Man, I love Apfelwein

WIP said:

This was a HUGE hit at Thanksgiving Dinner last night. Thanks Ed!

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New Years is coming and a few bottles will be opened! Can't wait.

Apple juice on sale for $1.50/64 oz at the A&P, so I bought enough for another 4 gallon batch. I am really liking the stuff I bottled 3 weeks ago. (first batch was 3 gallons) . It is carbing up nicely and I also have some bottled without priming. Planning to take some to a Christmas party and starting to worry I will never find out what it tastes like after suitably long period of aging! I will stash a few bottles and hope for the best.

I'm a little worried that my basement temps are down to 57-62 deg F which might be too cold, but I heard a Cider expert on one of The Brewing Network Jamil shows pretty much say he ferments Cider at extremely low temps..for a long ferment.

Will give it a shot and hope the Montrachet yeasties will not be too stressed. I also have some EC-1118 I was thinking of using, but at this point, I won't mess with success!

Well, I finally have a 5 gal. batch of Edworts exact recipe fermenting away in the basement. I put it together on Saturday afternoon and today I now have about a bubble per second out of the airlock, nice steady stream of bubbles rising to the top.

I don't have the Rhino fart thing going on either, not that I am disapointed.

I am very excited to see how this comes out. I wonder if a dash of apple puckers would be good in a nice big ice filled glass of this??????

Put a little pear in it.
Kinda tastes like green Jolly Rancher.:rockin:

i made a batch with 1/3 fresh pear juice and hot damn it's tasty! Gonna let it age a few months before i pop open another bottle

I have so many batches of this stuff in rotation. I use concentrate and usually don't dilute it as much as the instructions say (Seneca Farms concentrate in the grocery store). Then I add 1.5lbs sugar to ferment out with Montrachet(sp?). I've never taken gravity readings as it's unimportant to me but the stuff really knocks ya down. I can have one bottle before work and feel buzzed.

TerryWendel said:

I can have one bottle before work and feel buzzed.

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I'm glad I don't live in GA.

Your supposed to have it after work, or have I been missing something.

Must make work more fun to go to.

Recluse said:

Will give it a shot and hope the Montrachet yeasties will not be too stressed. I also have some EC-1118 I was thinking of using, but at this point, I won't mess with success!

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Most wine strains will have no trouble fermenting down to about 55*F. Most white wines are fermented down in that range to keep ester production in check, expect fermentation to take up to four weeks though!

Has anybody tried to make holiday slush with this? It seems like it would be pretty tasty, but I don't know how you would do it without just having a solid block of ice instead of the flaky scoopable ice that you would normally use.

What do you guys think?

Doesn't the original recipe tell you to expect a 4-5 week fermentation, anyway?

Saccharomyces said:

Most wine strains will have no trouble fermenting down to about 55*F. Most white wines are fermented down in that range to keep ester production in check, expect fermentation to take up to four weeks though!

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I left the first batch in Primary for 8 weeks anyway, though the fermentation was probably done in 2 or less. No problem keeping it lagered away for the winter

I bottled my batch of Apfelwein uncarbonated in wine bottles after about 2 months in the carboy. It still developed a little bit of sediment in the bottom of the bottles.

is there any way to make it so there isnt any sediment in the bottom at all?

I don't know for sure, but I would expect that multiple rackings over a long period would help. Maybe along with a cold crash to kill off more yeasties. Not sure if commercial wineries do it this way or if they use some ultrafiltration step that isn't really practical for the small scale homebrewer.

I was wondering if anyone has tried a malolactic culture in Apfelwein and how it turned out?

Has anyone repitched on the cake for this? I'm going to rack my first batch in about a week and was wondering if it would be fine to simply drop a new botch on top of the previous yeast cake (might not aerate as much since there's probably plenty of yeast if I use the whole cake). I figure I shouldn't need to wash it since the trub should be 100% yeast if I stuck to the original recipe right?

shek said:

Has anyone repitched on the cake for this? I'm going to rack my first batch in about a week and was wondering if it would be fine to simply drop a new botch on top of the previous yeast cake (might not aerate as much since there's probably plenty of yeast if I use the whole cake). I figure I shouldn't need to wash it since the trub should be 100% yeast if I stuck to the original recipe right?

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Works fine.
As long as the one you're taking out tastes OK.

Pivot ... I logged on today to post the same question. My bottled apfelwein, bottled at 7 weeks, crystal clear, has developed some sediment in the bottles. No off tastes ... just a layer of sediment.

Strange thing, the sediment didn't appear in the bottles for a couple of weeks.

I'm wondering if adding some k-met would be a good thing for future batches (I have two other batches bubbling away in carboys as we speak, er, write) ... and would like to avoid the sediment in future bottles of apfelwein.

Anybody got any advice?

I just ended up stabilizing my Apfelwine after about 6 weeks in the carboy. I racked off a gallon into a cider jug on top of 700mL of Black Bing Cherry Juice. man that is an awesome combination. It didn't sweeten it anywhere near what I thought, but is still great. The untouched Apfel is great too. Still a little green but I can see this aging just fine!

I just bottled and used two cups of corn sugar dissolved in four cups of water to prime... it's made me convince SWMBO that "she" needs a kitchen scale. That's after 5 weeks in the primary which turned out surprisingly clear. I'm impressed so far. Can't wait to taste... hopefully by New Years.

Pivot said:

I bottled my batch of Apfelwein uncarbonated in wine bottles after about 2 months in the carboy. It still developed a little bit of sediment in the bottom of the bottles.

is there any way to make it so there isnt any sediment in the bottom at all?

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I really think that racking once or two extra times would solve the problem. Probably moving the carboy and racking out for bottling stirred up the amount of sediment you see. Of course, you could use some gelatin or something, but that would probably be overkill.

I used a teaspoon of dextrose in each 12 oz bottle to prime and after 2.5 weeks, I can barely feel carbonation on the edges of my tounge but there are no bubbles in it to speak of. Anyone else have a carbing problem? I was thinking that maybe my capper sucks.

WIP said:

I used a teaspoon of dextrose in each 12 oz bottle to prime and after 2.5 weeks, I can barely feel carbonation on the edges of my tounge but there are no bubbles in it to speak of. Anyone else have a carbing problem? I was thinking that maybe my capper sucks.

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It took like two months for mine to get to a good level. It's pretty slow.

1st batch in bottles. 6 wine bottles (still) and the rest are carbing quietly in grolsch bottles in the pantry. 4.5 gal treetop, 2# brown sugar, 1 pack redstar premier cuvee wine yeast. Started 10/29 OG 1.070, FG 0.995. Sample says it should be wonderfull.

Alright, I just made a grog with about 6 cups of this stuff and Swmbo and I have drank most of it while decorating the tree and listening to Christmas music tonight. This is how I did it.

Ingredients for my grog,

6 cups of Apfelwein
2 Cinnamon sticks
1/2 cup organic sugar
1 apple sliced into 6 pieces and in one of the pieces I stuck about 6 cloves into

I put all into a pot and brought almost up to a boil and then reduced heat and simmered for about 10 minutes. After the 10 minutes, I discarded the cinnamon sticks and continued to simmer for 10 more minutes. I then cut off the heat and ladled into mugs.

How long does this take to ferment out? I started mine on 1 November and it's still bubbling away. Temperature has always been in the mid 60's. It's like the Eveready Bunny.

tundra05 said:

How long does this take to ferment out? I started mine on 1 November and it's still bubbling away. Temperature has always been in the mid 60's. It's like the Eveready Bunny.

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Mine typically bubbles for like a month. It's not like ale yeast.

I have four 1-gallon batches started in weekly intervals from early November.

Had a "publik skool math" moment when trying to convert my bag of dextrose from grams to pounds or ounces, than reducing it to amounts suitable for a 1-gallon batch. My head still hurts from thinking about THAT challenge... and I agree with previous posters about the need for a kitchen scale (now on my Christmas list). Looking forward to starting a 5-gallon batch soon (if for no other reason than to simplify the numbers).

Two of the batches are made with apple juice, the other two with fresh-pressed cider. One of each has 9 oz dextrose, the other of each has 6 oz dextrose. The high-sugar batches started out at 1.075, the low sugars at 1.060. I've read much higher numbers in some of the previous posts, so maybe I REALLY screwed-up the math. (Did I mention I went to publik skool?)

Oh, half-packet of Montrachet for each batch, about 65 degrees in my utility room, and these little guys don't seem to stink at all!

So far each is behaving as expected. The bubbles have stopped in the first two batches, and they are clearing nicely. Normally I'd hurry-up and rack them at this point, as I've had bad experiences in the past with wine which was left on the yeast for too long, but am heartened to read about how forgiving this recipe is. I'll probably bottle everything around New Year's (hopefully sampling will be conducive to the festivities).

Happy to see all the experience and positive attitude here, and looking forward to contributing!

so im confused how apfelwien is differrent from cider. is it higher abv?

Higher ABV and way drier than regular hard cider.

I highly recommend this kitchen scale:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0007GAWRS/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

Great scale for the price.

BTW.. here is a quick math check:

1 lb = 16 oz
1 oz = 28.35 g (use 28 or 30 for calculation, it won't matter)

1lb = 454 g

Recipe calls for 2 lb sugars in 5 gal. (32 oz, 908 g)

1 gallon is 1/5 or 2/10 (0.2) of the recipe.

0.2 * 2 lb = 0.4 lb/gal
0.2 * 32 = 6.4 oz/gal
0.2 * 908 = 182 g/gal

You can safely round up or down to whole numbers and not be terribly far off (e.g. 6 oz, 180 g etc..)

My gravities end up in the 1.062-1.064 range generally depending on the juice, so your 1.075 is going to be pretty potent.

fuzzyham said:

I have four 1-gallon batches started in weekly intervals from early November.

Had a "publik skool math" moment when trying to convert my bag of dextrose from grams to pounds or ounces, than reducing it to amounts suitable for a 1-gallon batch. My head still hurts from thinking about THAT challenge... and I agree with previous posters about the need for a kitchen scale (now on my Christmas list). Looking forward to starting a 5-gallon batch soon (if for no other reason than to simplify the numbers).

Two of the batches are made with apple juice, the other two with fresh-pressed cider. One of each has 9 oz dextrose, the other of each has 6 oz dextrose. The high-sugar batches started out at 1.075, the low sugars at 1.060. I've read much higher numbers in some of the previous posts, so maybe I REALLY screwed-up the math. (Did I mention I went to publik skool?)

Oh, half-packet of Montrachet for each batch, about 65 degrees in my utility room, and these little guys don't seem to stink at all!

So far each is behaving as expected. The bubbles have stopped in the first two batches, and they are clearing nicely. Normally I'd hurry-up and rack them at this point, as I've had bad experiences in the past with wine which was left on the yeast for too long, but am heartened to read about how forgiving this recipe is. I'll probably bottle everything around New Year's (hopefully sampling will be conducive to the festivities).

Happy to see all the experience and positive attitude here, and looking forward to contributing!

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Recluse said:

BTW.. here is a quick math check:

1 lb = 16 oz
1 oz = 28.35 g (use 28 or 30 for calculation, it won't matter)

1lb = 454 g

Recipe calls for 2 lb sugars in 5 gal. (32 oz, 908 g)

1 gallon is 1/5 or 2/10 (0.2) of the recipe.

0.2 * 2 lb = 0.4 lb/gal
0.2 * 32 = 6.4 oz/gal
0.2 * 908 = 182 g/gal

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That's what I eventually came up with on paper. My real issue is that without a scale, I had to try to physically divide an 850 gram batch of sugar knowing that 6oz by weight wouldn't equal 6oz dry measure. Not one of my better moments as a grown-up.

Thanks for the recommendation on the scale. I'll make sure Santa gets the hint!

Yeah, I finally broke down and bought a scale when I was starting to make some Gruit ales. Figured I wanted to measure the herbs a little more closely than guesstimation.

[off topic]
We have some cookbooks from Ireland and the UK that have measurements in weight vs. volume units too, and got tired of always looking up conversions from dry weight to volume for all sorts of ingredients. Just this weeken SWMBO made some gingerbread cookies from one of the cookbooks. I implored her to use the scale, but she refused. They came out OK, but the double batch was somewhat less than a SINGLE batch because she interpreted the weights (helpfully translated from g to oz) as volumes, and 4 oz of flour by weight is actually more like 8 oz (1 cup) by volume.
[/off topic]
Started a 4.5 gal batch of Apfelwein yesterday and used my scale to measure out my sugars, since I didn't have specific 1 lb bags of either the Dextrose or the Brown Sugar I used 50:50 with the Dextrose.

A little too cold in the basement, though. 57 deg F and 15 hours after pitching, still no activity. Might have to get some heat tape or something to wake up the Yeasties.

EDIT: Whether it was just TIME or the fact that I moved my carboy closer to the boiler in the basement, I had a nice foam at the top and airlock activity this morning. Go Yeast Go! I was worried that I also erred in shaking up the yeast with some apple juice rather than sprinking it through the funnel as I did in my last batch. I have always rehydrated my yeasts in water according to directions (except for Apfelwein and JAO) and was afraid I had bruised and battered the poor guys with the Shaken not Stirred treatment. I think all is proceeding normally now.

i got currious after several successful batches and started playing around with more than yeast. i just did the exact recipe (but using cosco applejuice, and adjusted for 3 gallons) then added about a half shotglass worth of pumpkin spice, and there is a cake on the top of the carboy. should i be concerned that it's contaminated? should i shake it up so the cake gets mixed back in? should i wait another month and see if the situation has changed?

it's fermenting, and it did kick off a little slower than it has in the past but it's rolling steadily now. i'm concerned because i've never had this cake on the top from montrachet yeast before, it looks like floating krausen, but it's thick, thick enough to worry me.

the batch was started on 11/22/09, today is 12/07/09. if the batch is bad i'd really like to get a fresh one in there. this is my main concern.

So I just got into my first batch this weekend for my birthday and let's just say I will have this on tap at all times!

AlTheGud1sRtaken said:

i got currious after several successful batches and started playing around with more than yeast. i just did the exact recipe (but using cosco applejuice, and adjusted for 3 gallons) then added about a half shotglass worth of pumpkin spice, and there is a cake on the top of the carboy. should i be concerned that it's contaminated? should i shake it up so the cake gets mixed back in? should i wait another month and see if the situation has changed?

it's fermenting, and it did kick off a little slower than it has in the past but it's rolling steadily now. i'm concerned because i've never had this cake on the top from montrachet yeast before, it looks like floating krausen, but it's thick, thick enough to worry me.

the batch was started on 11/22/09, today is 12/07/09. if the batch is bad i'd really like to get a fresh one in there. this is my main concern.

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It's fine. Many of the individual spices in pumpkin spice are naturally buoyant (floaters), and what you're seeing is them sticking to the krausen ring. I have a holiday ale in my primary that has some pumpkin pie spice in it, and the krausen is deep brown and striated in a way I don't normally see with krausen. It's nothing to worry about.

What you might want to be actually concerned about is the quantity of spice you threw in there. Normally, 1 to 2 tsp is enough for a full 5 gallon batch, and yet you used half of a shotglass, which is ~5 teaspoons' worth, in just 3 gallons? That is going to be one SPICY, totally out of balance cider! You might want to consider getting 2 more gallons of apple juice in there ASAP, lest you have a dumper on your hands.

khiddy said:

It's fine. Many of the individual spices in pumpkin spice are naturally buoyant (floaters), and what you're seeing is them sticking to the krausen ring. I have a holiday ale in my primary that has some pumpkin pie spice in it, and the krausen is deep brown and striated in a way I don't normally see with krausen. It's nothing to worry about.

What you might want to be actually concerned about is the quantity of spice you threw in there. Normally, 1 to 2 tsp is enough for a full 5 gallon batch, and yet you used half of a shotglass, which is ~5 teaspoons' worth, in just 3 gallons? That is going to be one SPICY, totally out of balance cider! You might want to consider getting 2 more gallons of apple juice in there ASAP, lest you have a dumper on your hands.

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that's what i had read too, but this is less spice that i had just used in a pumpkin ale (that started at 7 gallons), which i felt needed at least twice as much spice. i'd consider adding more juice, but the space in my brewing box for 5 and 7 gallon buckets it being used by beer, so this is in a 3 gallon better bottle. hopefully my spice is just not as potent i guess. i'll give you all an update in about a month and a half (nervous face)

Anyone know of a way to give this more of a wine mouthfeel? I would like it to feel more like a wine than water.

WIP said:

Anyone know of a way to give this more of a wine mouthfeel? I would like it to feel more like a wine than water.

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use better juice. if you can find applejuice that has more flavor in the beginning then it finishes out with more flavor

WIP said:

Anyone know of a way to give this more of a wine mouthfeel? I would like it to feel more like a wine than water.

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do you mean less dry or more dextrin-y or something I haven't thought of...please expand...

let it sit longer.
Its allot better after 7 or 8 months.