theveganbrewer
Well-Known Member
I am very impressed we somehow managed to steer this discussion to an actual recipe. Well done.
Raw Vegan brewing.
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zzARzz
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My cousin's Vegan and I know how much s%^& they take, so I like to make sure she has something special every Thanksgiving. It may not be my lifestyle, but I'm always sure to be respectful of her's and others'. Besides, a weird problem like a vegan/raw foods brew just gives me an opportunity to learn.
Whattawort
Well-Known Member
A good friend of mine's wife is a vegetarian (ovo/lacto) and it's actually kind of fun to make something that she'd eat that I've never made before. A bit of a crap shoot, but she's a good sport about it and usually gives me honest feedback on it. We still give her a hard time about her being a veggie, but that's only because she gives it right back to us and doesn't get her feelings hurt. Thankfully, she digs my beer so if the food I made is inedible, I can make it up to her with beer. Nothin' wrong with a liquid lunch every now and then.
I think I'm missing the point. It's one thing to be very careful that your homebrew doesn't have any animal derivatives (most of us are OK there) but the concept of making it conform to raw vegan seems misplaced. I understand (or think I do), the primary motive to sticking to a raw diet, but unless your cousin strictly adheres due to the concept of harmful effects of heating, I think I'd just say hey, this is completely vegan but the brewing process requires boiling if that bothers you. If you find that it does, offer up a hard cider. I keep at least one caffeine free, sugar free soda in my bev fridge for guests that require that, but I'm not going to brew a 60 calorie near beer for dieting alcoholic guests just because I happen to brew beer.
JordanThomas
Well-Known Member
Yea, I would pretty much agree. But if people want to try, they should. My comment earlier was, why would someone adhering to a raw food diet want to consume alcohol. I thought part of the philosophy was keeping bad stuff out of your body. Unless someone wants to argue that alcohol is good for you...
I wonder- would sulfites (campden tabs) but totally out of line for the raw vegan angle? First, they will sanitize the must so infection won't happen (lacto primarily would be a risk), and I use it in my wine. Secondly, the sulfite would dissipate quickly, so it wouldn't actually be "in" the beer(?) after fermentation gets going.
I wouldn't argue that it's good for you- but I would say that it isn't harmful and may offer health benefits in small amounts.
Mongrel
Well-Known Member
Another issue that I don't think has been mentioned, might have missed it in the 17 pages, is that commercial hops are kilned at a temperature higher than the raw diet would allow. So, if you want to do this, you're going to have to start growing, and air drying your hops.
zzARzz
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Nah, my cousin's your average, run-of-the-mill vegan. She drinks beer with the rest of us (and bourbon with me :cross: ) as long as it doesn't have any animal byproducts (like gelatin for fining, white sugar processed with bone char, etc.).
This was more of a thought experiment for me than something I find necessary or something that should even be attempted.
The raw food diet and vegan diet are separate things, so raw foodies may eat meat as long as it isn't cooked (some will, at any rate... and yuck...) and vegans will eat cooked everything as long as it doesn't involve critters. The OP was for a recipe that was both vegan AND raw food diet compliant, which is where the trouble came in for making a beer with both in mind. If it was just vegan it would be easy, as a few have already said on this meandering thread.
I'd, personally, edit that to be "some people that call themselves vegans eat honey"
An actual vegan, not someone that simply follows a vegan diet, wouldn't use animal products in clothes or other products (at least as much is possible in our society).
bottlebomber
Well-Known Member
afr0byte said:
As a vegetarian who has routinely been offered chicken and fish under the premise that "some vegetarians eat chicken", I heartily support your refinement of my post
I guess the posts I don't get in this thread (and in the world at large, for that matter) are the ones that think it's funny to say (I'm paraphrasing) "Hurrr, I'm going to go eat something I think vegans will find especially repulsive." I have to assume the intent is to insult vegans as a whole, but I don't know.
bottlebomber
Well-Known Member
afr0byte said:
Well, yeah. I guess you could come around with "I hope you get cancer from your charbroiled meat and die!", but why engage lol. It's usually all in good fun. And also usually from fat people
Well, yeah. I guess you could come around with "I hope you get cancer from your charbroiled meat and die!", but why engage lol. It's usually all in good fun. And also usually from fat people
True, there's no reason to engage. I guess I just don't understand how it's funny to say something similar to what I paraphrased.
theveganbrewer
Well-Known Member
I going to go eat some kale chips :rockin:
JordanThomas
Well-Known Member
Well, yeah. I guess you could come around with "I hope you get cancer from your charbroiled meat and die!", but why engage lol. It's usually all in good fun. And also usually from fat people
Hmm... While I agree that people saying "ZOMG JALAPENOS STUFFED WITH SAUSAGE AND CHEESE AND ROLLED IN BACON AND DEEP FRIED IN LARD SO GOOD" is a bit ridiculous and yes, just to make health-conscious people grossed out, labeling people fat without knowing who they are is pretty bad, too. You've said that several times in this thread, which is the only reason I'm pointing it out. Why even stoop to that level?
Well, yeah. I guess you could come around with "I hope you get cancer from your charbroiled meat and die!", but why engage lol. It's usually all in good fun. And also usually from fat people
I'm a fat meat eater and I have to say that was funny.
True, (maybe a little hurtful), but FUNNY!!!
bottlebomber
Well-Known Member
JordanThomas said:
It may be a little low, especially considering how self conscious people are about their bodies. And I apologize for any hurt feelings. However I will say that out of the thousands of times I've been ridiculed for my diet throughout my life, it had never been by a healthy-figured carnivore. And I know it's because they are projecting/venting their dissatisfaction with how they feel with themselves as a result of their own poor choices on me. The guy who walks up to me at the barbecue with a stick on a plate, always fat. The lady who makes a show out of wrinkling her nose at the salad I'm eating at lunch (which isn't THAT often for gods sake) always fat. So forgive me if I'M a little jaded. It's wasn't easy growing up this way in a redneck community I assure you.
JordanThomas
Well-Known Member
Well I was berated for using my experience as a device for simply sharing my thoughts on the topic earlier in this thread. I won't do the same to you, because I understand where you're coming from. While I love meat, and eat it daily, I am healthy, perhaps even low in weight. I do, however understand what you mean. Working in an office full of obese people has terrible qualities. I also get the "must be nice to be skinny" comments from overweight coworkers while I eat a burger or tacos, and then proceed to witness these same people consume the same, only in LARGER portions! It all comes down to this, though... Not everyone acts that way.
My wife was actually surprised at how few salads I ate when she first met me. I prefer something like steamed veggies (mushrooms and brussel sprouts are nice!) along with beans and some kind of whole grain (quinoa, amaranth, brown rice).
bottlebomber
Well-Known Member
Well, you did kind of say that you feel hostile toward every vegan you've met. That was on you. I agree that plenty of vegans are real *****ey, particularly the new converts. If you are keeping your body in good shape you get a tip of the hat from me regardless of what your diet is.JordanThomas said:
I've been eating more lately, but never been a salad guy. Lots of beans and whole grains. Lots of tofu. I've got some awesome tofu recipes if anyone is interestedafr0byte said:
I've been eating more lately, but never been a salad guy. Lots of beans and whole grains. Lots of tofu. I've got some awesome tofu recipes if anyone is interested
Yes, please. I've got ~7lbs of tofu in the fridge (Costco has it cheap, so we buy in bulk).
I can't stand tofu. I always figured I just didn't like the taste until talking to a vegetarian friend who said I may have an uncommon receptor, and that is why tofu tastes like dirt to me. I guess some people have the same thing with broccoli, if they have the receptor then broccoli is super bitter to them.
JordanThomas
Well-Known Member
Well, you did kind of say that you feel hostile toward every vegan you've met. That was on you. I agree that plenty of vegans are real *****ey, particularly the new converts. If you are keeping your body in good shape you get a tip of the hat from me regardless of what your diet is.
I've been eating more lately, but never been a salad guy. Lots of beans and whole grains. Lots of tofu. I've got some awesome tofu recipes if anyone is interested
Ughh... I need to stop following this thread. I said that because it's true. How is that bad? You painting every meat eater as fat is pretty bad. I wasn't saying every vegan was a jerk. Just all those that I have met. I really don't care anymore.
Yeah, that's definitely odd, since it basically doesn't have any taste unless you add something else to it via marinade or what not.
I think it came across as bad because bringing it up in this kind of thread makes it come across as you painting all vegans as jerks--seemingly adding to the circle-jerk of other comments (like "I'm going to go eat some veal!").
Bottlebomber is one of the more articulate people I know, so I hesitate to speak on his behalf, but:
Just to be clear, bottlebomber is making claims about people who ridicule him for being a vegetarian, not meat eaters. That's an important distinction in this context.
Just to be clear, bottlebomber is making claims about people who ridicule him for being a vegetarian, not meat eaters. That's an important distinction in this context.
JordanThomas
Well-Known Member
Good for you. I am guessing that your family is fairly big, also? Most of my family are very tall. I am 6'8" and some change and run around 210 during running season and about 220 during the off-season. Do I attribute that to my diet? No. I attribute it to the fact that my family members before me were/are very tall. Average height for the ladies runs around 6'2" or so, and average for the guys is around 6'5" or so.
I think that it is funny that you keep insinuating that meat-eaters tend to be fat (yes, you do insert the word "usually", but still). I actually don't know many vegetarians, and no vegans. Of the few vegetarians that I do know, over half of them I would consider to be a bit "chubby". Eating right is part of it. Another big part, IMO, is exercise. Even if you are only consuming veggies, but still wolf down massive amounts of calories and don't do anything but sit on the couch and watch TV, you are probably going to gain some weight.
Taste.
Everything aside, I truly do love vegetarians and vegans. Means more meat for me. :rockin:
I have no idea, but that's not what I said.
Perhaps you missed this post:
bottlebomber said:
...which seems strange because you just linked to it and put the same sentence in bold. :cross:
JordanThomas
Well-Known Member
That is a claim about both those who ridicule him, and meat eaters. My reading comprehension is fine. I realize that there is a high probability that I'm being trolled. So, I would really just appreciate it if my posts were no longer quoted. I'd rather not have to defend myself every time someone interprets something I said in a way that it was not meant.
I'll let him speak for himself when he comes back on.
Funny thing about that actually. I don't think I ever quoted you except when directly addressed by you. Conversely, you've pulled me into your world three or four times now.
JordanThomas
Well-Known Member
Thanks for letting us all know that you will let people speak for themselves.
BuddyWeiser
Well-Known Member
I was born with teeth that cut meat and crush raw vegetables & fruit pretty well. I don't feel like there's much of a decision here for me to make. I can prefer meats or prefer vegetables, but I ought to eat both.
Also, raw chicken + starsan =
Also, raw chicken + starsan =
bottlebomber
Well-Known Member
I will PM a few good ones this eveningafr0byte said:
Not what I ever said though is it. In fact, I specifically noted in a previous post that I suspected that empty carbohydrates were largely to blame for the obesity I see around me. I fact, I specifically noted that these would probably be better off eating a large, protein filled steak rather than, say, 6 little 1 oz bags of chips. I was, as Malfet was able to discern, speaking specifically of those who eat meat AND feel a need to ridicule others for their diet.JordanThomas said:
To me it tastes sort of earthy when raw.. I can see why someone would think of it as a dirt flavor lol. Most people seem to object to the texture, which is also something that's effected a lot by how you cook if.afr0byte said:
You're right, I don't KNOW. And so I accept that refinement on the statements I made. I am not qualified to made psychological diagnoses of why people do things. I will instead say that it often appears to be this way.JordanThomas said:
You're correct, I am large because of genetics. However, please note that I never said that I am large because of what I eat. I simply defended an accusation that a vegetarian diet is somehow nutrient deficient, and will truncate health. I used myself as an example because I am on the extreme for size, and so this is likely not an accurate statement. I am not making any claims that a vegetarian diet will trump genetics and allow you to grow to six and a half feet tall. Please quote my comment in which I said that meat eaters are usually fat, please. Most of the citizens of the earth eat meat, and are not nearly as obese as what is typical in this country.69Bronc said:Good for you. I am guessing that your family is fairly big, also? Most of my family are very tall. I am 6'8" and some change and run around 210 during running season and about 220 during the off-season. Do I attribute that to my diet? No. I attribute it to the fact that my family members before me were/are very tall. Average height for the ladies runs around 6'2" or so, and average for the guys is around 6'5" or so.
I think that it is funny that you keep insinuating that meat-eaters tend to be fat (yes, you do insert the word "usually", but still). I actually don't know many vegetarians, and no vegans. Of the few vegetarians that I do know, over half of them I would consider to be a bit "chubby". Eating right is part of it. Another big part, IMO, is exercise. Even if you are only consuming veggies, but still wolf down massive amounts of calories and don't do anything but sit on the couch and watch TV, you are probably going to gain some weight.
Taste.
Everything aside, I truly do love vegetarians and vegans. Means more meat for me. :rockin:
JordanThomas said:
I think you may be trolling yourself.
JordanThomas
Well-Known Member
Per your request.
Like I said, you insinuate the idea. It is not a big deal - I just thought it was funny.
I am a big carnivore, and I am not fat. I guess that my redneck upbringing turned out ok for me.
Well, yeah. I guess you could come around with "I hope you get cancer from your charbroiled meat and die!", but why engage lol. It's usually all in good fun. And also usually from fat people
Like I said, you insinuate the idea. It is not a big deal - I just thought it was funny.
I am a big carnivore, and I am not fat. I guess that my redneck upbringing turned out ok for me.
bottlebomber
Well-Known Member
69Bronc said:
Those remarks were discussing SPECIFICALLY those who feel a need to antagonize a vegetarian. It's quite obvious that that is what was being discussed.
Quite obvious, yes.
Well, I don't know you, so I won't antagonize you. Your record of thousands non-healthy figured people giving you crap about being a vegetarian will remain. But I give the few vegetarian friends that I have tremendous amounts of crap about their choice of diet. As you said, it is mostly in good fun. I truly don't understand the choice to be a vegetarian, though. That is one of those things that has always baffled me.
