Munich Helles BierMunchers “Helles Belles” (Munich Helles, AG)

Gonna brew this one tomorrow with halertau. Didn't find time to make a starter this week, made it this morning. Debating whether it's worth pitching since I usually decant. I made the starter with extra light DME, but this is a delicate beer. Should I pitch the whole 1L starter of WLP029 or save it for a brew Tues (when i can decant) and pitch nottingham?

EDIT: Problem solved; I forgot about my wheat pale fermented with WLP029 that I will transfer to secondary (dryhop) and pitch slurry. I usually dryhop right in the primary and toss yeast when i rack to the keg. My starter will be ready for a brew on Tuesday. I'm thinking altbier or a hoppy session...

I want to make this one soon. I like the idea of brewing it more like an ale since I've never prepped for lager temps before.

My question is I'd like to save a little money on buying another yeast strain. What do folks think about using WLP036 alt yeast for this one? I mean I know I'll get beer, but would this strain really take it out of the Helles range?

That is pretty much the same yeast as the original recipe calls for. Really this is closer to a Kolsh then a helles

I was shocked at how dark this turned out compared to when I transferred it into the fermentor. I was also surprised at how hoppy the hydrometer sample was. Then it dawned on me that this was probably the IPA that I brewed the same day and I had labelled the fermentors wrong. If anyone has always wanted to know what this beer would taste like dry hopped with 1.5 oz of Centennial, I'll be able to tell you in a couple of days. I got it off the hops after 3 days. The hydrometer sample didn't seem to have too much hops presence, but until it's carb'ed I won't be able to give an accurate review.

Its my first time brewing a psuedo-lager. Do I need to do a diacetyl rest? Warm back up to room temp for a few days? Or can I keg after 2-3 weeks and lager? I'm fermenting at roughly 52degrees. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

fedagentbeer said:

Its my first time brewing a psuedo-lager. Do I need to do a diacetyl rest? Warm back up to room temp for a few days? Or can I keg after 2-3 weeks and lager? I'm fermenting at roughly 52degrees. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

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What yeast are you using?
Would be a bit cold for an ale yeast.

thanks Kevin

If you are going to use the Kolsch yeast I would ferment it at about 60 deg f then transfer to a keg and and condition it for 2 to 3 weeks.

I'm using the kolsch yeast.. I'll warm it up closer to 60?

crazyirishman34 said:

If you are going to use the Kolsch yeast I would ferment it at about 60 deg f then transfer to a keg and and condition it for 2 to 3 weeks.

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+1 - I just kegged 5 gallons of this last weekend, very tasty! The kolsch yeast performs well for this grain bill. I fermented this one in my basement which was about 59/60 ambient - Came out pretty clean with just a little bit of sulfur to it. After a week of cold conditioning it's starting to clear and the residual sulfur has pretty much faded. 1 more week and this beer will be as clean as a lager!

I would mash this at 150 and use 1/2 pound of melanoiden malt instead of the Munich and Vienna.

hey guys, im about to brew this recipe this weekend but a larger batch of it (250L or 66gal).
I have some issues though because scaling the recipe in Beersmith got the software to tell me I need 9 packages of WLP029 with a 4L starter each, meaning a total of 36L starters. that sounds alot to me..
The guy at the local store who sells ingredients to most microbreweries near Montreal said 4 packages with a 2L starter each should do but I dont know what to think..
Anyone who has brewed this recently with WLP029 can give me some advice?
Thanks!

g0ldo said:

hey guys, im about to brew this recipe this weekend but a larger batch of it (250L or 66gal).
I have some issues though because scaling the recipe in Beersmith got the software to tell me I need 9 packages of WLP029 with a 4L starter each, meaning a total of 36L starters. that sounds alot to me..
The guy at the local store who sells ingredients to most microbreweries near Montreal said 4 packages with a 2L starter each should do but I dont know what to think..
Anyone who has brewed this recently with WLP029 can give me some advice?
Thanks!

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Never did a batch that big but I would do one pack to every 10 gallons with 2L starter each. Just my thoughts

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Are you using a stored starter? If so Mr Malty says you new a 21L starter with 14 vials. You could start with a 2L starter and 1 vial. Then step it to a 5L starter then to a 11L starter then to a 21L starter. That way you wouldn't spend $70+ on yeast alone. Just an FYI German brewing schools teach a 4 fold increase when you are propagating yeast.

What about dry yeast? Would be 17 packs.

Brewed 10 gallons of this yesterday. Split the batch into 5 fermenters. Pitch a slurry of 029 from a blonde into one and have it bubbling away @ 62 degrees. Got the other half in the 50 degree fermentation chamber with some WLP833. We'll see how the kolsch version compares to a lager version in a month or so.

Brewed 10 gallons of this today. Pitched Wyeast's Munich Lager going to give it about 12 hours to get going then move into the lager chamber at 48-52 degrees. I'm super excited!\

cannot pass on a BM recipe! all the stuff ordered!

I just have to say thankyou BierMuncher for this awesome recipe. Brewed 5 gals for a crawfish boil and it was a big hit. I'm not usually a light beer drinker, but I loved this beer. Planning to brew again shortly...

So after 14 days at 50 degrees I did about four days at 68 for the dialectal rest. On Saturday I moved the beer to a secondary and stored in an empty fridge. I also tasted it and I have to admit I really want to drink this right now. Exactly what I'm looking for during the summer months. A nice light beer with flavor! Oh well.

I need five gallons in a month so I'll keg half and leave the other half in cold storage till Mid July.

Doug36854 said:

Brewed 10 gallons of this yesterday. Split the batch into 5 fermenters. Pitch a slurry of 029 from a blonde into one and have it bubbling away @ 62 degrees. Got the other half in the 50 degree fermentation chamber with some WLP833. We'll see how the kolsch version compares to a lager version in a month or so.

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Let us know how it turns out. The wl 833 is my favorite yeast for my lagers. It has a nice malty backbone that is perfect for a Helles.


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Brewed this yesterday. End up with a 1.043 OG. Used 1 tablet of whirlfloc for a 5 gallon batch and the hydrometer sample was frikkin clear. Can't wait to try this one!

Made a double batch (two 6 gallon) and used WhiteLabs WPL029 German Ale/ Kolsch Yeast for the first 6 gallons which turned out great! The other half is still lagering with WHiteLabs WPL860 Munich Helles Yeast which I can't wait to try. Thanks for the recipe! The pic goes on my tap handle.

i made this two weeks ago and its been sitting in primary for the full two weeks, going to rack it today into secondary, then keg it this weekend. I havent stopped craving Helles since this time last year when I spent 3 glorious nights in Munich. Hopefully this one comes close to it. This will be my 4th German style beer, and I've used BeerSmith to create a Munich water profile. When talking with the people in Munich, they claim that its the minerality of the water that makes the beer...lets hope so! Cheers!

HotlantaGuy
***HackerPschorr Weiss clone on tap/Helles Belles in Primary/Secondary/Graduation Ale in Secondary. Next up: HackerPschorr Weiss clone V2, Kolsch, Steveriski's RIS w/ bourbon barrel & vanilla beans

Just purchased the Tower of Power....and this will be my first brew with it!!

I'm also using WLP860 Munich Helles yeast and laggering.

Since I can step mash, any suggestions on temps/times?

Protein Rest: 122° F for 20 minutes
Beta Sacch’ Rest: 149° F for 30 minutes
Alpha Sacch’ Rest: 158 F for 30 minutes
Mashout: 170° F for 10 minutes


Does that look good?

Just kegged it.End up at a FG of 1.007. will put on gas in the basement until I have a free spot in the keezer.

I'm planning on a double brew day in a couple weeks - brewing this and an Oktoberfest. Would I have any negative effects if I followed the fermentation schedule of the Oktoberfest?

65 degrees - 1 week
60 degrees - 2 weeks
crash cool for 3 days @39

lhd7osc said:

Just purchased the Tower of Power....and this will be my first brew with it!!

I'm also using WLP860 Munich Helles yeast and laggering.

Since I can step mash, any suggestions on temps/times?

Protein Rest: 122° F for 20 minutes
Beta Sacch’ Rest: 149° F for 30 minutes
Alpha Sacch’ Rest: 158 F for 30 minutes
Mashout: 170° F for 10 minutes


Does that look good?

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If you aren't using floor malted or undermodified malts I would just go to a Beta Sacch rest for 40min then the Alpha for 20 min.

Thanks Crazy Irishman. I ended up keeping it simple. I mashed in at 154 for 90 minutes and a 10 minute 170 Mash-out. Hit ALL my numbers....very excited about this beer.

lhd7osc said:

Thanks Crazy Irishman. I ended up keeping it simple. I mashed in at 154 for 90 minutes and a 10 minute 170 Mash-out. Hit ALL my numbers....very excited about this beer.

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Sounds like it will be a good beer. I normally do my helles with the above mash schedule. But I just use Pilsner and a touch of melanioden malt.

48 hrs on the gas, taste is really good but the beer is cloudy, wonder if I should gelatin it or just let it go...

icebob said:

48 hrs on the gas, taste is really good but the beer is cloudy, wonder if I should gelatin it or just let it go...

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What yeast strand did you use?


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Gelatin won't hurt if you get it down around 31f before you add the gelatin it will knock out the chill haze

Brewed a modified Partial Mash version of this, just tried the first preview of it a week in the bottle and it came out fantastic. In case anyone's curious, for a 5.5 gal batch:

3lbs Briess Pilsen DME

3lbs Best Malz Pilsner (1.3 SRM)
1lb Best Malz Munich (6.5 SRM)

Mashed @152 for 60 min

.6oz Santiam Hops @ 60 min (7.2%)

Wyeast 1007

14 Days @ 61 degrees, 14 days at 42 degrees, Gelatin after a week at 42deg.

Wyeast 1007 worked great, as did the Santiam hops and the partial mash. Since the original had 10L Munich and Vienna I decided to split the difference with a pound of light munich. May try light munich+vienna next time. It came out great either way.

Thanks for the recipe!

I made a beer very similar last week :

10 gallon batch
15# pilsner malt
2# munich malt
.5# carafoam

60min mash at 150F

90min boil
2oz tettnang @60min
1oz saphir @60min
4oz sahpir @hopstand

I made a starter of Wyeast 1007 and pitched at around 58F, its been fermenting at 58 for a week now and looks wonderful.

My first time using pilsner malt, german hops and german yeast stoked to taste the results.

If you can do a 20min rest at 122f you won't need to dextrin malt and it will have better foam retention. Also I would sub the Munich for .25# of melanoiden malt or do at least one decoction.

For a Helles just use a small bittering chare at 60min. The late hop additions would be more appropriate for a pilsner.

I brewed this yesterday. Fourth AG batch. Still fighting with efficiency, and figuring out proper water volumes.

2.5 gallon batch

5 lb Cargill Pilsner Malt
.25 lb Briess Bonlander Munich Malt
.25 lb Briess Goldpils Vienna Malt
.12 lb Briess Carapils Malt
.75 oz Tettnang Hops
90 minute mash that started at 154 degrees. Ended up at 147 degrees 90 minutes later.
90 minute boil. I boiled off too much and had to add back .75 gallons to get to 2.5 in fermenter.
OG - 1040
1 pack Wyeast 2565 Kolsch pitched today @ 60 degrees.

There is tons of trub. I don't generally bother with filtering it out before it hits the primary. That may bite me this time. Hope it settles out, a lot.

phyllobeddo said:

I brewed this yesterday. Fourth AG batch. Still fighting with efficiency, and figuring out proper water volumes.

2.5 gallon batch

5 lb Cargill Pilsner Malt
.25 lb Briess Bonlander Munich Malt
.25 lb Briess Goldpils Vienna Malt
.12 lb Briess Carapils Malt
.75 oz Tettnang Hops
90 minute mash that started at 154 degrees. Ended up at 147 degrees 90 minutes later.
90 minute boil. I boiled off too much and had to add back .75 gallons to get to 2.5 in fermenter.
OG - 1040
1 pack Wyeast 2565 Kolsch pitched today @ 60 degrees.

There is tons of trub. I don't generally bother with filtering it out before it hits the primary. That may bite me this time. Hope it settles out, a lot.

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Queasy 2565 takes a little longer to clear out than wl 029. You'll probably have to add some findings and eventually keg and lager it out.

Just made 5 gallons using WLP029. Love this yeast in other beers. Takes a long time to drop but worth the wait. What I forgot to do was cut my hops in half on this recipe and now have a bitter Helles to enjoy over the winter. Not what I expected but tasty. Mashed at 155 and has a wonderful malty backbone with the fruity 029 Complimenting the bitterness and malt.
Not exactly what I was going for but ended up a great beer in the end.

Brewed this up today! I'm treating it as a lager (WY2206) though and used a step mash schedule that I found in a BYO article:

15 mins @ 105°F (was supposed to be 100°F)
30 mins @ 122°F
15 mins @ 146°F
15 mins @ 156°F

I would have done a mash out, but decided to do another mini-mash with the grains which yielded another 1.5 gallons at 1.041. One gallon of that will get WY2565 (Kolsch) if I can revive my old harvest and the remaining half gallon got WLP830.

Has anyone tried making this with a dry yeast? If so which variety?

*Sorry, haven't scanned through 12 pages

Just finished this and after 2 weeks of lagering, I transferred to keg under 12 psi, adding gelatin. It's been sitting in the keg for about a week under pressure, and is brilliantly clear. The only thing is, I haven't had a helles before, and it seems a bit too much on the sweet/malty side. Is this typical of the style? Will this fade with more lagering time? With that said, it is absolutley delicious, I just don't know if I could drink more than a couple pints, without the maltiness getting in the way.