Yeast terminology confusion

Noob here. I have Papazian's JOHB 3rd edition and it seems very vague and confusing on certain parts of dealing with yeast.

1) What is the difference between culturing and propagating yeast?

2) can I take a bottle of WhiteLabs WLP001 (liquid) yeast and (not sure of the terminology) make multiple "5-gallon pitching amounts" in different containers that I can store in my refrigerator so I don't have to buy new yeast each time?

Not exactly sure about #1.

#2 - I've never done it that way but I'm sure it's possible. I usually wash the yeast left over in the primary and divide it between 4-5 jars. To use it again I just create a starter to get it up to the cell count I need. There's a sticky thread about yeast washing in this section.

A yeast culture is a sample that can be propagated in a starter for pitching into a batch of wort.

Yes, you can use a tube of yeast and make slants from it, which would be cultures for future use. Or you could make a starter and split the slurry into sterile jars for future use.

je52rm said:

Noob here. I have Papazian's JOHB 3rd edition and it seems very vague and confusing on certain parts of dealing with yeast.

1) What is the difference between culturing and propagating yeast?

2) can I take a bottle of WhiteLabs WLP001 (liquid) yeast and (not sure of the terminology) make multiple "5-gallon pitching amounts" in different containers that I can store in my refrigerator so I don't have to buy new yeast each time?

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1) Very similar. I interpret culturing as a process to maintain a library or to identify a unique strain. Propogating is any process used to increase cell numbers, usually in a liquid medium.

2) Yes. There are methods on here for washing, or just store it under the "beer". There are also methods for deep freezing using Glycol

ok cool that definitely sheds some light on the situation. So if I make a starter that i intend on splitting the slurry into more than one portion.....

A) Do I add the whole amount of the vial of yeast to the initial starter?

B) How many "slurry portions" can i make off this starter? is there a specific amount (fluid ounces) of slurry that will be optimal for each sterile container?

C)Will these "slurry portions" then be put in a new starter when needed for pitching?

je52rm said:

ok cool that definitely sheds some light on the situation. So if I make a starter that i intend on splitting the slurry into more than one portion.....

A) Do I add the whole amount of the vial of yeast to the initial starter?

B) How many "slurry portions" can i make off this starter? is there a specific amount (fluid ounces) of slurry that will be optimal for each sterile container?

C)Will these "slurry portions" then be put in a new starter when needed for pitching?

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A) You would want to split the vial into the maximum number of starters you want to store. You want to avoid re-re-repitching. Most micro labs max out their cultures to 5 passages, or transfers.

B) I am sure there is an optimal amount. Theoretically, you could put one yeast cell into each starter and, with optimal conditions (pH, O2, nutrients, stirring) you could reach a pitchable amount. I recently cultured the Sierra Nevada Pale Ale Yeast sediment from 1 Bottle in 1 quart wort. Granted it took a while for me to see some activity.

C) Depends on how many cells you end up with and how long it was stored for.

would it be easier (since i only ferment in one primary glass carboy and no secondary) to just wash the yeast out of the leftover sediment in my primary and not even worry about splitting starters with my new vial of yeast and such? I don't stray much from my normal recipes as I am a brown Ale fanatic so most likely I would be using the washed yeast for the same style Ale it was washed from. Typically WLP005 for Brown Ales

je52rm said:

would it be easier (since i only ferment in one primary glass carboy and no secondary) to just wash the yeast out of the leftover sediment in my primary and not even worry about splitting starters with my new vial of yeast and such? I don't stray much from my normal recipes as I am a brown Ale fanatic so most likely I would be using the washed yeast for the same style Ale it was washed from. Typically WLP005 for Brown Ales

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That's is a matter of personal preference. With my method, you have X number of starters that are ready to go.

With your method, you have to lug around a glass carboy and collect sediment, wash the yeast, aliquot the washed yeast, AND make starter wort each time. Not to mention, now your yeast is on its Third passage, with lots of possible routes of contamination and mutation/gene expression changes. In addition, I would venture to say that yeast will hold up better stored under beer rather than water or saline.

Which brings up the topic of how long you plan on storing the yeast in the refrigerator?

But don't take my word for it. Whatever works for you!

medusa1066 said:

That's is a matter of personal preference. With my method, you have X number of starters that are ready to go.

With your method, you have to lug around a glass carboy and collect sediment, wash the yeast, aliquot the washed yeast, AND make starter wort each time. Not to mention, now your yeast is on its Third passage, with lots of possible routes of contamination and mutation/gene expression changes. In addition, I would venture to say that yeast will hold up better stored under beer rather than water or saline.

Which brings up the topic of how long you plan on storing the yeast in the refrigerator?

But don't take my word for it. Whatever works for you!

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Oh so I guess I was still a bit confused hahahahahha I'm a noob! So u are saying that if I take a vial of WLP005 liquid yeast and split it into let's say 4 clean sanitized beer bottles or mason jars with sterile wort cooled to pitching temp that those individual bottles can then be pitched directly into 5-gallons wort without having to put them with a starter? It will typically be about every 2-3 weeks (sometimes a month) That I'll do a new batch. Bigtime thanks for the help!

The sanitized mason jars with wort ARE your starters! After, adding part of the vial and growing/swirling for a couple days, you will see bubbles, krausen, and sediment. I usually pitch the resulting sediment off of combined (2) quart mason jars per batch. After sitting in the fridge, there will be a light cream layer (live yeast) and an increasing peanut butter color layer (dead yeast/waste). The longer it sits in the fridge, your yeast start dying so keep this in mind. Let us know if you need more assitance. We are all noobs; the wise man realizes he knows nothing.

medusa1066 said:

The sanitized mason jars with wort ARE your starters! After, adding part of the vial and growing/swirling for a couple days, you will see bubbles, krausen, and sediment. I usually pitch the resulting sediment off of combined (2) quart mason jars per batch. After sitting in the fridge, there will be a light cream layer (live yeast) and an increasing peanut butter color layer (dead yeast/waste). The longer it sits in the fridge, your yeast start dying so keep this in mind. Let us know if you need more assitance. We are all noobs; the wise man realizes he knows nothing.

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Awesome! I'm getting it slowly but surely hahahahahaha. One last question and I'll leave ya alone for today (yeah right! Hahahahaha endless search for knowledge)

Once I let the mason jars sit for a couple days after putting yeast into each and there's krausen and activity inside them do I decant (pour off) all the liquid off of 2 mason jars and just pitch the "bottom sediment" into 5-gallons wort or do I wanna try and swirl the entire liquid contents (or part) of the 2 mason jars into the 5-gallons wort?

If storing the yeast, store it under beer. If pitching, I have heard both ways. Personally, I decant the liquid off the sediment, leaving only enough liquid to thoroughly swirl the yeast into solution.

Not to confuse you, but after some reading it appears that people pitch yeast that has been washed and stored. I generally thought that yeast needed to be in an active growth phase, but maybe it is just the quantity that is important. Just do what is convenient.

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Mrmalty.com

-d