just dropped a wad of cash to go all grain

I mostly wanted to post just how excited I am.

I got a 10 gallon rubbermaid cooler, stainless false bottom and stainless valve and fittings from morebeer.com. Later I plan to add another for the HLT.

I have one 10 gallon kettle and one 8 gallon.
Planning to just batch sparge, single infusion at first and then go to town with all the possibilities.


I also got a irish red all grain kit from more beer.

What do you wish you knew before your first all grain batch?
Any beersmith tips to make sure my first time is successful?
What are the biggest mistakes that most first time all grainers make.


I know I need to read up on calculating efficiency. I dont know how to do that.


I love this website. thanks for all the wonderful info.

Still a noob myself. Suggest you take lots of notes in some sort of a log so when you look back to figure out what to change on next batch you know for sure what you did.


Have fun!

Your first couple batches are more about dialing in your system, so take close notes on your volumes and boil off. Add the grain to the water. Stir lije a mofo. And congrats!

I cant figure out how to enter the type of system i have into beersmith.

I have on the way the 10 gallon cooler and 10 gallon boil kettle.
I am only going to do 5 gallon batches for now. Do i want to select the 5 gallon cooler from the equipment in beersmith or the 10 gallon and then scale back to 5 gallon recipe?

When I scale back my gravity takes a nose dive.

PastorofMuppets said:

I cant figure out how to enter the type of system i have into beersmith.

I have on the way the 10 gallon cooler and 10 gallon boil kettle.
I am only going to do 5 gallon batches for now. Do i want to select the 5 gallon cooler from the equipment in beersmith or the 10 gallon and then scale back to 5 gallon recipe?

When I scale back my gravity takes a nose dive.

Click to expand...

I'm not a beersmith user. But I use a 10 gal kettle and only do 5 gallon batches. Well I build the recipe to get 5.5 gal wort into my fermentor so when I go to bottle I can leave half a gallon of yeast and dry hops and still package 5 gallons.

To get to 5.5 in the bucket I try to end boil with 6 in the kettle, so I can leave boil hops and trub behind. To get to 6 gallons post boil, I need 7 to 7.5 gallons pre-boil...

All this is to say a 10 gal kettle is a good size for 5 gallon batches.

Put in the 10 gal cooler and 10 gallon pot. Your tun dead space and kettle boil off and waste volumes will be the same on a 5 gal batch or a larger batch.

I didn't see that you have a grain mill, get one. The LHBS typically don't crush grain enough to avoid stuck mash/sparge. Grain milled in wide set rollers will kill efficiency. I got a mill, now crush at .035 and get 80% efficiency. If you are batch sparging, move to fly or continuous sparging. Everyone says continuous sparging improves efficiency. I batch sparge but am moving to continuous sparging.

ILoveBeer2 said:

Put in the 10 gal cooler and 10 gallon pot. Your tun dead space and kettle boil off and waste volumes will be the same on a 5 gal batch or a larger batch.

Click to expand...

i dont see that as an option as an equipement choice. I can choose 10 gal cooler and its defaulted to 15 gallon pot.
I used the add on to add the morebeer irish red which i purchased.
I dont know how to tell if the dead space is set right.
Ive never done a all grain batch and i dont want beer smith to cause me to over think stuff.

Advice for first batch:

Request a double crush on the grain if possible: helps improve efficiency.
Make sure your thermometer is accurate: test it in crushed ice water (32*) and then boiling water (212*). If you can check it against other thermometers too. This is important for mashing.
Keep a pot of boiling water and a bunch of ice on hand for the mash: you can adjust your temp if you miss. I'd say shot for 152*, if it's on or off by 2* your good but if it's more you could adjust.
Be patient when cooling, wait until you got that temp down to 60* to pitch.

You can build a new equipment profile in Beersmith. You don't have to chose one of the pre-installed profiles. Check out their videos on their website.

The single best investment I made when I went AG was a 1 gallon measuring pitcher. It allowed me to track my volumes precisely and figure out where, and how much water, I was losing in my system.

Also, I have started purposefully overshooting my strike water temperatures by 2-4 degrees or so. That way I can add it to my tun, stir until it cools to just above my strike temp (1 degree or so above) then I dough in. Then I continue stirring until the temperature is even and I settle at my mash temp.

Otherwise you are boiling up extra water and throwing off your grain/water ratio if you end up coming in too low. And I rather have a fuller, slightly sweeter beer than a thinner, drier beer.

Volumes, volumes, volumes! And a good thermometer.

so to confirm you dough in by adding grain to water not water to grain?

In palmer's book it clearly says add water to grain.

Will the kit have the amount of grain i need to start with 6.5 gallons into kettle?
When I did extract i hit gravity with 6.5 gallons and then 5.25 gallons into fermenter which left me with a perfect 5 gallon batch after trub.

I add grain to water and stir as much as I can while i do it. If you add water to grain, you will have a rather difficult time breaking up dough balls and not scorching yourself.

I don't think it really matters how you do it, just as long as you end up with a good mix at the right temp with no balls.

PastorofMuppets said:

so to confirm you dough in by adding grain to water not water to grain?

In palmer's book it clearly says add water to grain.

Will the kit have the amount of grain i need to start with 6.5 gallons into kettle?
When I did extract i hit gravity with 6.5 gallons and then 5.25 gallons into fermenter which left me with a perfect 5 gallon batch after trub.

Click to expand...

I add water to the grain but it is a matter of preference not practicality. Most grain bills I am about 10 degrees drop in temp when I add the water to the grain so if I want a 152 degree mash I dump 162 degree water and hit the temp right on.

The volumes are easy to figure as well. The grains absorb pretty much the same amount of water per pound so add that up and nope I do not remember right off how much it was other than something like 1/4 quart per pound or something. Add the amount of water left under the screen to that along with the pre boil volume and that is where to start.

Hehe then you get to decide if you are going to do full volume boils or nor not

Full volume boils are the only way to go!!!!

Not really but... kind of

I guess I am weird. I add water then grain then more water until its just over the grain bed.

I dont know how to mark my boil kettle to know how much wort i will end up with after the runoff. I can measure how much goes into the MLT and how much goes into the fermenter after the boil, but how can i know how much i get before boil? I have always done full volume 6.5 gal boils with extract. Am i supposed to check gravity before I boil or only after?
I was thinking of having DME on hand if I come up short of the intended gravity. ahhh so many questions i have. I just need to do a few batches and learn along the way. There are alot of blanks in my mind even though i feel like I have the basics in my head.

PastorofMuppets said:

I dont know how to mark my boil kettle to know how much wort i will end up with after the runoff. I can measure how much goes into the MLT and how much goes into the fermenter after the boil, but how can i know how much i get before boil? I have always done full volume 6.5 gal boils with extract. Am i supposed to check gravity before I boil or only after?
I was thinking of having DME on hand if I come up short of the intended gravity. ahhh so many questions i have. I just need to do a few batches and learn along the way. There are alot of blanks in my mind even though i feel like I have the basics in my head.

Click to expand...

I've found this problem more of a learning process. Once you get use to your system doing all grain, you get a feel for how much water you'll need. For me, it took about 3 times on my system to get a good feel. Now I make sure I boil with 7 gallons to get to 5.5 at the end for an hour long boil, but thats just me personally.

My advice is to physically fill your boiling kettle with water, one gallon at a time and measure the depth after each addition to determine exactly the gallons per inch in your kettle. That way if you know you need say 6.7 gallons pre-boil to boil down correctly in 60 minutes for a 5.0 gallon batch, you can simply make a mark on a stick at the proper depth in the kettle for 6.7 gallons and sparge until you reach that volume depth.

I say this because it's difficult to guesstimate your sparge water volume until you have your system dialed in. Much easier to just measure your wort depth in the kettle as you sparge.

Having a site glass on the kettle to measure is great "bling" to have.... I really need to put one on mine.

For those that cant afford a site glass...

• get a piece of 1 inch PVC or something... 6 inches to a foot longer than your kettle is tall
• Get an accurate measurement vessel (Restaurant supply store's carry them or a milk jug if you are cheap)
• Pour 1 gallon into your kettle at a time and mark the PVC or whatever stick you are using
• Measure out and mark up to 8-9 gallons or so if you are doing 5 gallon batches

Then to check your volume roughly, just stick the pipe or stick into your kettle and eye it. During a rolling boil or while heated it will read a little high due to roughly 4% expansion and the motion of the boil. When chilled to room temperature it should be pretty accurate if you did it right.

ApothecaryBrewing said:

For those that cant afford a site glass...

• get a piece of 1 inch PVC or something... 6 inches to a foot longer than your kettle is tall
• Get an accurate measurement vessel (Restaurant supply store's carry them or a milk jug if you are cheap)
• Pour 1 gallon into your kettle at a time and mark the PVC or whatever stick you are using
• Measure out and mark up to 8-9 gallons or so if you are doing 5 gallon batches

Then to check your volume roughly, just stick the pipe or stick into your kettle and eye it. During a rolling boil or while heated it will read a little high due to roughly 4% expansion and the motion of the boil. When chilled to room temperature it should be pretty accurate if you did it right.

Click to expand...

thanks thats awesome info. What is the best way to mark the pvc? Marker notch it? what do you suggest?

I have been trying to configure and learn beersmith, but i think its serving more to confuse me rather than make things easier. which is unfortunate cause it wasnt free. im sure it will help me out soon.

If you want to avoid sharpie somehow washing off into your beer... you can mark it with a thin sharpie then go at it with a hacksaw or dremel to remove the sharpie and turn it into a notch or groove.

Also poke around for a material that wont melt or seep chemicals into your beer if you are dropping it in the boil. I just mentioned PVC but I am unsure of the temperature rating on it. There are plenty of cheap materials out there.. just needs to withstand 212F

I used my mash spoon which happens to be the same stainless steel spatula that I use for grilling and marked gallon ticks on it with a file. It aint pretty but it works

I mark my spoon also.

I drain my mash and measure the volume. Then for sparging I just add enough water to make it to the pre-boil volume I want.

For example. If I use 4 gallons for the mash, and get 2 1/2 in the pot after draining. I then know that I need 4 more gallons of sparge to hit 6 1/2 gallon pre-boil volume. The grain will not absorb any more water and the dead space that does not drain is already filled, so adding just enough sparge water to get final volume works every time for me.

The first few brews are about getting your system figured out. Volumes and efficiency.

Here is a good calculator for figuring out your efficiency. http://www.brewersfriend.com/brewhouse-efficiency/

This comes in handy when you are doing a recipe. Just set your efficiency in your software to what your average efficiency is. You want to try to get consistent efficiency.

I always get about 73% efficiency within a percent or two. There is no need to chase really high efficiency, just get to the point where you get a consistent efficiency.

Oh and it is wise to talk to your wife before taking a file to her favorite spatula...Just saying

I was considering buying myself a stainless mash paddle and using that.
I have a 21 inch stainless spoon already but i dont know if its tall enough or not at this point.

My wife is super supportive, but didnt like it when i told her what SWMBO meant, lol

Beer Smith takes a little to get use to, watch the video. It saves me so much time I love it, I could never go back.

PastorofMuppets said:

My wife is super supportive, but didnt like it when i told her what SWMBO meant, lol

Click to expand...

My GF responded in an opposite manner. She was okay with me brewing but once she found out about SWMBO and what it meant, she wears that badge with honor... too much honor... i am scared for my life.

Walk yourself, literally, through your process the day before. Stop and think at each step, what do I need here? Helped me tons before my first brewday, realized what equipment I needed on hand for example that I needed another bucket in order to transport water back and forth (mashing in the house) etc...

I missed whether or not your grains are precrushed, if not, do that the night before, just saves a ton of time and one less thing to worry about on your first AG day.

I wish I had mash temp adjustment calculators handy, looks like thats been mentioned.

Try to stay calm and not panic if you hit some bumps in the road. I also found it more difficult to be effective at all-grain and do it right if I enjoyed 1 too many beers before and during the process.

Advice from my last batch (3rd all grain overall): Make sure your water softener is filled up! Hard water will have an affect on mash efficiency.

jarnock said:

Advice from my last batch (3rd all grain overall): Make sure your water softener is filled up! Hard water will have an affect on mash efficiency.

Click to expand...

well i have no such device. i do have fairly hard water. I plan on adding ph stabilizer to the mash water before the dough in but is there something i should test for hardness? I dont want to get into needing a bunch of chemicals and stuff though. Maybe I should get a brita sink attachment filter or somethign like that.

I slways measure gravity and volume pre boil and post boil ( OG) Don't forget to write down temp of gravity samples if using hydrometer.

Of course the pre boil grav sample can go into the boil, but the OG sample should be discarded.

I batch sparge and like to also record volume and gravity of each batch collected. Not necessary I guess but interesting if I ever want to think about partigyle brews.

As you progress you can reevaluate how many measurements you want to track. I like getting technical, but understand that isn't for everyone and not necessary to make good beer.

But for your early batches seems better to err on side of too many measurements and too detailed notes.

And yes a sight glass is great item. A refractometer is another bit of not too expensive gear that makes getting multiple grav samples during brew day a snap.

One final idea is a good brew day checklist. I'm assuming beer smith provides one you can print. They are helpful.

PastorofMuppets said:

well i have no such device. i do have fairly hard water. I plan on adding ph stabilizer to the mash water before the dough in but is there something i should test for hardness? I dont want to get into needing a bunch of chemicals and stuff though. Maybe I should get a brita sink attachment filter or somethign like that.

Click to expand...

Water chemistry might be overkill on your first AG batch. If your water is not good to drink maybe use spring water from grocery store. Brita filter will remove chlorine but not hardness. You could just brew something that likes hard water like an ipa.

eric19312 said:

Water chemistry might be overkill on your first AG batch. If your water is not good to drink maybe use spring water from grocery store. Brita filter will remove chlorine but not hardness. You could just brew something that likes hard water like an ipa.

Click to expand...

my extract brews have been fine with my tap water.
I didnt know that hardness can mess with efficiency, and im not sure i care.
I will pay a little more for more grain rather than buying water.

I didn't have a refractometer for my first 2 brews. It really helps to measure your mash efficiency before you add hops. Now I keep an extra pound or two of DME on hand to hit my desired gravity. If you don't have DME on hand, plug the new efficiency into beersmith, and maybe adjust hops accordingly.

The best advice I've seen so far, if you're batch sparging, is to measure the volume of your first runnings, subtract that amount from your expected boil volume, and use the result for mashing out/second infusion. With a sight glass on my boil kettle I fly sparge until I have my desired boil volume, check SG with the refractometer, and adjust accordingly with DME.

Jayhem said:

My advice is to physically fill your boiling kettle with water, one gallon at a time and measure the depth after each addition to determine exactly the gallons per inch in your kettle. That way if you know you need say 6.7 gallons pre-boil to boil down correctly in 60 minutes for a 5.0 gallon batch, you can simply make a mark on a stick at the proper depth in the kettle for 6.7 gallons and sparge until you reach that volume depth.

I say this because it's difficult to guesstimate your sparge water volume until you have your system dialed in. Much easier to just measure your wort depth in the kettle as you sparge.

Click to expand...

I did this. Has worked out wonderful for me.

PastorofMuppets said:

I cant figure out how to enter the type of system i have into beersmith.

I have on the way the 10 gallon cooler and 10 gallon boil kettle.
I am only going to do 5 gallon batches for now. Do i want to select the 5 gallon cooler from the equipment in beersmith or the 10 gallon and then scale back to 5 gallon recipe?

When I scale back my gravity takes a nose dive.

Click to expand...

I use the same equipment and do 5.5 gallon batches in BS to yeild 5 gallons at bottling.

Can you use the diameter of your kettle and google boil off calculators? is your cooler a rubbermaid? DO you have a false bottom?

If yes to most of the questions I can send you my profile in BS. I have it dialed in pretty tight. you would just need to measure the deadspace under the false bottom.

I've used my hard (filtered) tap water to great effect. I'm thinking about, in the future, using it for porters and stouts (and maybe browns), while diluting it about 50/50 with distilled water (at least the strike water) for paler beers to see if that makes a difference.