Sweet Stout Deception Cream Stout

I did 4 weeks in primary, 4 weeks kegged, and it was good to go.

That was the first keg...

The second one (it was a 10 gal batch) is still aging

Craig, checkout the first post

wookiemofo said:

Do the majority of people secondary this? I was going to just leave it in primary for 4 weeks...

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I didn't even do that. Primary for two, secondary for one on some espresso beans. Then off to the keg with it.

This is on the calendar for another batch. My keg's almost kicked, and I want more.

Hannable1975 said:

Well - 2 points - 1) It was all I could do not to open another one on the spot - it was good. and 2) I'm about to go to the AHS site and order the fixings for another batch! ( This will be the first brew I have made twice - but do not want to risk waking up one day to find I do not have any on hand!)

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Waiting for this on is going to be a bit tough... I just brewed this (AG version) over the weekend and it smelled fantastic brewing, and the pre & post boil samples I took for gravity both tasted like it's going to be a FANTASTIC beer.

Pitched Saturday afternoon and saw some bubblies this morning in the blowoff container.

CA-LT1 said:

Craig, checkout the first post

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So funny, I knew I saw it somewhere when I was reading through this a week or so ago - but I immediately looked at the type and it said "all grain" so I just skipped on without reading further.

Sorry about that! Thanks for the reference - I want to get this one brewed here in the next few days but will probably have to wait until this weekend. I was thinking 2 in primary, 1 in secondary and bottle for 2-3. Sound about right?

wookiemofo said:

Do the majority of people secondary this? I was going to just leave it in primary for 4 weeks...

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Yes, no point in putting it in a secondary because the beer is pitch black.

Awesome recipe. Even straight out of the fermenter I was already enjoying it!

How does this compare to something like a Left Hand Milk Stout? I've been looking all over for a PM Left Hand Clone but this looks good too. I've got to hurry and get something dark and delicious in the pipe for the cold months ahead.

ubermick said:

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Just the label on that bottle makes me want to try it. mmm chocolate.

knotquiteawake said:

How does this compare to something like a Left Hand Milk Stout? I've been looking all over for a PM Left Hand Clone but this looks good too. I've got to hurry and get something dark and delicious in the pipe for the cold months ahead.

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Most commercial milk stouts have a more "milky" flavor IMHO. I would guess that they use more like the equivilant of 1 lb / 5 gallons. If you are going with that much lactose, I would probably use a reliable attenuator like Wyeast 1028.

abazin said:

I'm planning to brew this soon. When I plug in 0.75 oz of Magnum pellets at 13.4AA and a 60 minute boil into Beer Alchemy, I get 44 IBUs. I double checked with an online calculator and got a similar result. The recipe says 27 IBU. Is my software wrong? Should I be shooting for 27 IBU, or just use roughly 0.75 oz of Magnum?

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Yep. That is a mistake. I did this with a roughly 4.5 gallon boil orignially. If you are doing this full-boil, adjust accordingly to get to about 30 IBU.

NCBeernut said:

Here is your grain bill for 60% eff:

2 lb Light/Extra Light DME
1.5 lb Wheat DME
3.5 lb Pale Malt (MO, Am 2-row, etc)
1 lb Crystal 60
0.75 lb Chocolate Malt
0.5 lb Roasted Barley
0.5 lb Lactose

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I want to do this as my first partial mash in my new 5 gallon beverage cooler (was using my bottling bucket wrapped in a blanket before). Since i've never done a mash in my cooler I have no idea what my efficiency would be, would this grain bill be a safe bet? Also, was thinking of upping the lactose to .75 to get somewhere between this and a commercial milk stout.

I have a half batch of this boiling away on my stove, thanks to Death Brewer's "Stove Top All Grain" Method. I tasted the wort and honestly wanted to start drinking there and then. Then I realized, I'll just be full and not drunk. I think I'll wait.

knotquiteawake said:

I want to do this as my first partial mash in my new 5 gallon beverage cooler (was using my bottling bucket wrapped in a blanket before). Since i've never done a mash in my cooler I have no idea what my efficiency would be, would this grain bill be a safe bet? Also, was thinking of upping the lactose to .75 to get somewhere between this and a commercial milk stout.

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Your efficiency is going depend a lot on your tun design and how you sparge. Like you said the best way to know is to test it out. Before I moved to all-grain, I did PMs using brew-in-a-bag with a small 2 gallon rubbermaid cooler that could accomodate about 4.5lb of grain. I double batch sparged and got about 75% efficiency. YMMV.

Basically going to be doing one of these

but with a 5 gallon instead of a 10 gallon cooler.
I'm not too savvy with picking a grain bill so thats why I was wondering what to start out with to try and make this. Since the one you posted earlier was for 60% I think maybe it would be a safe one to start out with, if my efficiency is low than I'm safe, if its higher then I get a stronger beer. Right?

Yeah. And there is nothing wrong with that! I actually use the exact same design, but I have a 48qt rectangular cooler and I have always gotten about 75% efficiency. BTW, I haven't done the math, but you might be able to do this all-grain with a 5 gallon cooler assuming 75% efficency.

I hadn't even thought about that! Maybe Allgrain is closer than I thought... According to BobbyM here https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/how-big-your-mash-tun-needs-123585/
I should be able to fit about 12lbs of grain in my 5 gallon cooler.
However, the only hangup I have is that I have only a 5 gallon pot, so I am limited to about 3 gallon boils.

Sounds like it's time for a new pot! I use my old pot (about the same size as yours) for as my HLT. I would highly highly recommend this one:

http://www.foodservicewarehouse.com/update-international/apt-40/p4857.aspx

You may not be able to brew bigger beers yet, but your average to low gravity beers you could do AG. Once you get a good handle on it, move the hardware onto a bigger rectangular cooler and enjoy the freedom!

Since i just spent $300 on my kegging setup I don't think SWMBO will let me buy any more equipment right now (i'd need a turkey fryer to go with that pot of course!).

Is there any chance you would be able to convert the recipe to partial mash with a 70% eff? I think i want to try and brew this this weekend.

knotquiteawake said:

Since i just spent $300 on my kegging setup I don't think SWMBO will let me buy any more equipment right now (i'd need a turkey fryer to go with that pot of course!).

Is there any chance you would be able to convert the recipe to partial mash with a 70% eff? I think i want to try and brew this this weekend.

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I would just keep it the same. It really won't make much of a difference to be honest. Also, I am jealous of your kegging set-up. I am about over bottling every batch. Whenever you get the chance though, go with that pot and a Bayou Classic SP10 burner off of Amazon. It is the ultimate combo that combines both quality and price. You can get both for about $70 with free shipping.

NCBeernut said:

Whenever you get the chance though ... Bayou Classic SP10 burner off of Amazon...

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Which also happens to be on sale at the moment

So I currently have 3 gallons of this monster crazy bubbling away in me closet. I didn't have any Denny's on hand so I pitched a packet of S-05. Should be fine. So far, it's a rager!

wookiemofo said:

Which also happens to be on sale at the moment

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Just received mine a few days ago! What did you have to do to "prep" your burner? i.e. burn it with nothing on to burn off the paint? How long? Did you boil water? Or just let it burn with nothing on it?

Just wanted to give a quick thanks to those who cleared up the IBU question for me. Cheers!

craig_reed said:

Just received mine a few days ago! What did you have to do to "prep" your burner? i.e. burn it with nothing on to burn off the paint? How long? Did you boil water? Or just let it burn with nothing on it?

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The night before my first brewday with it, I hooked up some propane and made the air and gas valve adjustments to get the flame where I wanted it. After that I just used it just like normal.

Does $50+ for the ingredients for the extract sound right? Not including the hops even, I have what I need in the freezer. I was just off pricing it out from AHS and was surprised at how expensive the DME was, also I have to buy more DME than I need because of the quantities.

Oddball/rookie/Newb fermenting question for this beer...

This beer seemed to kind of abruptly go from a relatively violent fermentation - probably 2-3 bubbles per second from the blowoff tube, all kinds of swirly action in the carboy & about 3" of krausen for a solid 2 days - to a much more subdued fermentation (say 1 bubble every 10-15 seconds, & a thin creamy looking krausen) in what seemed like about 4-6 hours.

I'm not at all worried about it since it's still got 3 weeks to ferment/age before I'm going to do anything with it - but is that 'normal' for this beer/style of beer?? Just found it kinda intriguing since none of my other beers have done this...

It was kinda like all the yeast saying "Ok, that was delicious... but now I'm full and want to go take a nap." - all at once.

FWIW, I used White labs European ale (WLP011) w/ no starter. My OG was actually high (1.062) due to a slightly excessive boil off and getting better efficiency than I was expecting (77% for my second AG ever... :rockin:... but I planned for 70%...)

knotquiteawake said:

Does $50+ for the ingredients for the extract sound right? Not including the hops even, I have what I need in the freezer. I was just off pricing it out from AHS and was surprised at how expensive the DME was, also I have to buy more DME than I need because of the quantities.

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Sounds way high to me. But I don't order from AHS. How much extra DME are you getting? DME and LME is expensive. That can definitely drive up the costs. Plus, remember you are probably paying a shipping cost.

Timboosh said:

This beer seemed to kind of abruptly go from a relatively violent fermentation - probably 2-3 bubbles per second from the blowoff tube, all kinds of swirly action in the carboy & about 3" of krausen for a solid 2 days - to a much more subdued fermentation (say 1 bubble every 10-15 seconds, & a thin creamy looking krausen) in what seemed like about 4-6 hours.

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Honestly that sounds like all of my fermentations. All but my Belgian Triples and Kolschs- both of which act like they never stop fermenting.

For AHS I have to buy 5lbs for the 4.5lbs of Amber $20, and 3lbs of Wheat for the 1.5lbs of wheat $12, plus the tax and not including shipping.
Then about $9 for the grain/lactose and $8 for the yeast (with the yeast nutrient).
Then shipping.

I guess its the DME that is killing me here, most kits I've ordered for a medium gravity brew like this one have been under $50 shipped.

I swapped the 4.5 lbs of Amber for 2lbs of Extra light and then 3.5lbs of 2-row. I also figured out how to correctly add the wheat so i am buying 2lbs instead of 3 for the 1.5 that i need.
that brings the cost down to $38.
So is that swap good?
4.5 of Amber roughly = to 2lbs of extra light and 3.5lbs of 2-row? I am using the PM listed previously for that.

Sorry, to be a pest, I am just trying to nail down a good PM that I can afford for this. From what I entered into beersmith it looks like my OG is a little high and I'm not totally sure on what yeast to use since I want to lean slightly towards a milkier stout. Also I saw earlier somebody was talking about using Marris Otter? Not sure on the differences between the different base grains I guess.

BigB said:

Honestly that sounds like all of my fermentations. All but my Belgian Triples and Kolschs- both of which act like they never stop fermenting.

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Thanks Big... good to know. Seems like the few I've done so far have tapered off more slowly/gradually than this one. Guess the yeast just liked this beer - or it could be a figment of my imagination I guess.

knotquiteawake said:

Sorry, to be a pest, I am just trying to nail down a good PM that I can afford for this. From what I entered into beersmith it looks like my OG is a little high and I'm not totally sure on what yeast to use since I want to lean slightly towards a milkier stout. Also I saw earlier somebody was talking about using Marris Otter? Not sure on the differences between the different base grains I guess.

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Looks pretty good. I would probably bump up the Crystal by 2 oz and the Chocolate by 1 oz (Amber DME is roughly 90% 2 row, 5 -7% Crystal, and 2-5% Choclate or Black Patent). But overall you are pretty close. As far as the Maris Otter goes, it is actually a winter variety of 2 row. But it is nuttier and has a slightly better yield. Maris otter would probably be nice in this recipe. Yeast wise, I would go with Denny's Fav.

I still make this using Maris Otter and 1084 Irish Ale yeast ... truly the best beer I have on tap, never lasts long!! I also use Galena at FWH.

In fact I'm picking up this stuff today from American Brewmaster in Raleigh to brew tomorrow !!

Here are my ingredients for the partial mash version ...

Amount Item Type % or IBU
2.50 lb Light Dry Extract (8.0 SRM) Dry Extract 25.64 %
3.00 lb Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 30.77 %
1.50 lb White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) Grain 15.38 %
1.00 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 10.26 %
0.75 lb Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 7.69 %
0.50 lb Roasted Barley (300.0 SRM) Grain 5.13 %
0.85 oz Galena [13.00 %] (60 min) (First Wort Hop) Hops 28.9 IBU
1.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
0.50 lb Milk Sugar (Lactose) (0.0 SRM) Sugar 5.13 %

Wyeast 1084 Irish Ale Yeast

jeremysavoy said:

I still make this using Maris Otter and 1084 Irish Ale yeast ... truly the best beer I have on tap, never lasts long!! I also use Galena at FWH.

In fact I'm picking up this stuff today from American Brewmaster in Raleigh to brew tomorrow !!

Here are my ingredients for the partial mash version ...

Amount Item Type % or IBU
2.50 lb Light Dry Extract (8.0 SRM) Dry Extract 25.64 %
3.00 lb Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 30.77 %
1.50 lb White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) Grain 15.38 %
1.00 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 10.26 %
0.75 lb Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 7.69 %
0.50 lb Roasted Barley (300.0 SRM) Grain 5.13 %
0.85 oz Galena [13.00 %] (60 min) (First Wort Hop) Hops 28.9 IBU
1.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
0.50 lb Milk Sugar (Lactose) (0.0 SRM) Sugar 5.13 %

Wyeast 1084 Irish Ale Yeast

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AB was actually out of 1084 so I got London III instead ... should be interesting !!! Grains are mashing right now ...

I swamp-coolered this for the last 2 weeks at 62-64 ambient... think I'm safe to take it out now and ferment the last 2 weeks at 68 ambient? I need the swamp for a new batch.

I assume when the peak of the fermenting is happening is when the inside of the carboy has a 4-5 degree differential?

craig_reed said:

Just received mine a few days ago! What did you have to do to "prep" your burner? i.e. burn it with nothing on to burn off the paint? How long? Did you boil water? Or just let it burn with nothing on it?

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Just seeing this now. I didn't get one of the sale burners... I have a used turkey fryer. Will probably upgrade down the road!

wookiemofo said:

I swamp-coolered this for the last 2 weeks at 62-64 ambient... think I'm safe to take it out now and ferment the last 2 weeks at 68 ambient? I need the swamp for a new batch.

I assume when the peak of the fermenting is happening is when the inside of the carboy has a 4-5 degree differential?

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Yep, you are good. The yeast are just cleaning up after the orgy now.

Brewed this ! Dont have Beersmith Used 5 lbs of Amber 1 lbs of Wheat both DME .Steeped grains @156 Degrees .75 Caramel/crystal 60 L .75 Chocolate 350 srm).50 Roasted barley (300 srm).50 Lbs.Lactose at 10 min .3/4 oz of Yakima Magnum .Did use whirlfloc.Only reason didnt follow this recipe is cause had this Dme and Yaks already wasnt goin to LHBS for 1/2 of Wheat or try to get German.Anyway could some1 tell me what my og and fg might come out since I no The extra 1/2LBS Amber DME will change it!Would def. appreciate it Thanks ,Rdatsun BTW Its sitting in tub on ice ! Will post how turns out thanks.Wondering if shoulda cut back on roasted Barley