gushing bottles--why?

I know this has been addressed several times, but I was looking for possible reasons why this has happened. This was a wit beer made last summer. All of the bottles recently have just gushed completely out on opening. I opened the last few today and noticed some rather large nasty particles floating up from the bottom as the foam churned out. In the past, I sort of waited out the foam and drank it (didn't notice those particles), and the beer was fine. Even today the little bit I tried was good. So what is causing the foaming? And what are those particles on the bottom?

My notes tell me I bottled the beer only after three weeks in primary--no secondary. Too much yeast still in suspension? Infection? This has never happened before or since (overcarbonation--usually the opposite). I'm fairly sure I didn't use too much priming sugar. Any ideas? (chemistry, technical info welcome).

Thanks.

Sounds like an infection. Especially considering how long it took to gush.

FWIW, you should drink a Wit young and while it's fresh, they age terribly.

+1 on the infection. It also may not have been fully fermented, but I doubt it. Did you do FG readings?

Yeah, it started 1.046 and finished 1.011. The funny thing is this was a second run (with extract added). The first was 1.040 to 1.009 with about an extra week of secondary with watermelon. I'm actually drinking the last of that today and it's fine. These had separate yeast, etc., of course. (Mash efficiency and temp control on that brew day is another issue...)

A couple of things could cause this, but since you say it's all bottles of a particular batch it's probably safe to say that it came down to sanitation of the bottles, caps, or your bottling bucket during the bottling process. When you have a gusher that just seems to appear randomly in a batch it's most likely due to just some gunk stuck in the bottom of a bottle or a glitch in sanitation.

If you use a bottling bucket, now would be a good time to take apart the spigot and make sure it's cleaned very well. This is a perfect hiding spot for microscopic nasties. This goes for your bottling wand, siphon, and anything else you use on bottling day. Then, double check your bottle/cap sanitation procedure and make sure that's all kosher.

It sucks, but I had a batch like this not long ago. It made me especially mad because it was a winter warmer and I had the patience to let it sit a month in primary, another two months in secondary, and another month in bottles before even tasting one. They were actually pretty good young and didn't have a gushing problem, but with more time in the bottles it turned out they were all gushers with a rancid vegetable type smell and flavor (although a friend of mine drank one and then asked for another ). After going over every piece of my bottling operation with some extensive cleaning the next batch I bottled came out 100% perfect.

Sanitation = sanity.

Seriously.

Think about your process each step of the way and try to remember if you may have missed anything. Even if you didn't have an infection, it's a great exercise and one that all brewers of all levels ought to do from time to time. Thing is, folks just getting started ought to think about it even more until they become so inured with cleanliness habits that they become second nature. That doesn't mean get overly anal-retentive, just use your good sense and make sure everything is spic and span before you take the next step with your brews.

When I bottle, I always take a good 5-15 seconds to inspect each bottle and make sure it's really clean - bare glass top to bottom - before I put in my final sanitizer. Personally, I use Star-San as a final rinse and use a bottle rack to let them air dry. Works great. I also keep my caps in a solution of Star-San until they are crimped atop the bottle. I've not had an infected bottle for literally 30 years now. (No, Star-San hasn't been around that long, and I used other sanitizers back in the day.)

Bummer that you lost some brew, but as it is with all things, take it as a learning experience and use the knowledge you gain as a stepping stone to better things.

Definitely a wild yeast (or gusher bug) infection.
If you want us to help you, you'll have to describe your sanitation process.

Thanks. I'm actually pretty fastidious about cleaning, including taking the spigot and rubber bits apart every time--usually even after each bottling session and before the next. Which doesn't mean an infection didn't happen in this case. I had the same experience as you. I didn't notice a gusher until we were celebrating my daughter's birth in early October, but every bottle since then was like that. Before that, they were OK. I hadn't noticed the nasty particles, though. One I opened today clearly had yeast sediment on the bottom and that basically exploded in the kitchen when I opened it (had been in basement, ~60 degrees--was thinking it might gush less when warm--wrong), but the others didn't have much on the bottom. Is there a specific name for this gushing bug? Or could it be any of many different microorganisms?

Cleaning is not sanitizing, and sanitizing is not cleaning. It took me a few batches to figure that out. You need to do both.

What products are you using, and how are you using them?

To last poster-- I wash the bucket before and after as I said (with regular dishwashing soap usually--straight A from time to time). I use star san before bottling. The bottles usually soak in it, and the bucket, wand, caps, etc. get a healthy dose. Like I said, I've never had this problem before or since. I can accept there was a misstep in this case. Good lesson in being careful at all times. Weird that I wouldn't have noticed it if I had drunk the beer a lot faster.

mrjeffrey said:

Thanks. I'm actually pretty fastidious about cleaning, including taking the spigot and rubber bits apart every time--usually even after each bottling session and before the next. Which doesn't mean an infection didn't happen in this case. I had the same experience as you. I didn't notice a gusher until we were celebrating my daughter's birth in early October, but every bottle since then was like that. Before that, they were OK. I hadn't noticed the nasty particles, though. One I opened today clearly had yeast sediment on the bottom and that basically exploded in the kitchen when I opened it (had been in basement, ~60 degrees--was thinking it might gush less when warm--wrong), but the others didn't have much on the bottom. Is there a specific name for this gushing bug? Or could it be any of many different microorganisms?

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The only specific name they have is a "gusher" bug. It's because it could be any number of things. A wild yeast from the outside, leftover bugs on equipment from something else, etc. Sometimes the problem is simply way too much CO2 and it doesn't impart any off-flavors in the beer. In other cases (like mine) you can get some real nasty flavors from that particular bug.

The best thing you can do is just make sure you stick to your sanitation process, which it appears you're doing. It happens to the best of us

You guys reply faster than I can respond--thanks. The bottles get sanitized in a dishwasher usually before sanitizing with starsan. I do wash everything else, but never in bleach. I use a cleaner like straight A from time to time, but not after every batch.

mrjeffrey said:

To last poster-- I wash the bucket before and after as I said (with regular dishwashing soap usually--straight A from time to time). I use star san before bottling. The bottles usually soak in it, and the bucket, wand, caps, etc. get a healthy dose. Like I said, I've never had this problem before or since. I can accept there was a misstep in this case. Good lesson in being careful at all times. Weird that I wouldn't have noticed it if I had drunk the beer a lot faster.

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Do you use some sort of cleanser that breaks down organic compounds (pbw, or oxiclean...not soap, which is just a surfactant) when cleaning your bottles, prior to sanitizing them with star-san? If you don't, there is all sorts of leftover "stuff" in your bottles that is hiding micro-organisms so the star-san can't reach them to kill them.

mrjeffrey said:

You guys reply faster than I can respond--thanks. The bottles get sanitized in a dishwasher usually before sanitizing with starsan. I do wash everything else, but never in bleach. I use a cleaner like straight A from time to time, but not after every batch.

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I really don't think this is sound process. I don't think much of the water from a dishwater would find its way up into the bottles. Even if they get really hot, they likely aren't getting truly clean. You should soak the bottles in Straight-A, or pbw, or oxiclean (which is much cheaper) every single time. Use really hot water, and soak for several hours, or just overnight. Then either soak in starsan, or use a vinator with starsan.

Thanks. I think this is a good lesson. I probably should use straight a or pbx or one of the other cleaners more often. I do use a bottle washer, and visually inspect every bottle. And my dishwasher does have a sanitize function, for what it's worth.

Along the same lines, I made my first wine yesterday and didn't really understand the recommendation to sanitize everything with metabisulphites, but I dutifully did that (straight a to clean everything, then star san per my habit, then the potassium metabisulphites as well), figuring there's fewer places for off-flavors to hide in wine.

I try to have a don't worry attitude usually and think about the monks brewing outdoors in open fermentation barrels. But even those these are the first three beers I've poured down the drain, it's still an eye-opener.

I recently bottled a 1 gallon batch (beginner here) and all my bottles are gushing. I'm fairly sure I hit the amount of priming sugar for 1 gallon (about 2/3 cup of sugar split between two gallons) and I boiled it before use. Everything was cleaned with oxyclean and then one step sanitized, including all hoses and siphons, etc. Every bottle gushes like crazy even if I try to let some CO2 out for a half hour before hand. However, the beer doesn't have any crazy off flavors. If anything it has a slight metallic taste to it, almost coppery.

Am I freaking out or did I just use too much primary sugar? Left the beer in a primary for three weeks.

I'd say way too much priming sugar. I think for a 5 gallon batch at room temperature, you'd use about 5 ounces of corn sugar, or slightly less table sugar. Check out this link:
http://www.northernbrewer.com/priming-sugar-calculator/
Sounds like you used about double what you should have

Yes definitely too much sugar. Use 1 oz. per gallon if you're not carbing to style. So 2 oz. for 2 gallons which is way less than 2/3 cup. Measuring with volume is inaccurate, go with weight measurements and you'll always be good.

Thanks guys. Hopefully this doesn't happen again. Got another gallon in the pipeline....

It could also be sediments from improper lautering. This step just takes a lot of time

Yeah make sure the bottles are clean before put them into the dishwasher. Get a bottle brush also if you don't have one.

My procedure is to soak bottles in a sink for of oxy clean water, then take the bottling brush and clean insides of them, rinse with water, then into the dishwasher and finally rinse with star san before bottling (can't be too cautious).

BUT since all of your bottles recently have been gushing and you're spraying them visually clean with water before hand, I'd think you might have gotten lucky and had at least a few clean bottles in there. I'd assume the cause of your infection is somewhere else in your bottling procedure.

6 months ago I had 3 infected batches and I narrowed it down to my bottling bucket spigot or the auto siphon. I replaced both and that took care of the problem.

The terrible thing about my wild yeast infection is that Star San didn't seem to stop them (luckily heat worked).

This has happened to me three times. First two times was overcarbonation due to much priming sugar. The 3rd time was unfinnished fermentation. Always check your FG before botteling and mix the priming solution well.

I've read through this whole thread so far and learned a couple things; Thank you all for the info. Please don't hate me for hijacking it for a moment... I came upon this thread because I'm having an issue with gushing bottles. It is likely because I started bottling too soon.

At this point I think it would be worth asking "What can I do with these gushers?" The beer is acceptable flavor and I would like to salvage it if possible. Has anyone here tried to degas and re-bottle? Any other ideas?

One thing I'll offer as far as bottling too soon - reaching expected FG isn't the whole story. Take two gravity readings 2 - 3 days apart. If gravity drops, it isn't finished.

As far as de-gassing, I haven't tried it, but since the bottles are gushing, be really careful when handling and opening them - they could get worse and explode.

habrew said:

I've read through this whole thread so far and learned a couple things; Thank you all for the info. Please don't hate me for hijacking it for a moment... I came upon this thread because I'm having an issue with gushing bottles. It is likely because I started bottling too soon.

At this point I think it would be worth asking "What can I do with these gushers?" The beer is acceptable flavor and I would like to salvage it if possible. Has anyone here tried to degas and re-bottle? Any other ideas?

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I watched this a few weeks ago ... [ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itrjDXPKEGw[/ame]