Liquid Bread...

Hello all, this is my first post on these boards, so I figured I would post with a question.

I'm relitavely new to the homebrew scene, although I've done a lot of reading and studying.

I have only three batches under me. Tried extract the first time, and now I'm doing all grain.

About three weeks ago I brewed up my first American Ale, and when it came time to re-hydrate my yeast I noticed that the back of the package said it was good for 2.5 gallons. I was suprised because the last slap pack I used previously was good for 5 gallons. So I figured that was a standard quantity...

Well it was 11pm at night and I needed to pitch the yeast fairly soon. so I figured I would just add a little bread yeast and see how it turns out.

After one day in the keg the beer tasted quite bread-y. I wasn't sure if that's a result of using the bread yeast or just due to the fact that I think some was still in suspension.

As time passes it's getting more and more faint, but there's still a bread overtone to the beer. Has anyone else used bread yeast like this and had similar results?

I remember there was an episode of Basic Brewing where they made bread out of beer yeast and beer out of bread yeast. I think I remember them saying there wasn't a huge difference. Actually, all the first developed yeasts came from beer....bakers used to get yeast from brewers. But then again, yeasts weren't as modified as ours today. I would think type of bread yeast you're using is pretty big too.

As for why certain yeast packages have different recommended batch sizes: well every manufacturer has their own idea of what makes the best pitch cell count. Some brewers believe that even the yeast manufacturers packaged yeast isn't high enough (and hence make a starter).

I thought that I read somewhere that the yeast propagate and multiply themselves to the correct population for their environment? So I've always wondered why you need to make a starter for a big beer or any beer, will they stress out? Won't the yeast eventually have enough cells? Isn't that why the lag time? Is it to save lag time? So many questions . . . .
Vern.

COLObrewer said:

So many questions . . . .

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I hope you're not looking for an agreed upon answer No two yeast manufacturers or brewers probably agree on the exact number of cells you need to pitch. FWIW, I've had good results just pitching from the package (and letting the yeasts multiply more while pitched). I do believe my attenuation improved some, and there is less lag time by pitching with a starter though. There are so many variables that go into brewing though.....probably why no one holds all the answers to brewing: even though mankind has been doing it for thousands of years

if they were both Wyeast slap packs was one an "Activator" and the other a "Propagator"? Wyeast has two sizes.

Thanks for the input. I think it'll be ok, the bread aftertaste is fading fairly quick. It still has a fair amount of chill haze, but I think that's because I put the irish moss in for the whole boil and not the last 15 minutes...

Does anyone use clarifiers for porters or stouts where you can't see through them anyway?....

Or is that a pointless endeavor.

IXVolt said:

Does anyone use clarifiers for porters or stouts where you can't see through them anyway?....

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Nope, not a wasted effort to put irish moss in a stout. I do put it in all my stouts, and condition the way I do my light colored ales. They only thing I don't do is my final step of crash cooling for getting a really clear ale. To me, adding irish moss in a stout helps the yeast flocculate more: giving you a dryer/crisper flavor. Perfect for a dry Irish stout!

The only styles I wouldn't use IM or another clarifying agent are those style which are supposed to be cloudy. Darkness or color of the beer shouldn't be used as reasoning for not adding IM. The stuff isn't outrageously expensive and if you whirlpool it will help to keep alot of the trub out of your primary, which to me is better when trying to harvest/wash yeast. Although, some trub is supposed to be healthy for yeast, just ranting here.

There are historic styles that specifically call for bread yeast - bakers yeasts have their own particular flavour profiles. Its also possible that your brewers yeast outcompeted the bakers yeast and wound up the dominant population (depends if the growth conditions favoured one yeast over the other.)

I"ve used bread yeast to make mead, and mead often has less 'flavor' to hide imperfections like a bread yeast might leave behind.

all yeast is basically created equal. but, some yeast are better because they create fewer esters or phenols (or in some styles, more esters/phenols).

from my experience, I wouldn't worry too much. it might need just a little extra aging, and if you made the same exact beer with just the original smack pack, there might be a little difference in the end taste.

then again, maybe not. yeast ARE living organisms so it can be hard to predict what'll happen. but again, I wouldn't sweat it, and would just consider it an interesting experiment to learn from.