into the beer, and you're good to go.
 
Yooper said:
What do you have for equipment? If we know that, we can type out step by step instructions for you.
Click to expand...

This is my kit here:

7.9 gallon plastic primary fermenter with a lid and stopper
5 gallon glass carboy secondary fermenter
Universal stopper
Two 3-piece airlocks
Plastic Bucket Opener
6 feet of Siphon Hose (3/8" Thin Wall)
Auto-Siphon (3/8")
Auto-Siphon Clamp (3/8")
Bottle Filler (3/8")
Red Baron Bottle capper
Bottle caps
Nylon grain bag
Triple scale hydrometer
Floating thermometer
21" stainless steel spoon
Cleaner/Sanitizer

I also have a outdoor propane burner, a 44 QT stainless steel stock pot, and a 25' wort chiller.
 
stratslinger said:
Nice - jumping directly into the deep end with AG, I see!

First question: exactly WHAT equipment do you have on hand? Most specifically, what do you intend to mash in?

Traditional all grain methods are very similar to what you describe - but you mash the grains for 60 minutes, then extract the wort from the grains, rather than remove the grains from the wort, if you follow what I'm getting at.

Here's how I would approach it, which might help:
- I'd mash the grains @ 155, as you suggest, in my cooler mash tun.
- After 60 minutes, I'd drain all the liquid I could from that mash tun into my boil kettle.
- I aim to boil 7.5 or so gallons (I expect to boil off about 1.5 gallons). So I take a look at what volume I was able to extract from the mash, and subtract that from 7.5. This is my sparge volume.
- I heat that sparge volume up to about 180F, then add half of it to the mash tun, stir, wait 10 minutes or so, then drain into the boil kettle.
- I then add the second half of the sparge volume to the mash tun, stir, wait 10 minutes or so, then train into the boil kettle.
- I should now have about 7.5 gallons of wort in my kettle, and I bring that up to a boil
- Once I reach a boil, I give it a couple minutes, watching carefully for the hot break (it'll look like egg drop soup). Some folks scoop this out, I simply wait for it to happen and let it drop back into the kettle.
- Once the hot break is done, I set a timer for 60 minutes, and add my 60 minute hop addition
- When the timer reaches 30 minutes, I add the 30 minute hop addition
- When the timer reaches 0, I turn out the flame and add the 0 minute hop addition, whirlpool (stir it up fiarly rapidly) and let it stand, covered, for 10-15 minutes.
- After the 10-15 minutes, chill the wort, transfer to fermenter, and add the yeast

Give it whatever time it needs (yeast work on their own timetable, not yours!) for primary fermentation to complete. You'll know it's complete because your hydrometer (you have one, right? ;) ) will give you a consistent gravity reading for 3 days in a row. Typically, this will happen in 10-14 days, but it never hurts to give the beer an extra week or so past that point.

Only after primary fermentation is done do you add the dry hops. Some folks will add that to the primary fermenter, some will transfer the beer to a secondary vessel and add the dry hops there - do whichever works best for you. Let the beer sit with the dry hops for at least a few days (to be honest, I've only dry-hopped once, so I'm no authority when it comes to dry-hopping).

After those few days with the dry hops, go ahead and package your beer - whether you keg it, or add priming sugar and bottle. If you're bottle conditioning, give it 3 weeks at room temperature, then a couple days in the fridge for the CO2 to dissolve into the beer, and you're good to go.
Click to expand...

Nice set of instructions! And I'll add that no matter what, chances are you'll end up with something you'll truly be proud to drink and enjoy...
 
WOW! You guys are fast!

Yooper said:
What do you have for equipment? If we know that, we can type out step by step instructions for you.
Click to expand...

I'm using this kit:

7.9 gallon plastic primary fermenter with a lid and stopper
5 gallon glass carboy secondary fermenter
Universal stopper
Two 3-piece airlocks
Plastic Bucket Opener
6 feet of Siphon Hose (3/8" Thin Wall)
Auto-Siphon (3/8")
Auto-Siphon Clamp (3/8")
Bottle Filler (3/8")
Red Baron Bottle capper
Bottle caps
Nylon grain bag
Triple scale hydrometer
Floating thermometer
21" stainless steel spoon
Cleaner/Sanitizer


I also have a 44 QT stainless steel stock pot (planning to use for mash and brew, the brewery I stopped by said this would work), an outdoor propane burner that matches the pot, and a 25' wort chiller.

BIG THANKS TO EVERYONE WHO HAS HELPED SO FAR!
 
claytontlewis said:
WOW! You guys are fast!



I'm using this kit:

7.9 gallon plastic primary fermenter with a lid and stopper
5 gallon glass carboy secondary fermenter
Universal stopper
Two 3-piece airlocks
Plastic Bucket Opener
6 feet of Siphon Hose (3/8" Thin Wall)
Auto-Siphon (3/8")
Auto-Siphon Clamp (3/8")
Bottle Filler (3/8")
Red Baron Bottle capper
Bottle caps
Nylon grain bag
Triple scale hydrometer
Floating thermometer
21" stainless steel spoon
Cleaner/Sanitizer


I also have a 44 QT stainless steel stock pot (planning to use for mash and brew, the brewery I stopped by said this would work), an outdoor propane burner that matches the pot, and a 25' wort chiller.

BIG THANKS TO EVERYONE WHO HAS HELPED SO FAR!
Click to expand...

You're going to use the bag to mash in? For that much grain, it has to be a BIG bag. BIG. It should be able to line your pot. Do you have a big enough bag?
 
Yooper said:
You're going to use the bag to mash in? For that much grain, it has to be a BIG bag. BIG. It should be able to line your pot. Do you have a big enough bag?
Click to expand...

It appears to be big enough to hold all of the grain fine. I guess I won't know for sure until I start the brew, which I'm planning on doing New Year's Eve night. What better way to start the year than with a batch of homebrew?

Oh, I also bought a ball valve and kettle screen that I added to the pot.
 
I can do 14lb grain no problem in a 5 gallon paint strainer (clearly the bags are bigger than 5 gallons, they just fit conveniently in the 5gal homer pails with some overhang), and it goes just barely above the bottom of my 30qt pot, which is perfect. I would check to make sure your bag will fill all of the space in your 44qt pot for mashing before you start.

My concern is that if your bag sits way above the bottom of the pot, you'll have all your grain constricted in a tight space in the bag with a bunch of strike water in the bottom of the pot not in contact with your grains. This is something you should check out before you start your brew or you may be disappointed.
 
How much water should I be using for the mash? I have been reading about it today and my initial assumption may be wrong. I was going to do 7.5 Gallons, remove the grain, bring it to a boil, and start hopping. From what I was reading today it seems like I need to do a much smaller mash and then add water for the boil. Is this right?
 
I'd suggest using the seach feature in this forum. Search: BIAB or brew in a bag. When I first started I did biab. It works well. I suggest getting a ladder and attaching pully with a cleat on it so you can pull out your grain bag and let it drain over the kettle for 5-10 minutes after mashing is done. You really want to avoid wringing out the bag too much as its really hot and the can extract some nasties you don't want.

Good luck and enjoy brewing it is a great hobby/obsession for many of us! :)
 
If your pot allows (think you said 44 qts) do as close to a full volume mash as possible. It will allow for more sugars to concentrate in the wort. Also, tends to lead to a cleaner and more dry ferment.
 
Given the high planned OG of this beer, you should probably make a yeast starter. You can grab a liter of your wort as you sparge, boil it for sterility (a pyrex Erlenmeyer flask helps, but you can boil it in a pan then dump it into a mason jar), cool it down than poor your smack-pack into it. Shake it every time you think of it for 24 hours or so, than dump it into your carboy, which you kept airlocked or stoppered since you transferred your wort into it. You might get away with dumping the smack-pack as is, but I'm fairly sure that either 1.060 or 1.070 is the stated upper limit on those for a 5 gall. batch.
I agree with whoever said consult "How to Brew" - I think that the last edition is available gratis on the internets somewhere. If not, get the equivalent info somewhere and write out a rough plan before you start. Good idea starting with an 11 gall. boil-pot - why mess around with dinkster pots?
 
I have a dry yeast that I'm planning to use. This was due to buying the ingredients while travelling for the holidays. The guy at the store thought dry was going to hold up better in the car.
 
You should be fine just pitching your dry yeast. A starter would be better, but if given the choice between pitching right away with a packet or waiting 24-48 hours to get a decent starter going id pitch the packet. Just a personal opinion due to how vulnerable the wort is. You'd hate to have a wild yeast take off in there. Who knows what it'd turn out to be. If you have time to make a starter a couple days prior to brew day do it. Your yeast will thank you.
 
I'm doing the brew. Just about to sparge and start the boil. I had a hard time keeping the mash at 155, so I ended up mashing at around 190. Hope this doesn't ruin it :(
 
claytontlewis said:
I'm doing the brew. Just about to sparge and start the boil. I had a hard time keeping the mash at 155, so I ended up mashing at around 190. Hope this doesn't ruin it :(
Click to expand...

Mashing at 190 will not work - this is much too hot for the enzymes you need to do their thing (convert starch into sugars). You will end up with very few sugars in your wort which means very little alcohol. If it is already done, I'm not sure you can fix it at this point unless you happen to have a bunch of malt extract laying around.

160 is about the upper limit for mash temps. In general you want to shoot for something between 148 and 158.
 
I guess I just brought the water temp up too fast. I couldn't get it down below 185, and it was only 150 when I added the grain.
 
claytontlewis said:
I guess I just brought the water temp up too fast. I couldn't get it down below 185, and it was only 150 when I added the grain.
Click to expand...

How long do you think it was under 160? Even 15-20 minutes would be good. Conversion will happen faster at higher temps, so you might be ok. Does the wort taste sweet?
 
I didn't taste the wort, but it may have been under 160 for about 15 minutes. I hope it turns out ok. I have plenty of corn sugar and could add more than the 9.5 OZ it called for.
 
claytontlewis said:
I didn't taste the wort, but it may have been under 160 for about 15 minutes. I hope it turns out ok. I have plenty of corn sugar and could add more than the 9.5 OZ it called for.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't add additional corn sugar - this will seriously thin out the beer and lacks flavor. Where are you in the process? Tasting the wort will at least tell you if you had some conversion. Do you have a hydrometer? If so, cool a sample of wort down and take a reading. This will tell you for certain how much conversion took place.
 
claytontlewis said:
Already 20 minutes into boil. =(
Click to expand...

Not too late to at least figure some things out. Put a sample in the freezer for a hydro reading and taste the wort. It will bitter from the hops, but should also be sweet.
 
I don't honestly know yet. I got it down to about 65 and took a reading then pitched the yeast. I made mental note of my hydrometer reading but couldn't yet interpret it. I'll do some googling on that today and let you know once I can tell how to read it.
 
Alright. It looks like I was aiming for an OG of 1.070 and in actuality I got a OG of 1.032. Its probably going to come out low on ABV, but since it was supposed to be 7.2% maybe I can still have a decent beer.
 
claytontlewis said:
Alright. It looks like I was aiming for an OG of 1.070 and in actuality I got a OG of 1.032. Its probably going to come out low on ABV, but since it was supposed to be 7.2% maybe I can still have a decent beer.
Click to expand...

That's what I was afraid of. 1.032 is quite low, especially if you hopped it expecting 1.070 - it will be intensely bitter and thin. The only thing I can think of now is to chalk this one up to experience and try to figure out a way to manage your mash temp next time. Sorry. :eek:
 
You should look into building a cooler mash tun. It is not that hard to do and it won't cost you much.
 
JLem said:
That's what I was afraid of. 1.032 is quite low, especially if you hopped it expecting 1.070 - it will be intensely bitter and thin. The only thing I can think of now is to chalk this one up to experience and try to figure out a way to manage your mash temp next time. Sorry. :eek:
Click to expand...

Is this even worth bottling? Should I just pour this out and start again or wait and see what my final gravity is? It tasted really bitter when I tried the hydrometer sample.

BWN said:
You should look into building a cooler mash tun. It is not that hard to do and it won't cost you much.
Click to expand...

Can you give me a link on how to do a cooler mash tun, or some details? I know the local homebrew store sells cooler mash tuns, but I'm not sure on that process.
 
There's a few great builds on here. This one is probably the simplest:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/cheap-easy-10-gallon-rubbermaid-mlt-conversion-23008/

The 10 gallon cooler is ~42 at Home Depot, the rest of the stuff is maybe $20 more. I built a copper manifold on mine, so that added another $25 or so. Search around on the forums and you'll find a bunch of helpful builds with pictures.

As for this batch, just let it ferment out leave it...no need to dump it yet. See what it tastes like after a week or two, and I'd probably bottle it anyway, you may be surpised how it turns out.
 
I'd let it ferment out and see how it is. If nothing else, you'll get some experience with fermentation. Even if it doesn't seem great, i might still bottle at least some of it. Again, this would be a good experience - it is amazing how different beers can be after fully carbed and conditioned.

Plenty of folks do the brew in a bag technique so you don't have to go out and build a cooler mlt. I think there might be a good sticky on here somewhere about BIAB (by DeathBrewer if I recall correctly) - check it out and see if you can tweak your process for next time.
 
Buy some more grain and try this again. With BIAB you want to use the full volume of water and heat it to the proper temperature so when you add the grain it will all settle to the temperature that is proper for your mash. Make sure you stir in the grain well to keep from making doughballs and then put the lid on the kettle and wrap it in a blanket, a winter coat, or a sleeping bag and ignore it for an hour. With the full volume of water plus all the grain the temperature won't change very much over the course of an hour. If your grain is crushed or ground fine like it should be for brew in a bag, your conversion may be done in only 15 minutes so even if you lose 5 degrees over that hour, you will have all your conversion anyway.
 

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