cutchemist42
Well-Known Member
They said that there is not enough cells even with the starter smack pack inside to properly innoculate a typical 5 gallon, 5% beer. Is this true?
Reading "Designing Great Beers", and had question about Wyeast yeasts...
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Hello, fellow Winnipegger.
The "smack packs" have about 100 billion cells.
Mr. Malty says you need 180 billion cells for 5.25 gallons of a 1.050 ale.
The answer is: a smack-pack probably contains enough yeast to get the job done, especially if it was produced recently and you have a relatively small beer. However, if the pack is a bit old, or if you have a bigger beer, you should make a starter. Thousands of brewers probably use no starter and feel like their beer is fine.
Personally, I would never pitch a smack-pack with no starter.
The "smack packs" have about 100 billion cells.
Mr. Malty says you need 180 billion cells for 5.25 gallons of a 1.050 ale.
The answer is: a smack-pack probably contains enough yeast to get the job done, especially if it was produced recently and you have a relatively small beer. However, if the pack is a bit old, or if you have a bigger beer, you should make a starter. Thousands of brewers probably use no starter and feel like their beer is fine.
Personally, I would never pitch a smack-pack with no starter.
Wyeast have two products an Activator and a Propagator. According to Wyeast the Activator is sufficient to inoculate a 5 gallon batch and the Propagator is not and needs a starter. Both have "smack pack" nutrients inside. I have used both with excellent success. I make 1.5 quarts of wort for both kinds. Some will say the Activator really does not need one some say all of them need a starter. I make starters, is easy and fast and fun
cutchemist42
Well-Known Member
Just curious then, how does a starter increase the capability of yeast? Like will a starter take a smack packed Wyeast pack and increase the year past 100 billion?
A starter is a medium to grow more yeast cells in.
That's exactly what a starter does. If you are a really new brewer consider dry yeast to make things easy for your first few batches.
paulster2626
Well-Known Member
Dry yeast is your best friend right now.
But you can even get a little saucy and make a mini-starter for the dry stuff, so you get a feel for larger ones with liquid yeast. At the very least you'll confirm that your dry yeast is alive, and you won't get those "did I pitch dead yeast" thoughts running through your head when your wort doesn't start fermenting right away.
cutchemist42
Well-Known Member
I've actually been brewing for about 2 years but after reading this book, started thinking about my yeast. So how many billion yeast cells are created with a starter?
He's talking about 'great' beer. You can make regular beer without a starter. Great beer takes the proper amount of healthy yeast and good temperature control.
Making a starter with dry yeast will do more harm than good. They are dried with all the nutrients they need. Making a starter will use some up and it wont be big enough to increase the numbers. The only starter I'd make with dry yeast is five gallons.
Making a starter with dry yeast will do more harm than good. They are dried with all the nutrients they need. Making a starter will use some up and it wont be big enough to increase the numbers. The only starter I'd make with dry yeast is five gallons.
rockfish42
Well-Known Member
Depends on the starter size, the amount of yeast you started with, the way the starter is kept etc. Here's a website that should answer most of your questions. If you really want to get into the details buy a copy of Yeast.
http://www.mrmalty.com/starter_faq.php
http://www.amazon.com/dp/0937381969/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
http://www.mrmalty.com/starter_faq.php
http://www.amazon.com/dp/0937381969/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
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A two liter simple starter will double a smack pack.
Propagators don't exist anymore btw.
paulster2626
Well-Known Member
2 packs?!! Man I find liquid yeast to be, well, a huge ripoff. I've started washing it when I use it, but have also been trying to stick to recipes that are dry-yeast friendly. Even $2 or so for the dry stuff seems like a ripoff to me. And believe me, I'm no cheap bastard.
I just hate constantly buying stuff that I can either reuse, or make more of for free via a starter. Although it is fun to smack those things...
solavirtus
Well-Known Member
It seems to me like a small price to pay to turn your sugar water into good beer. They yeast are doing the lion's share of that work!
paulster2626
Well-Known Member
Right, but it's still just yeast. Just something doing a chemical reaction/enzyme conversion/whatever you want to call it. There are about a billion different organisms and chemicals that do this to other things on this planet. Yeast is nothing special.
Anyhow - it's simple enough to wash yeast and save it for later, so it's all good.:cross:
rockfish42
Well-Known Member
It comes down to money vs time for most people, if I had time to brew more often I'd wash yeast to save money. Since I only get to brew at best once every other month, it's important that my investment in time pays off.
I don't have a great place to do lab work, and my OCD biologist tendencies keep me from storing frozen slants etc.
I don't have a great place to do lab work, and my OCD biologist tendencies keep me from storing frozen slants etc.
I've started to top crop US-05 (with some success) and I've stopped using liquid strains that aren't either top cropping friendly or that need gelatin to clear (gelatin messes with yeats washing).
MonkeyWrench
Well-Known Member
Nevermind...seached and found my answer.
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