Smokinghole's Imperial Stout

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smokinghole

Senior Member
HBT Supporter
Joined
Nov 11, 2009
Messages
2,910
Reaction score
146
Location
Lucid Dream Land
Recipe Type
All Grain
Yeast
Wyeast 9097
Yeast Starter
YES
Batch Size (Gallons)
8
Original Gravity
1.117
Final Gravity
1.026
Boiling Time (Minutes)
200+
IBU
110
Color
80
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp)
45 Days at 68
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp)
260 days at 68
Tasting Notes
Rich stout that develops into roasty dark fruit flavors.
Ingredients
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
24 lbs Maris Otter (Thomas Fawcett) (3.0 SRM) Grain 1 70.6 %
5 lbs 8.0 oz Brown Malt (65.0 SRM) Grain 2 16.2 %
2 lbs 8.0 oz Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM) Grain 3 7.4 %
2 lbs Wheat, Midnight (550.0 SRM) Grain 4 5.9 %
5.00 oz Calypso [12.00 %] - First Wort 180.0 min Hop 5 116.5 IBUs
2.0 pkg SafAle English Ale (DCL/Fermentis #S-04) [23.66 ml] Yeast 6 -
1.5 pkg Old Ale Blend (Wyeast Labs #9097-PC) [50.00 ml] Yeast 7 -
1.0 pkg Edinburgh Ale (White Labs #WLP028) [35.49 ml] Yeast 8 -

Beer Profile

Est Original Gravity: 1.120 SG Measured Original Gravity: 1.120 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.036 SG Measured Final Gravity: 1.026 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 11.2 % Actual Alcohol by Vol: 12.6 %
Bitterness: 116.5 IBUs Calories: 432.1 kcal/12oz
Est Color: 79.2 SRM
Mash Profile

Mash Name: Single Infusion, Full Body, No Mash Out Total Grain Weight: 34 lbs
Sparge Water: 7.63 gal Grain Temperature: 72.0 F
Sparge Temperature: 168.0 F Tun Temperature: 72.0 F
Adjust Temp for Equipment: FALSE Mash PH: 5.20

Mash Steps
Name Description Step Temperature Step Time
Mash In Add 8.50 gal of water at 173.7 F 158.0 F 60 min

Sparge Step: Fly sparge with 7.63 gal water at 168.0 F
Mash Notes: Simple single infusion mash for use with most modern well modified grains (about 95% of the time).


I used a blend of yeast in this beer because I wanted the esters from the SO4, the fermentation and alcohol handling of the WLP028, and the brett from my small amount of very old slurry from the 11-11-11 Old Ale. The esters from the SO4 will be reduced and reused by the brett so I wanted the character contributed by SO4 in this high gravity beer. This beer has been an evolution from complex grist with some caramel malts, to this much simpler grist with no caramel malts. The boil is variable for me. I base my sparge volume on my refractometer. If I'm getting low numbers I sparge more (even at the end with this much grain I was getting just under 10 brix) and then just let it boil longer. I gave up adding hops at the end due to the extended fermenation using the brett. I used hops that I had available but any hops you like could be used for bittering due to the long boil not much flavor will remain. Please note the high mash temp. This coupled with the black malt and long boil should provide enough residual non-fermentable sugars to leave you a brett stout that drinks like a very thick full bodied stout.

Edit: If you cannot source any 9097 then I am told that the blend just contained what is basically a healthy English strain and brett lambicus.
 
It is thick and black. My recipe two years ago was the last with caramel malts, this is the current brew that I am getting ready to dig into. The beer is very good, has a nice smooth roast flavor with a balanced bitterness. There are some pie cherry flavors from the brett but it just isn't 100% carbed (yep bottle conditioned, I love bottle conditioned beer).
 
I am just itching to brew a giant RIS. I like the idea of Brett mingling with the malt richness and nice warming sensation from the alcohol. How cold will you chill it before you pitch the yeast and how will you keep it from tasting "hot?" Every time I've tried to brew a beer with that high an alcohol percentage it's had a harsh alcohol burn.
 
I brew it and ferment it in fall through the winter. Then the high mash temp keeps the saccharomyces from going nuts on all the sugar. The vigorous initial fermentation is carried out starting at about 62 and after 7 days that is sitting at just 50% attenuation due to the mash temp. Then the remainder is slowly fermented via brett and the yeasts that can ferment maltotriose sugars and other more complex stuff that is longer than two glucose molecules.

The other thing is maybe I can't taste the hot alcohol flavor since I like to drink strong cocktails.
 
I was reading Jamil Zainasheff's column in Brew Your Own magazine on Barley Wine. He suggests using a lower mash temp on beers with higher gravities to produce a more fermentable wort. I suppose the solvent taste comes from fermenting the wort at too high a temperature, but I always use a temperature controlled fridge. I think my problem comes with the spike in temperature during the peak of fermentation
 
A lower mash temp on a high gravity is what I'd advise also if not using brettanomyces in the mix. However when using brettanomyces I got an additional 15%-20% attenuation. So if you mash for 70-75% attenuation only saccharomyces by using a lower mash temp you risk drying the beer out and greatly enhancing the alcohol flavor. The alcohol flavor is slightly masked by the residual extract from the high mash temp that leaves a relatively high terminal gravity even when using brett.
 
I wonder if the terminal gravity wasn't where u wanted it to be even after the Brett did its thing... Maybe if you pitched some lager yeast into it that would drop the terminal gravity even further. But in a beer that style maybe a higher terminal gravity isn't such a bad thing
 
I highly doubt that a lager yeast will take it any further than a brettanomyces strain. Typically speaking the lager yeast can ferment up to and including maltotriose sugars, and some brettanomyces can go futher and take down cellobiose or trehalose and in some cases lactose. Lager yeasts do not have the enzymes necessary to break those bonds and some brettanomyces species have those enzymes. This is a case of hope the brett doesn't take it too far, but this is third year I've been running with this yeast. I have become fairly familiar with the ability of the yeast. If it ends up low in gravity you could always make a small highish gravity 2 gal of wort and boil it down to a syrup to create caramelized sugars that the brettanomyces shouldn't be able to consume in order to bring up your terminal gravity. The issue with that wort addition is it adds like 5-6 months to your fermentation. If you don't want to wait that long you can guesstimate the sugar contribution a use it for bottle conditioning instead.
 
Any update on the progress of the crystal-less malt bill and how it compares to the older versions? How long do you generally leave the brett to work before bottling?

In case anyone is interested, I contacted Wyeast about the 9097 blend. Apparently, the blend changes a bit each time it's released, but it's basically just a mix of 1084 and 5526. Using a smack pack of each ought to get you, more or less, the same results as 9097.
 
The beer is coming along great. I have it sitting in a 15gal barrel right now. It's roasty and very bitter still but the flavors are coming around nicely. Has a strong coffee component and there is certainly a strong sweet malt character.

I tend to leave it for about 6-8 months before I think about bottling. Last I checked the gravity was near 1.032 but seems to have mostly stopped there. The three year old stout is on the sweeter side of things now but that also used some jaggery sugar so it has a molasses sweetness. Last year's is pretty nice, they're boozy brews but the roastiness helps cover it up.
 
I just saw the barrel in the other thread - looks awesome! I found this as I actually was wondering if brett would work in an RIS, and now I know. I got the idea when I found out how much cherry flavor Wyeast's BrettL throws is you handle it well, and thought it might be an interesting way to make a big "cherry" stout, which the fiancee loves.

In any case, I think I'll have to try a variation on this at some point soon. It's getting a bit warm for big beers now, considering my lack of easy temp control, but come autumn...this is gonna get brewed!
 
Well, my basement is at 65-66F or so, and should hold steady for the next month or two before slowly warming up to 70-75F. Have you fermented this that warm? I was initially afraid high gravity plus mid to high 60s ambient temps might make for (bad) funky beer. I suppose I could start with 1762, which does OK up to the low to mid 70s, and hit it with brett separately after that. Do you think that would work, or would that yeast clash with the recipe as drawn up?
 
I recall it being quite warm when I brewed this in October. I had over 15 gal fermenting with no temp control. I don't see 70s as a problem, I done know much about the yeast you listed, but I used some left over 9097 slurry for the Brett and then some packets of S04. I am already looking forward to brewing the next batch in fall.
 
I'm starting to bottle the batch that was barrel aged. I think it's my best version to date. You can smell the rummy sweetness in the beer as well as the vanillin contributed by the charred barrel. I only had it in the barrel for about 4.5 months. I had done three good hot rinses before I even put the beer into the barrel to remove some character to the point I wouldn't have to remove the beer from the barrel in two weeks time. I've broken down and just gave up on bottle conditioning this beer. I am sure I could do it but the work required to do it successfully is much more than just force carbing the beer and using my beer gun to bottle.

I am actually drinking a version that was brewed in 2011 and it's drinking nice. It has a nice mouth feel with a slight astringency that dries the mouth preventing the sweetness from the 1.024 terminal gravity from being cloying. There's still a decent bitterness remaining from the hops. My friend and I are talking about making some plans to do another batch this fall. This time it will just be about 8 gallons since now I have at least a case of three year old stuff, I have a case of two year old stuff. Then there will be a touch more than six cases of the barrel aged version to go around. Plus I have 15 gal of sour 1.090 stout in the barrel that had the last 1.120 brett stout batch aging.

Anyhow I encourage the patient ones to brew something similar to this brew it's rewarding.
 
I hear you and do want to try it, but I don't have kegging equipment yet. I'm taking your warning against bottle conditioning seriously, and kind of want to hold off until I can get the kegs going. Of course, that takes $$$, and who knows when I'll have that. :D
 
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