Glutenase (anyone know?)

Doing some research on the feasibility of brewing a barely based gluten-free ale using the same ingredients I always do. The problem of course is that barley contains gluten, loads of it, so my response is 'destroy it!'

Are there any known types of glutenase which are known to break-up gluten down to a reasonable level ~20-30ppm?

If those enzymes exist, what temperature/pH conditions do they require?

Are there any known labs which produce relatively cheap glutenase?

I just imagining adding the enzyme to the mash of my typical ales, and having it do it's magic. I imagine its not that easy as there seems to be no barley based gluten free beer on the market.

Any thoughts or insights would be greatly appreciated.

google for "pharmax glutenzyme"

Interestingly enough, I went to a seminar yesterday and the whole <20 ppm was brought up and truthfully, <20 ppm is still too much for a person who is celiac to consume and can be dangerous. This I heard from Dr. O'Bryan, his site is www.thedr.com he had some great information and I figured I would pass this along. Not having a gluten sensitivity or CD myself I will still attempt to brew a 100% safe beer for a person with CD.

That said, I think your best bet is to look into grains that are "safe" rather than using "unsafe" grains and altering them to a "reasonable" level, just my opinion. I've malted my own sorghum but have yet to use it (you must use a decoction) but you can get sorghum syrup commercially from http://www.midwestsupplies.com/ or http://www.austinhomebrew.com/ just to name a few.

Hope that helps and sheds some lights on the reason for going gluten free in the first place

The few celiacs who I know consider glutenzyme more hype than reality. Useful for protection from potentially contaminated foods, but not helpful with foods that normally contain gluten.

well it is my under standing that sorghum syrup is actually just a sugar, so i would think if you could actual malt a grain and use it it would be much better i have been looking into this my brother is gluten free and i am trying to made some for him.

i keep hearing of cidery tastes in gluten free beer and i would assume that is why

As someone with celiac I would also urge caution with the idea of a "reasonable" amount of gluten. Many people, including myself seem to be sensitive to even trace amounts of gluten. At the very least be sure you give the full info to anyone about to consume such a product. I get so sick from it that there is no trivial amount to me, I'd just do without rather than risk it.

I want to be able to use the enzymes around protein rest temperatures, unless I could find something that works at saccharification temperatures. With that in mind, most oral enzymes are made to work under conditions found in the body, I need something that can work under brewing conditions and completely eliminate any trace of gluten.

So far, it seems unlikely that such a compound exists.

The reason I don't want to use sorghum, is because well, it just doesn't taste like beer; which is why I'm looking into this alternate route, whereby I get to keep my recipes unchanged, and hopefully create barley based beer without gluten.

Brewster2256 said:

The reason I don't want to use sorghum, is because well, it just doesn't taste like beer; which is why I'm looking into this alternate route, whereby I get to keep my recipes unchanged, and hopefully create barley based beer without gluten.

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I really doubt you're gonna make it..... But, I appreciate your idea anyway... For me it is very clear that if there was a way to do it, some commercial brewery would already have it on the market....

Brewster2256 said:

The reason I don't want to use sorghum, is because well, it just doesn't taste like beer

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I hadn't had a beer in 6 years before I found a sorghum based one at a local off license. It was the best beer I had ever tasted!

Maybe have a 6 year hiatus from your regular drop and you'll appreciate the alternatives,

I don't actually have a problem with gluten, I'm just doing research to see if it's possible to create a beer without any. In which case, those few friends of mine that do have a problem, can join the fun.

In the November/December 2009 issue of Zymurgy Charlie Papazian wrote an artce on Gluten reduced beer, there was a lot of good information so I recommend a read when you get it as I'm sure there are a lot of AHA members on this forum. Anyway there is an enzym called "Brewers Clarex" that was able to bring down his pale ale to just under 5ppm.

is these a way to measure gluten cheaply ?

92yjeremy said:

In the November/December 2009 issue of Zymurgy Charlie Papazian wrote an artce on Gluten reduced beer, there was a lot of good information so I recommend a read when you get it as I'm sure there are a lot of AHA members on this forum. Anyway there is an enzym called "Brewers Clarex" that was able to bring down his pale ale to just under 5ppm.

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Awesome, that's exactly what I was hoping for.

There actually is a beer that uses the Brewers Clarex too:
http://www.lammsbraeu.de/index.php?id=183&L=1

In the Zymurgy article it says that the products are being distributed by White Labs, but as of yet they aren't able to get any.

My guess is that this will work really well for beers in the future, and can potentially make a lot of our lives better. But for every person that says 20 ppm is safe, there's another PhD out there saying that 1 ppm is unsafe. This whole thing would be a lot easier if there were a few more facts and lot less hearsay out there related to Celiac.

aggieotis said:

My guess is that this will work really well for beers in the future, and can potentially make a lot of our lives better. But for every person that says 20 ppm is safe, there's another PhD out there saying that 1 ppm is unsafe. This whole thing would be a lot easier if there were a few more facts and lot less hearsay out there related to Celiac.

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Totally agree with that! Not being a Celiac myself I wouldn't know how 20 ppm vs. 1 ppm would effect me. It would be nice to be able to brew like the others and use this to modify the beer, but hey, what we're doing is a niche, right? :cross: