Saison Wallonia Basil Lime Saison

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dcHokie

dcHokie

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2010
Messages
1,554
Reaction score
270
Location
Washington, DC
Recipe Type
All Grain
Yeast
Wyeast 3711
Yeast Starter
1 Liter
Batch Size (Gallons)
5.5
Original Gravity
1.068
Final Gravity
1.006
Boiling Time (Minutes)
75
IBU
32
Color
4
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp)
7 days @ 70, then 14 days @ 80
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp)
none
Tasting Notes
bright citrus upfront balances earthy, peppery farmhouse notes
Basil-Lime Saison

% LB OZ Malt or Fermentable ppg °L
78% 8 0 Belgian Pils info 37 2
10% 1 0 German Wheat info 39 2
10% 1 0 Flaked Wheat info 38 2
2% 0 4 Munich Malt info 37 9
10 4
Batch size: 5.5 gallons

Original Gravity (1.050 to 1.058)
Final Gravity (1.011 to 1.013)
Color 4° SRM / 8° EBC (Yellow)
Mash Efficiency 75%

Mashed 60-70 minutes at 155
Double batch sparged

boil 60 mins 1.0 Saaz pellet 3.5
boil 10 mins 0.5 Sorachi Ace pellet 13.7
boil 5 mins 0.5 Sorachi Ace pellet 13.7
boil 1 min 1.0 Sorachi Ace pellet 13.7
Boil: 6.5 avg gallons for 60 mins

32.1 IBU / 4 HBU
Wyeast French Saison (3711)

boil 10 min .25 ounces Dried Lime Peel
boil 5 min .25 ounces Dried Lime Peel
boil 5 min 1 oz (handful) fresh basil leaves


This beer was my entry in a 2 club competition based on 'Iron Chef'. We had to brew within certain OG/FG/IBU parameters and Sorachi Ace and Lime Peel were our 'secret ingredients'. It was the first recipe I'd created and my first Saison, but it placed 3rd in the competition.

One of the better, if not the best, beers I've made. I lucked into guessing the perfect amount (IMO) of basil. The basil really isn't present in the aroma, but has a few subtle hints in the upfront flavor and balances nicely with the lemongrass flavor of the Sorachi Ace. The lime peel pairs nicely with the SA as well, but is most noticeable in the light, meringue-like head. 3711 brings out some farmy, peppery flavors. Light, effervescent, and refreshing but with enough complexity to stay interesting.

The color is a bit lighter than this picture.

saison_3711_bottled.jpg
 
ProfessorSTAFF said:
Two weeks at 80 degrees? Isn't that a bit high? I'm not sure how I'd even maintain that temp in my carboy
Click to expand...

The saison yeast strains can handle pretty high temps. Actually you don't need to ramp up the Wyeast 3711 nearly as much as the more finicky Dupont strain.

I had this beer in a 6.5 gal glass carboy, wrapped it up in a down blanket and then put a fleece jacket over top of that. I left it in a spare bedroom, closed the AC vent, and put several lamps without lampshades nearby, and put a towel under the door. The room temp actually got up to the low 90s and held there, but the thermometer sticker and a digital thermometer affixed to the glass held right around 80. Maybe not the most efficient, but the gravity dropped significantly after that and I ended up with a pretty darn good beer.
 
ProfessorSTAFF said:
Two weeks at 80 degrees? Isn't that a bit high? I'm not sure how I'd even maintain that temp in my carboy
Click to expand...

I used a Wyeast saison yeast (forget which one) that wouldn't ferment below 70. I turned a space heater toward my carboy and let it get into the mid-to-upper 70's. Never took it to 80, but I have heard of people going as high as 90.
 
eulipion2 said:
I used a Wyeast saison yeast (forget which one) that wouldn't ferment below 70. I turned a space heater toward my carboy and let it get into the mid-to-upper 70's. Never took it to 80, but I have heard of people going as high as 90.
Click to expand...

it was likely Wyeast 3724, their strain description: This strain is notorious for a rapid and vigorous start to fermentation, only to stick around 1.035 S.G. Fermentation will finish, given time and warm temperatures. Warm fermentation temperatures at least 90°F (32°C) or the use of a secondary strain can accelerate attenuation.
 
Brewing this on Saturday. Did you do anything to the basil or just drop the whole leaves into the boil?
 
29thfloor said:
Brewing this on Saturday. Did you do anything to the basil or just drop the whole leaves into the boil?
Click to expand...

I picked the leaves straight from the plant and dropped them right in at flameout. I recall just using a loose handful or so.

Good luck with the brewday, let us know how it turns out!
 
I have this kegged now. I ended up only using 1 oz of Sorachi Ace. The LHBS didn't have any more and I didn't feel like waiting. Other than that it's the same recipe.

You can definitely taste the basil right away. I'm guessing using 1oz of the Sorachi Ace instead of 2oz is giving the basil more room to come out. I like it, but I think next time I would either make sure I use 2 oz of Sorachi or just go with less basil.

Overall it's really good though.
 
29thfloor said:
I have this kegged now. I ended up only using 1 oz of Sorachi Ace. The LHBS didn't have any more and I didn't feel like waiting. Other than that it's the same recipe.

You can definitely taste the basil right away. I'm guessing using 1oz of the Sorachi Ace instead of 2oz is giving the basil more room to come out. I like it, but I think next time I would either make sure I use 2 oz of Sorachi or just go with less basil.

Overall it's really good though.
Click to expand...

Glad you like it. Some folks that tasted mine immediately recognized the basil flavor while others could barely discern an herbal presence from the hops and lime. In mine the basil mellowed out a bit over time and melded with the citrus of the Sorachi. Pretty subjective, but I actually wish mine had a bit more basil and a bit less lime.

I recently brewed another saison with thai basil and peppercorns and the aroma is quite distinct.
 
Just brewed this the other day. I dropped the pilsner to 5 # and added 3# of golden promise and changed the munich to 2oz. Will see how it turns out.
 
It's very cloudy still. I have it at about 81F and has been at that temp for maybe a now. Still very cloudy. Is this normal?
 
I believes its been 12 days altogether so far. I think.i was considering cold crashing after 21 or so days to clarify things. What do u suggest?
 
SloppyGriffin said:
I believes its been 12 days altogether so far. I think.i was considering cold crashing after 21 or so days to clarify things. What do u suggest?
Click to expand...

I don't cold crash saisons, but that is my personal preference. Generally though, for any rustic beer with a decent percentage of wheat I would just say let it ride.
 
Actually now im not sure if it trly is an infection. This morning i checked it and i notciced white bubbly flake things on the surface as well with a slight translucent film near the edges. I looked up what it could be and some people said that it could just be "rogue" something. i forget. I smelt it though and it smells like it used to but then i smell again and there's this toasty sort of smell coming from it. Any thoughts?
 
Let it run its course and then taste. Tastes and smells change during the course of fermentation, and even at bottling, so a taste/aroma that's there now might be gone next week.
 
I've seen some pretty weird things on fermenting beer that weren't anything to do with infections. I even have a Saison fermenting right now that I "infected" on purpose. As long as it tastes good I wouldn't worry about it too much.

If you really think it's something nasty though, post a photo so we can get a better idea of what you're looking at.
 
So i dont believe this is an infection. Heres why. A week ago i added a package of dry yeast that i had sparred from a coopers. Brewing kit months prior. I added it in addition to the already active yeast because the fizzing and activity had halted. Heres why i double guessed myself. When i mashed i had added too hot of water to the grain causing it to produce too few fermentable.sugars. Believe the mash temp was like 175. Clearly i have learned my mashing lesson but thats why i added the yeast, thought i could pickup.where the other yeast left off. It is now my beliefe that this film and white bubble spots are the yeast i added. Perhaps they were expired or something
 
That actually does look like a pellicle to me, especially if those white spots are bubbles. I'm not sure adding more yeast would do something like that. You might get some yeast "rafts" floating on the surface but most of the yeast would either be in suspension or drop out and collect at the bottom of the bucket. Expired yeast would be mostly dead yeast so it just wouldn't do anything (unless the package was somehow contaminated).

So, it could be an infection but like I said some infections can actually make your beer taste better (if you like sour/funky beer). I would let it go for while and see how the flavor develops. As long as it doesn't taste like pure vinegar there's a chance you could end up with something good.
 
Well the aroma given off has become more like what it was before i noticed the stuff.And i have not seen any further development of mold or anything more serious so perhaps i will get a feux lambic style saisson? gonna be hard to share that with people tho lol.
 
My base beer was a little different but I brewed this for a friend's wedding. It got rave reviews and is probably one of the better beers I've brewed. For the lime addition I zested one lime and added it at 2 different times at the end of the boil. For the basil, I measured out 1 oz of fresh leaves and threw them in at flame out (I did not chop them or anything). The lime was just noticeable in flavor, and the basil was definitely present but not overpowering. Most people would smell it and know there was something familiar about it but I had to tell them it was basil for them to figure it out.

Recipe Type: All Grain
Yeast: Wyeast 3711 French Saison (2 vials)
Yeast Starter: none
Batch Size (Gallons): 5.5
Original Gravity: 1.051
Final Gravity: 1.004
IBU: 26.7
Boiling Time (Minutes): 90
Color: SRM 4.7
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 3 weeks at 67 to 80F (see notes below
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): none
Tasting Notes: Basil noticeable in aroma, meld well with Sorachi Ace hops. Lime adds a nice citrus kick.

Basil Lime Saison

Grain
Amount Item Type % or IBU
9.00 lb Belgian Pilsner (2.0 SRM) Grain 77.4%
0.75 lb Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 6.5%
0.75 lb White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) Grain 6.5%
0.175 lb Caramunich Malt (56.0 SRM) Grain 1.1%

1 lb Cane Sugar (at 10 minutes)


Hops/Other
1 oz Hallertauer [4.80 %] (45 min) Hops 14.2 IBU
0.25 oz Fresh Lime zest (10 min)
0.5 oz Sorachi Ace [12.00%] (10 min) Hops 7 IBU
0.25 oz fresh Lime zest (5 min)
0.5 oz Sorachi Ace [12.00%] (5 min) Hops 7 IBU
0.5 oz Sorachi Ace [12.00%] (1 min) Hops 7 IBU
1 oz Fresh Basil leaves (1 min)

Yeast
Wyeast 3711 French Saison

Mash Schedule
Mash at 149F for 75 min.

Yeast nutrient (1 tsp) for last 15 min of boil
Whirlfloc for last 10 min of boil

Fermentation Schedule
Day 1: 69F
Day 4: 71F (start a ramp-up to make sure yeast dries beer fully)
Day 5: 72F
Day 6: 74F
Day 7: 76F
Day 10: 80F
 
2thGuy said:
My base beer was a little different but I brewed this for a friend's wedding. It got rave reviews and is probably one of the better beers I've brewed. For the lime addition I zested one lime and added it at 2 different times at the end of the boil. For the basil, I measured out 1 oz of fresh leaves and threw them in at flame out (I did not chop them or anything). The lime was just noticeable in flavor, and the basil was definitely present but not overpowering. Most people would smell it and know there was something familiar about it but I had to tell them it was basil for them to figure it out.

Recipe Type: All Grain
Yeast: Wyeast 3711 French Saison (2 vials)
Yeast Starter: none
Batch Size (Gallons): 5.5
Original Gravity: 1.051
Final Gravity: 1.004
IBU: 26.7
Boiling Time (Minutes): 90
Color: SRM 4.7
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 3 weeks at 67 to 80F (see notes below
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): none
Tasting Notes: Basil noticeable in aroma, meld well with Sorachi Ace hops. Lime adds a nice citrus kick.

Basil Lime Saison

Grain
Amount Item Type % or IBU
9.00 lb Belgian Pilsner (2.0 SRM) Grain 77.4%
0.75 lb Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 6.5%
0.75 lb White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) Grain 6.5%
0.175 lb Caramunich Malt (56.0 SRM) Grain 1.1%

1 lb Cane Sugar (at 10 minutes)


Hops/Other
1 oz Hallertauer [4.80 %] (45 min) Hops 14.2 IBU
0.25 oz Fresh Lime zest (10 min)
0.5 oz Sorachi Ace [12.00%] (10 min) Hops 7 IBU
0.25 oz fresh Lime zest (5 min)
0.5 oz Sorachi Ace [12.00%] (5 min) Hops 7 IBU
0.5 oz Sorachi Ace [12.00%] (1 min) Hops 7 IBU
1 oz Fresh Basil leaves (1 min)

Yeast
Wyeast 3711 French Saison

Mash Schedule
Mash at 149F for 75 min.

Yeast nutrient (1 tsp) for last 15 min of boil
Whirlfloc for last 10 min of boil

Fermentation Schedule
Day 1: 69F
Day 4: 71F (start a ramp-up to make sure yeast dries beer fully)
Day 5: 72F
Day 6: 74F
Day 7: 76F
Day 10: 80F
Click to expand...

That looks and sounds great. Having a deft touch with spices/herbs/fruit such that they are perceptible, but not overbearing is really tricky IMO. Sounds like you nailed it on your batch. Glad to hear your beer went over so well at the wedding!
 
Hi all. I brewed this a little over a month ago and generally followed the OP recipe; don't have my notes in front of me but I know it was about 2 oz Sorachi at the back half of the boil plus a large handful of basil and the zest from two limes at flameout. Fermented at about 72-74 degrees for 12 days, and it has been hanging out in secondary almost three weeks now.

My sort-of problem: I'm getting NO basil scent/flavor from my samples. I know that it can still develop and meld, that's why it's in secondary. My thought is the Sorachi came on too strong and, combined with the yeast, created the very citrus flavor. Basically, it's a normal saison. Pleasantly sweet, very citrus, touch of coriander, etc from the yeast. (Wyeast 3711).

So, I'm thinking I may basil-dry-hop. I have plenty of fresh basil in my garden. Did anyone find that the basil came through stronger after bottling? Or has anyone tried this? I figure I'll grab a couple handfuls of basil, rinse, then rinse in Starsan, and toss them in the carboy.

Experts/everyone who knows more than I do (that's all of you), what do you think?
 
tmags711 said:
My sort-of problem: I'm getting NO basil scent/flavor from my samples. I know that it can still develop and meld, that's why it's in secondary. My thought is the Sorachi came on too strong and, combined with the yeast, created the very citrus flavor. Basically, it's a normal saison. Pleasantly sweet, very citrus, touch of coriander, etc from the yeast. (Wyeast 3711).
Click to expand...

In my original batch, the basil was pretty subtle.

tmags711 said:
So, I'm thinking I may basil-dry-hop. I have plenty of fresh basil in my garden. Did anyone find that the basil came through stronger after bottling? Or has anyone tried this? I figure I'll grab a couple handfuls of basil, rinse, then rinse in Starsan, and toss them in the carboy.

Experts/everyone who knows more than I do (that's all of you), what do you think?
Click to expand...

Did you basil-dry-hop this? Curious how that turned out.
 
I did! Two full handfuls of basil in secondary for six days. It added a very interesting bitterness, in a good way, and did definitely help out the nose of the beer.

Just cracked one open to get my notes right:

Nose - light, grassy, light lime finish if you know it's there
Taste - crisp citrus, basil comes through on the back end and lingers

It's a great drinking summer beer, was very popular. I will definitely be making it again with the full intention to 'dry-basil' it in secondary. I went for a higher volume of CO2 and serve this beer pretty well chilled. It is excellent. I'll post a picture of the next one I open. This one in front of me is too far gone to be worthy of a photo shoot :mug:
 
When you dry-hopped with Basil, did you sanitize the leaves first? Soak in a starsan mixture, or spray down with starsan?
 
Juno_Malone said:
When you dry-hopped with Basil, did you sanitize the leaves first? Soak in a starsan mixture, or spray down with starsan?
Click to expand...

I added the basil just after flameout during whirlpool so I wasn't concerned with sanitizing it. I didn't even rinse it, picked it fresh off the plants a few feet away and right into the boil kettle.
 
Mine's done!
Its a basil bomb! But in a great way.

This is definitely getting brewed again this summer.
 

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