Mike's basic sweet mead 09

I have put together the following ingredients

20lbs raw local honey
4gal water
1pck D47 yeast
1tsp energizer day 1
1tsp energizer day4
1tsp energizer day8

This gives me a batch size of right at 6 gallons.

I started this batch on 8-27-09. I mixed the honey with 3 of the gals of water, then added the 20lbs (roughly 2 gal) raw local wildflower honey and stirred until mixed very well. I then added energizer (1tsp) and D47 yeast and aerated vigorously for 10 minutes. I then added 1 more gallon of water to bring the batch up to about 6 gallons.

On 8-31-09 I opened up the fermenter and added another 1tsp energizer to the mead, stirred and briefly aerated the mead.

Fermentation has been moving along steady since day 2.

Again on 9-4-09 I removed lid from fermenter and added another 1tsp of energizer and stirred into the mead. I did not aerate this time.
Today I took first hydrometer reading and it showed a PABV of 13%. Taste from test sample is very sweet. SG at this time, if I'm reading right is 1.098. It is 1 mark under the 1.100. I know I wont get down to 1.000 but I'm hoping to get down to 1.030 or somewhere in that area. A little lower if possible. Tell me what you think it will go to.

9-5-09
Fermentation is moving along pretty well bubbling 5 or so times per minute. I think everything is moving along as it should be. Temp has been regulated betwween 70*-72*.

9-9-09
Fermentation is still moving along bubbling 3-4 times per minute. I took another hydrometer reading today an it shows a PABV of 11% and if I'm reading it right SG is 1.080. Does this seem like an adequate pace to be moving along? I would love to get down to 1.020 or even lower. Input? Advice? Should I aerate? More energizer?
The mead from test beaker is a little less sweet... Still very sweet, but is developing sort of an acidic taste (very slight). If that continues to develop it will round out the mead well I think. I do have some acid blend if I need to add some at the end. Comments? Suggestions?

I think you are OK to go ahead and just let it sit. It's hard to do, but I always let mine sit for 6 months to fully ferment and for all of the flavors to really congeal. Just set it and forget it, and you should be fine! (Just my 2¢. I'm sure you can get by with drinking sooner, but if you really want it to settle out clean and be sure it's finished, I'd wait if you could).

I don't know if you'll get to 1.020 with that much honey.

Give it another couple weeks - check the gravity, and if you're not significantly lower than 1.080 check out hightests sticky on how to restart a stuck fermentation, and his staggered nutrient addition schedule

Thank you for your input and replies. I'll let it set for 2-3 more weeks or until the end of the month anyway. My previous batches this is exactly where I had some issues... Waiting and leaving it alone!! I just felt like I needed to DO something.hmhmhm. This time I vow it will be different! hmhmhm. I am going to give thisw batch all the time it needs period. I know it will be that much better in the end. I will re-assess at the end of the month. I will keep updates on the batch coming and if I start anything else I'll post it here for input and suggestions. Thanks!

If you need to do SOMETHING, start another batch! You'll be glad you did.

I like that natron! I do believe I'll take that advice!! hmhmhm... Just out of curiosity, is it moving at what would be considered a decent pace? today it shows 11% PABV. On the last reading I took on 9-4-09 it showed 13% PABV. So it moved a couple percent in 5 days. Is that normal with so much honey??? I think I'm gonna do a couple 1gal batches. Any tried and true recipe you would recomend? Thanks again!

im kinda new at this but doesn't the energizer instructions call for 1 tsp per gal?

Some energizers do call for that amount. The energizer I have calls for 1tsp per 5 gal. I also have some energizer of another kind that states 1tsp per gal. Fermentation seems to be going well at this point. If it starts to decline I'll surely hit it with another tsp or 2.

Today, 9-14-09, I racked out of my primary into a glass carboy. I found a small crack in the rim and didn't want to risk any oxidation or maybe some kind of small insects getting in there... It has a rubber o-ring, so I think it still had a good seal, but I didn't want to take a chance. Anyway since I had pretty close to 6 gallons I filled it up to just about 2" from the top. Since I did that it has been bubbling once every couple seconds or so. I can also see bubbles (like carbonation) coming up through the mead.

How long can I leave the mead in this glass carboy before lees becomes a concern? I've heard people say not to leave it on the lees for more than 2 months. Is this true in your experience?? Thanks for any replies.

I see that your adding energizer, but I do not see DAP (Diammonium Phosphate), the potassium is needed by the yeast to adjust to the nutrient wasteland of just honey.
SNA does require additions at different stages of the yeast growth and gravity levels from the OG.

Without the OG, I would take a guess that along with out adding the DAP, you may have started the second and third additions too early.
Looks like your OG would have been around SG 1.116, Stage 2 should have been done around SG 1.107 which it may have been, Stage 2 should have been done at SG 1.058, but you did it at 1.098.

I use hightest's spreadsheet and have learned to trust it, I am doing a very dry mead and hit stage 2 in 1 day, and stage 3 in 3 days. Now I just have to wait, I'm thinking maybe a 4 days more and take a sample to see if it is time to go to secondary.

I have also learned that de-gassing helps in the early stages. I do it daily. I just sterilize a spoon, and stir it up. Not enough to really aerate it but just kick the C02 out.
You did not mention what the SG was when you racked. Racking out of primary too soon may slow down the fermentation by reducing the yeast population.
As for how long to leave it in the secondary. When you see a layer of lees that is larger than you index finger which since you racked early may be in around a month.

When I racked the mead it was at 1.070. I'm not sure what the OG was, I didn't even check the gravity until 9-4-09 which showed a PABV of 13% (batch was started on 8-27-09). When I racked it over it showed PABV of 9%. If my OG was 1.116 and I'm now down to 1.070 after just a couple weeks, That to me seems like the fermentation is going fairly well. Pretty quick but not too quick. I'm gonna go look again at hightest's spreadsheet and try to figure it out... Thanks for the reply!

I see a lot of numbers being discussed in this topic, but based on the original recipe (20# honey & 4 gal of water) here's what they should be: OG: 1.124, Must volume: 5.7 Gals, ABV at a FG of 1.000: 16.4%, SNA SG add points: Stage 1: 1.124, Stage 2: 1.110, Stage 3: 1.062.

Now if the OG was not near 1.124, the either the honey MC varied from the nominal 18%, and/or the honey & water measurements were different.

The last time I made a mead of this strength (2005), the OG was 1.125, and it fermented to 1.011 in 22 days, and then to 1.002 on day 36. :cross:

What type of yeast did you use to get it down that low? D47 having a tolerance of 14% will probably give out before it gets that low wont it??? Your #s are probably correct, I just didn't take an initial reading, which now I wish I had! Anyway what do you have to say about racking off the lees? Can I simply leave this mead for 2-3 months in the carboy and worry about racking then? Thanks for all the info you gave me.

The example I noted above used Zymaflore VL3 yeast. However, I also found an another example where I used 10g ICV D-47, which fermented from 1.118 to 0.996 in 21 days.

Of course in each case the yeast was properly rehydrated and I followed my SNA protocal as noted in my FAQs.

Regarding the lees, I am not overly concerned about them. I routinely leave my primary alone for 3-7 weeks before racking - not because of the lees, but to get the mead in a secondary where I can add spices, fruit, etc. In one mead (a Reisling pyment), I left the mead on the primary lees for over 6 months)...

Read my autolysis FAQ.

hightest said:

I see a lot of numbers being discussed in this topic, but based on the original recipe (20# honey & 4 gal of water) here's what they should be: OG: 1.124, Must volume: 5.7 Gals, ABV at a FG of 1.000: 16.4%, SNA SG add points: Stage 1: 1.124, Stage 2: 1.110, Stage 3: 1.062.

Now if the OG was not near 1.124, the either the honey MC varied from the nominal 18%, and/or the honey & water measurements were different.

The last time I made a mead of this strength (2005), the OG was 1.125, and it fermented to 1.011 in 22 days, and then to 1.002 on day 36. :cross:

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The godfather has arrived - welcome to this thread hightest

Yea, I thought if I mentioned his name enough he would show up and correct all my mistakes.
One thing though, from his initial post he topped off the total volume to 6 gals, so that was what I was basing my numbers off of. But then again maybe I need to get the latest spreadsheet.
Good to see you still haunt this site hightest. Thank you.

I believe hightest is supernatural. His posts and replies make me believe this guy knows his stuff. Thanks for replying to my thread. I feel much more comfortable about leaving this batch in the carboy for as long as it is fermenting now and not being so concerned about racking again and again. Thanks for everyones replies, I'll update this thread as progress is made.

Kauai_Kahuna said:

...One thing though, from his initial post he topped off the total volume to 6 gals, so that was what I was basing my numbers off of. But then again maybe I need to get the latest spreadsheet.

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I see now how your OG calc was made. However, as I read the initial post - both the ingredient list and the process description - I didn't see the same thing.

While I did see a mention of 6 gallons, it did not logically follow from this description,

...I mixed the honey with 3 of the gals of water, then added the 20lbs (roughly 2 gal) raw local wildflower honey and stirred until mixed very well. I then added energizer (1tsp) and D47 yeast and aerated vigorously for 10 minutes. I then added 1 more gallon of water to bring the batch up to about 6 gallons.

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Looking closely it does say 20# of honey was used along with 4 gallons (3 first and then 1 later).

What does not follow is that the volumes occupied by those ingredients is 6 gallons. Now if that really is true, and a 6 gallon carboy was used, then more than 1 gallon of water was added in the last step. Perhaps that last gallon was more of a "guesstimate" than a true measurement?

If the true total must volume was 6 gallons, then somewhere another 5 cups (over 1 Qt) of water had to have been added...

Damn you're good hightest! A virtual mead process investigator! You're 100% right it was a guess or estimate on my part, I just new it was pretty close to 6 gallons. Nothing gets by you, you are my hero. Teach me the ways almighty guru. hmhmhm. You definitely seem to know enough about what I did that you may have well been there when I did it and walked me through it. Amazing. Thanks again...

I just use his spreadsheet, but no way do I have his experience and background in meads. But thanks to his FAQ I am now able to make great mead quickly and then forget about them during bulk ageing.
You could cover you mead in secondary with a towel, check the air lock every two weeks or so to make certain it does not go dry and then see how clear it is in a month or two..
Best of luck, and give it as much time as you can to develop.

Right on Kauai. I am feeling good about the advice and info I have been getting here. Seems like there are a lot of experienced people here that are willing to come down and help the noobs. Thanks a lot guys. I'll keep you updated on status.

OG was 1.124. Today, 9-23-09 the SG is 1.052 and a little under 7 PABV. So at this time it's right around 10% abv. I tasted the sample and it has a clean taste that is still sweet but it is developing a little bite. My plan at this point is to let it sit right where she is until it clears and at that point I will rack it out into seperate 1 gallon containers for aging. A couple of those gallons I may add some spices to. Maybe cinnamon sticks, cloves, nutmeg or some combination of those. I am going to keep some traditional but I am curious about adding spices to see what I come up with.

Given the information provided I would have to say that this mead has suffered from either a low pH or lack of nutrients (at the appropriate time).

I say this based on my experience and a most recent mead whose OG was 1.123 and fermented to 0.999 in 15 days. I also have other examples of meads that have a similar OG (±0.003) that fermented to 1.000 (or less) in the range of 15-28 days.

What effect will this have on the finished mead??? This mead started with 20lbs of honey for a total volume of almost 6 gallons. I figured it would take a while to fully ferment and it hasn't quite been a month yet... I was figuring it could take up to a couple months to finish fermenting and then another 2-3 months to drop clear. Am I wrong to assume this? I hope I haven't ruined the batch.

thorson138 said:

What effect will this have on the finished mead??? This mead started with 20lbs of honey for a total volume of almost 6 gallons. I figured it would take a while to fully ferment and it hasn't quite been a month yet...

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As you can see from the examples I cited it does not have to take an excessive amount of time to finish even with a OG of 1.123 - although in this case it appears that it will.

To try and answer your question. I suspect the mead will finish very sweet. If you plot your SG vs. days since yeast pitching you will note that the rate of fermentation has fallen-off considerably and your SG is still near 1.052. Once this happens, you will rarely get much more significant fermentation - I'd be surprised if it dropped more than 10 points.

Do not make the mistake of trying to induce more fementation by adding more DAP or nutrients - the mead is well beyond that point.

For now time is your friend. I'd let the mead rest for at least another 2-3 months before making any decision to bottle, sorbate, etc.

Thanks hightest. I want the mead to finish pretty sweet but I don't want it to be so sweet you can't drink the stuff. What would happen if I pitched a stronger yeast??? Would that be beneficial in any way? If I let it sit for a few months do you think it will get down to the 1.02 range? Thanks for your input on this.

Since you're mead is ~10% ABV, you might try to follow my stuck fermentation FAQ and see if that helps. There's no guarantee it will get you 30 more points, but it can't hurt to try.

I'm still letting the mead sit. I haven't tried to do anything to it. It seems to still be fermenting at a steady pace. Or at least it's still bubbling every couple seconds. It appears to be Carbonated with bubbles rising up to the top. Is this mead going to finish sparkling??? I didn't think that would happen unless I put in some priming sugar at bottling time. This mead was started on 8-27-09. It is now 10-1-09.

soo i have 1 gallon of fermented to dry 1.000 mead and one gallon of 1.082 Fg could i marry the two bottles? or is that a no no?
thanks
-miles

What? You may want to start yourself a new thread.

thorson138 said:

What? You may want to start yourself a new thread.

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maybe soooo, but the 1.082 is a stuck fermentation it started at like 1.177 and from what i saw in the thread it might be hard to restart so i was just wondering rather than restarting a fermentation, could i just marry the overly sweet with the totally dry and get a semi sweet mead? sorry to hijack the thread.