Grain mill payback

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WI_Wino

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I've recently moved from extract to BIAB and I'm loving the cheaper cost. I started to think about, well what if I got a grain mill and started buying base grains in bulk? That's got to save a ton of money, right?

Err, not so much. I already typically buy 2-3 batches worth of ingredients at once so I get a $.20 discount per pound. With that my numbers are showing I have to use 2000 lbs (!) of 2-row to recoup $100, 3000 lbs for $150 in savings. It starts to go down if I look at other malts (GWM pilsner 400lbs to save $100, 600 lbs to save $150).

Quick examples:
GWM 2-Row
  • $.96 lb
  • $.76 lb (10+lbs purchased at once)
  • $.71 lb ($35.50 for 50 lb sack)

GWM Pilsner
  • $1.22 lb
  • $1.02 lb (10+lbs purchased at once)
  • $.77 lb ($38.50 for 50 lb sack)

Weyereman Pilsner
  • $1.47 lb
  • $1.27 lb (10+lbs purchased at once)
  • $1.20 lb ($66.10 for 55 lb sack)


That is a lot beer before I see $$$ savings. I could go ubercheap and use a corona style mill but still it's hundreds of pounds of 2-row before I break even. At this point I'm probably going to put my brew money elsewhere. I'm probably not fully appreciating the benefits of freshly grinding my own grains...
 
Guess it depends on where you live, most of SD County LBHS are charging $1.85/lb on up, so buying in bulk not only is cheaper, once again depending on cost paid for the bulk grains. It might take a few years for it to pay for itself depending on how often and how much you mill. I think I've almost broke even in about 8 months. There is nothing like CONSISTENCY of crush and ease of deciding the night before wanting to brew the next morning or afternoon, in which would limit the time you LBHS is open like being closed on Monday and you decide to brew on Monday during late Sunday afternoon. I also have a new cordless drill and can mill my grain bill in minutes, which I'll do while my strike water is coming to temp- now that's fresh grinds.

I picked up my barley crusher directly from Barley Crusher for $115 with shipping.
 
It's about a lot more than saving money. That's not why I brew beer. It's about having control over your crush and what you want to brew with it. You can't beat having ingredients on hand and being able to create any recipe or change a recipe on a moments notice.


oops, Ocean beat me and hit the same points. :eek:
 
you also have to realize by milling your own grains you can mill tighter and more consistently which will increase you efficiency and you will use less grain per batch as well.

Still there is nothing about this hobby that is cost saving to any substantial amount. :mug:
 
Well that seems pretty accurate on cost savings. However, there are other factors such as grain crush and freshness that people like about having their own mill. Milling and immediately doughing in just kinda feels right. Also, a lot of LHBS mess with their settings on their mill which can cause you to get wide changes in your efficiency. If yours doesn't do this then it's not really a big deal.

I've always been pretty hesitant to say that making your own beer is cheaper than getting it commercially. This is mostly because of equipment costs. I have probably spent at least 2 grand on my equipment over the last few years (fermenters, kettles, kegging system, etc) so I personally don't look at cost all that much.
 
I'm already getting 80%+ efficiency in my 5 gallon BIAB setup. I've been trying to get into a little lighter ABV beers but last 3 batches were almost 10 points higher than what the recipes called for (yes, volumes were accurate!)
 
The second you move beyond buckets and coolers you won't be saving money anytime soon...we all know this. Its a hobby so much of buying stuff has more to do with producing better beer with more consistency and less to do with saving some coin.
 
If you're doing this (or any other hobby) just to save money, it's not much of a hobby. Maybe you will sink the cost of a grain mill over time, maybe you won't.

But the versatility of milling the way you want it, when you want it, is liberating. Even if you don't buy in bulk, you can still buy the grains you need and not worry if you don't use them for a while. Kept in airtight containers, whole grains will stay fresh much longer than crushed grains.
 
I do think I save money on beer. Last 5 gallon batch was $20 in ingredients, figure $4 in propane or so. 2 cases of decent beer is like $50.

But I guess my point is not that I won't spend money on the hobby, just I was expecting a bigger cost savings in bulk grain. It's just not there for me.
 
My new LHBS does not have a grain mill at the present time. The one I used to use 70 mi round trip had a hand crank corona mill. The gas savings alone for me is worth the price of a mill.
 
At this point I'm probably going to put my brew money elsewhere. I'm probably not fully appreciating the benefits of freshly grinding my own grains...

I affirm your choice. You're getting grain by the pound for less than half of what a lot people end up paying. As price sensitive brewer, I did a similar cost benefit analysis and decided having a mill would pay for itself in less than a year in my circumstances.

As a side benefit, I appreciate the ability to brew on a whim by just digging into the grain silo (rubbermaid trash can). You'll have to evaluate what advantage (or not) having the materials available for spur of the moment brewing would provide to you.
 
Based on the prices you already get on 2 row, it isn't really worth it as long as you are happy with their crush. My lhbs is 1.75/lb or $42 for a 50 lb sack (.84/lb). So that is the next purchase I will be making
 
I've recently moved from extract to BIAB and I'm loving the cheaper cost. I started to think about, well what if I got a grain mill and started buying base grains in bulk? That's got to save a ton of money, right?

Err, not so much. I already typically buy 2-3 batches worth of ingredients at once so I get a $.20 discount per pound. With that my numbers are showing I have to use 2000 lbs (!) of 2-row to recoup $100, 3000 lbs for $150 in savings. It starts to go down if I look at other malts (GWM pilsner 400lbs to save $100, 600 lbs to save $150).

Quick examples:
GWM 2-Row
  • $.96 lb
  • $.76 lb (10+lbs purchased at once)
  • $.71 lb ($35.50 for 50 lb sack)

GWM Pilsner
  • $1.22 lb
  • $1.02 lb (10+lbs purchased at once)
  • $.77 lb ($38.50 for 50 lb sack)

Weyereman Pilsner
  • $1.47 lb
  • $1.27 lb (10+lbs purchased at once)
  • $1.20 lb ($66.10 for 55 lb sack)


That is a lot beer before I see $$$ savings. I could go ubercheap and use a corona style mill but still it's hundreds of pounds of 2-row before I break even. At this point I'm probably going to put my brew money elsewhere. I'm probably not fully appreciating the benefits of freshly grinding my own grains...

You are not looking at all the numbers. You also need to account for the efficiency difference between grain you mill and grain your LHBS mills for you. If you get a 15% increase (which is not unheard of) then you need to use 15% less grain for the same gravity.

Then there are other numbers harder to account for. With milled grain, you buy it a few days before you brew. If life intervenes and you can't get back to brew that batch for a few weeks (which happens) how can you know if the grain is as good as it was when first ground. Ground grain does not store as well as whole malted grain. I buy a fifty pound bag and store it properly. If I can't brew for a few weeks, no big deal. I get to schedule my brewing to fit with my life, instead of making my life fit my brewing because I have the clock running out on milled grain.

Then there is convenience of spacing out the larger purchases. I buy a 50 lb bag of base malt ever couple (2 or 3) months. Then when I do my weekly or semi-weekly batches all I need is to purchase a few dollars in specialty grains, hops and yeast. One ten gallon batch only required me to lay out $10 for other supplies that week because I had already bought and stored my base malt. This makes it easier to budget for brewing, which makes me and my wife happier.

Then there is the peace of mind. I had one clerk in my LHBS who wasn't zeroing out the scale properly and I was getting shorted on grain. Then how do you know they have not changed the gap on their crusher? For all you know someone may have messed with the setting and the batch you just spent big money on will not come anywhere close to the last version you made of it. When you have them measure and grind your grain you are trusting them more than I will.

With these details alone, even if I didn't get a big enough price difference between small and bulk buying, it would still be well worth the cost of a nice quality mill.
 
But is that why you brew?

Not the only reason but it is more than a passing consideration for me. If it cost more than what I can buy it for it would move lower on the list of hobbies for me (of course I hold my home brew in the highest esteem ;)).
 
You are not looking at all the numbers. You also need to account for the efficiency difference between grain you mill and grain your LHBS mills for you. If you get a 15% increase (which is not unheard of) then you need to use 15% less grain for the same gravity.

Then there are other numbers harder to account for. With milled grain, you buy it a few days before you brew. If life intervenes and you can't get back to brew that batch for a few weeks (which happens) how can you know if the grain is as good as it was when first ground. Ground grain does not store as well as whole malted grain. I buy a fifty pound bag and store it properly. If I can't brew for a few weeks, no big deal. I get to schedule my brewing to fit with my life, instead of making my life fit my brewing because I have the clock running out on milled grain.

Then there is convenience of spacing out the larger purchases. I buy a 50 lb bag of base malt ever couple (2 or 3) months. Then when I do my weekly or semi-weekly batches all I need is to purchase a few dollars in specialty grains, hops and yeast. One ten gallon batch only required me to lay out $10 for other supplies that week because I had already bought and stored my base malt. This makes it easier to budget for brewing, which makes me and my wife happier.

Then there is the peace of mind. I had one clerk in my LHBS who wasn't zeroing out the scale properly and I was getting shorted on grain. Then how do you know they have not changed the gap on their crusher? For all you know someone may have messed with the setting and the batch you just spent big money on will not come anywhere close to the last version you made of it. When you have them measure and grind your grain you are trusting them more than I will.

With these details alone, even if I didn't get a big enough price difference between small and bulk buying, it would still be well worth the cost of a nice quality mill.

Good to hear your opinions. For my budgeting, it's better to have smaller but more frequent purchases (beer ingredients are part of the monthly grocery budget!).
 
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