What really constitutes a DIPA?

I've been looking at recipes on here and comparing them to what I just made, and I can't figure out at what point an IPA becomes a DIPA or an IIPA. Is it gravity? Is it grain bill? Is it IBUs?

I'm wondering partly because I think what I just bottled sits within this grey area, and if it's a DIPA that might influence the name I bestow upon it.

What is the general consensus on what makes an IIPA or a DIPA?

More particularly, my recent batch had an OG of 1.071 and an FG of 1.014. Calculated IBUs came in at 109. SRM ~ 7.2


I'd like to think that makes it a DIPA?

It seems to be pretty arbitrary. A couple local examples:

Laurelwood Workhorse IPA : 7.5% ABV, 80 IBU
Hair of the Dog Blue Dot DIPA: 7.0% ABV, 80 IBU

Off the bat, I would say your IBUs put you solidly into DIPA mode.

Anyway, the BJCP guidelines are always a useful place to look when pondering such things. http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style14.php


American IPA:
Vital Statistics: OG: 1.056 – 1.075
IBUs: 40 – 70 FG: 1.010 – 1.018
SRM: 6 – 15 ABV: 5.5 – 7.5%

Imperial IPA:
Vital Statistics: OG: 1.070 – 1.090
IBUs: 60 – 120 FG: 1.010 – 1.020
SRM: 8 – 15 ABV: 7.5 – 10%

There is definitely a little bit of crossover between the styles. You'll have some really big, really hoppy IPAs, and some drier, lower ABV Doubles, and the numbers might seem similar.

You have to judge it more based on what's in the glass. Double IPAs will have a definitely alcohol presence, IPAs might, but it won't be as strong (Neither should be assertive, just a nice warming). Doubles will be much more bitter. You're really looking for that tongue-stripping bitterness. Doubles will also be extremely hoppy. Hops should really, completely, dominate the beer.

In terms of numbers: Firestone walker Union Jack is 7.5 ABV, Green Flash IPA is 7 or 7.1%. Stone's Ruination (Double IPA) is 7.7% For me IPAs are usually under 7.5% and Doubles are usually over 8%, but there's obviously some wiggle room.

But ruination is much more bitter than a union jack, and the union jack has a more pronounced malt character. Ruination is just straight hops.

That's mostly how I think of it. Double IPAs are a showcase for hops. just all hops. IPAs, while being very hoppy, still strike a balance with the malt.

You'll just have to taste the beer. Personally I'd say that's a big IPA, not quite DIPA.

discnjh said:

Off the bat, I would say your IBUs put you solidly into DIPA mode.

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scottland said:

Personally I'd say that's a big IPA, not quite DIPA.

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Case in point.

ajbram said:

Case in point.

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But honestly, what does it matter? Call it whatever you feel like it is.

discnjh said:

But honestly, what does it matter? Call it whatever you feel like it is.

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You know, it really doesn't matter 90% of the time. I usually just write IPA and the bottling date on the cap and it's gone in a month anyways. I like to come up with clever labels for the ones I give to friends sometimes though, some of whom are beer snobs. That being said, even the BJCP guidelines show an awful lot of overlap between these two styles.

For me a DIPA needs to be at least 7.5%, leaning more toward 8%+. The more alcohol you have, the more hops you need to balance it out (usually). Just because something is highly hoped, I don't consider it a DIPA. I like to see the alcohol content to go along with it. That's my take on it.

discnjh said:

Off the bat, I would say your IBUs put you solidly into DIPA mode.

Anyway, the BJCP guidelines are always a useful place to look when pondering such things. http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style14.php


American IPA:
Vital Statistics: OG: 1.056 – 1.075
IBUs: 40 – 70 FG: 1.010 – 1.018
SRM: 6 – 15 ABV: 5.5 – 7.5%

Imperial IPA:
Vital Statistics: OG: 1.070 – 1.090
IBUs: 60 – 120 FG: 1.010 – 1.020
SRM: 8 – 15 ABV: 7.5 – 10%

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The only thing here that doesn't overlap is the ABV. 7.5% seems to be the dividing line between IPA and Imperial IPA.
OG of 1.071 - FG of 1.014 = 0.057
0.057 * 131 = 7.47%

What is trump here? ABV or IBU?

If you're slightly below the ABV range for IIPA (depending on the calculator), but well above the IBU range for IPA, which way do you go, or are you outside of style on both (not that it really matters)?

There has been a big shift in what constitutes IPA and IIPA over the years. I think many people have had their sensory systems impacted by a massive overload of hops and it takes quite a lot to impress them, which is what a lot of people brewing IIPA's are striving for, a sensory overload!

I would have no problem naming that beer a IIPA. And I can't say that IIPA should be less malty, however. I think that there can still be a balance as long as there is LOT of hop flavor to go with it, and a gravity to support them.

If you taste it and say, "Man, that is a hoppy beer!" then there ya go!

ajbram said:

What is trump here? ABV or IBU?

If you're slightly below the ABV range for IIPA (depending on the calculator), but well above the IBU range for IPA, which way do you go, or are you outside of style on both (not that it really matters)?

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Well, I would argue that 7.47 is not really outside the range. Given the approximations and assumptions that go into the % alcohol calc, saying 7.47 really isn't meaningful, because you do not have that level of accuracy. 7.5 is as accurate as you could really claim, i would think.

But anyways, lets say it was 7.4%, and the question becomes "I have a beer which doesn't fit exactly into either style, which is it." I don't see how you don't go with IIPA (if your decision is based on style guidelines), because you're very very close on alcohol for IIPA, and way off for IBU from a IPA.

EDIT: I do want to clarify that I'm not saying that decisions for what you call a beer should be based solely on BJCP guidelines. BJCP guidelines could reasonably be considered irrelevant unless you are entering a competition. My argument above is just for *IF* you view the guidelines as significant for this decision.

discnjh said:

Well, I would argue that 7.47 is not really outside the range. Given the approximations and assumptions that go into the % alcohol calc, saying 7.47 really isn't meaningful, because you do not have that level of accuracy. 7.5 is as accurate as you could really claim, i would think.

But anyways, lets say it was 7.4%, and the question becomes "I have a beer which doesn't fit exactly into either style, which is it." I don't see how you don't go with IIPA (if your decision is based on style guidelines), because you're very very close on alcohol for IIPA, and way off for IBU from a IPA.

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I agree.... and depending on the calculator you use, ABV can be over 7.5 anyways.

discnjh said:

Well, I would argue that 7.47 is not really outside the range. Given the approximations and assumptions that go into the % alcohol calc, saying 7.47 really isn't meaningful, because you do not have that level of accuracy. 7.5 is as accurate as you could really claim, i would think.

But anyways, lets say it was 7.4%, and the question becomes "I have a beer which doesn't fit exactly into either style, which is it." I don't see how you don't go with IIPA (if your decision is based on style guidelines), because you're very very close on alcohol for IIPA, and way off for IBU from a IPA.

EDIT: I do want to clarify that I'm not saying that decisions for what you call a beer should be based solely on BJCP guidelines. BJCP guidelines could reasonably be considered irrelevant unless you are entering a competition. My argument above is just for *IF* you view the guidelines as significant for this decision.

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I was just pointing out that there is some overlap between OG, FG, IBU, SRM, but no overlap in ABV, so if you want a bright-line there is it. Of course, you can always call your beer whatever you want, BJCP style guidelines are just guidelines. I'm sure measurement error makes it unlikely that we can measure to the 0.01% ABV, probably more like +/- 0.5%. There are probably lots of examples of beers that don't fit exactly into BJCP style guidelines, but it's still beer. Black IPA would fit the IPA category except for SRM, but most people would still call it an IPA.

There's also a difference in regions. West Coast IPAs are huge, extremely hoppy beers. Most of the West Coast IPAs are 7%+. Everywhere else they tend to be smaller, and a little less hoppy. Keep that in mind. My opinions are firmly based on west coast beers.

I'm curious what most people think is a good FG for a DIPA. I brewed a batch last weekend that started at 1.074 and pitched two pkgs of US-05. It's been fermenting well at 63 degrees. Down to 1.028 after 5 days (sugar addition at two days) and still has a thick krausen on top. I was shooting for a FG of 1.012.

My beer of choice are IPA's.

Out west, the DIPAs are defiantly higher in alcohol, but I often find them to be smoother/more balanced than an IPA. THe malt backbone and hops are both very in your face, but they balance each other out more than the regular IPA which I often find to be more hoppy than malty.

Just my experience/taste. Obviously there are exceptions.

buffaloipa said:

I'm curious what most people think is a good FG for a DIPA. I brewed a batch last weekend that started at 1.074 and pitched two pkgs of US-05. It's been fermenting well at 63 degrees. Down to 1.028 after 5 days (sugar addition at two days) and still has a thick krausen on top. I was shooting for a FG of 1.012.

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1.008-1.014 depending on the OG and dry hopping rates. Believe it or not more dry hopping can support a lower FG in my experience. Higher OG needs a higher FG though. I like all my doubles/imperials under 1.014-1.015 though. Any higher than that, and you'll masking the hops.