How to reach your arm into a 155F mash....

don't ask me know I know this, but I do. This may be of some value to someone out there

Lets say you strike, mash in... everything is cool. You realize, oh, crap... did I connect my tubing from my false bottom to my spigot on the inside of my MLT?

OR, you are mixing the mash and knock the hose off.

What do you do?

Get your FoodSaver and a roll of 8" wide bag material. Seal the end and then cut this "bag" so that it is long enough to go up your arm to your shoulder.

Then, fill half of this bag with cool tap water, insert arm.

Reach your arm into your mash and feel around for the hose and attach it.

The cool water will insulate your arm to a great degree, your hand and arm will barely get warm.

Problem solved.

Thats a great idea. If you don't have a food saver you could maybe do the same with a kitchen trash bag maybe?

Yambor44 said:

Thats a great idea. If you don't have a food saver you could maybe do the same with a kitchen trash bag maybe?

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Well, FoodSaver bags are suitalbe for boiling, I am not sure if a thin trash bag will provide the strength necessary. All I KNOW is that FoodSaver bags will work.

If you get 3rd degree burns (which can happen to bare skin at these temps in about 1 second) using a trash bag, well, you do.

You can do it with the shoulder length "dairy" rubber gloves. You'll have finger dexterity to boot. They gave away Blichman "brewing gloves" at the Brewers Cup this year, so I guess that would be an option also.

Whiskey said:

You can do it with the shoulder length "dairy" rubber gloves. You'll have finger dexterity to boot. They gave away Blichman "brewing gloves" at the Brewers Cup this year, so I guess that would be an option also.

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Yep... unfortunately, sometimes you have to improvise.

Don't get me wrong it's a great idea.

This always one of my fears when I am setting up the mash "crap did I connect the false bottom to the spigot". So far I haven't run into this yet but now I have a way out.

Thanks, you rule :rockin:

Good idea!

I had to do this too. Except, I used a typical pair of dishwashing gloves. Filled them with ice cold water and did the dunk.

Ahhhh. Good Times.

I did it once, very quickly, with welding gloves. They work for a second or two until they get wet, then look out. I suppose you could put the food saver bag over the welding glove and be OK.

I reached into the mash tun once...

You can do it with the shoulder length "dairy" rubber gloves.

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Yep - exactly what I use. They do double duty on brewing days when I've got some 'Que on the smoker.

Pol, you need to write a book - 101 ways to use a Food Saver!

I did it with dishwashing gloves. But instead of filling it with cool water, I would reach in with the glove for about 5 seconds, then pull it out and run it under tap water until it was cool enough to try again.

Time consuming, but it worked. Might have to try filling it with cold water next time... Hopefully there won't be a next time, though...

AZ_IPA said:

Pol, you need to write a book - 101 ways to use a Food Saver!

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I will get right on that.

Pretty smart Pol. You definitely deserve an A+ for ingenuity. Even though I am sure you would never fall victim to such a n00b mistake such as forgetting to connect a hose in your MLT. That was just a suggestion for the rest of us, right?

bull8042 said:

Pretty smart Pol. You definitely deserve an A+ for ingenuity. Even though I am sure you would never fall victim to such a n00b mistake such as forgetting to connect a hose in your MLT. That was just a suggestion for the rest of us, right?

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Yah, Id never make such a mistake, I am a professional.

Once with an incredibly stuck sparge, I just dumped all of the grains into a 5 gallon bucket. I have enough burn scars...

Man, I wish I had thought of that back when my braid came off a couple years ago during the GaP experiment.

My hand was this bright red constricted claw for about 8 hours after....


owie

I have has 2 mashes where the manifold came apart and had to reconnect.

The first one I tried to just reach inn WRONG!

I ended up emptying the mash into a 8 gallon pot and fixing the problem as quickly as possible.

The second time I just did the same but it was a huge grain bill and I only had about 1.2 qt/per lb, I filled my pot and 2 gallon pitchers.

If I ever get a foodsaver, and have this unfortunate setup again I will give it a shot.

Since then I have modified my manifold so that it won't come apart as easily so hopefully it will never happen again.

I'm sorry, but its simply foolish to stick any extremity into gallons of 140F - 160F liquid. Its one thing if you actually own the proper PPE (Personal Protection Equipment) designed and rated for such tasks, but to cobble together untested items for said tasks is absurd. At 140F it only takes 5 - 6 seconds for second degree burns to occur. The rate drops to 1sec at 158F.

As a first responder at my workplace for the past 15yrs, I have come to take safety very seriously. Even more so when there is an obvious inherent danger involved. To suggest that its "ok" to put oneself in harms way does this community a grave disservice. I'm not trying to bash anyone here, I just don't care to see others misled or severely injured.

Its safer to transfer your mash or liquids into another bucket or vessel. I think taking an extra few minutes is a better option then putting oneself at risk of severe burns, IMO.

xiang said:

I'm sorry, but its simply foolish to stick any extremity into gallons of 140F - 160F liquid. Its one thing if you actually own the proper PPE (Personal Protection Equipment) designed and rated for such tasks, but to cobble together untested items for said tasks is absurd. At 140F it only takes 5 - 6 seconds for second degree burns to occur. The rate drops to 1sec at 158F.

As a first responder at my workplace for the past 15yrs, I have come to take safety very seriously. Even more so when there is an obvious inherent danger involved. To suggest that its "ok" to put oneself in harms way does this community a grave disservice. I'm not trying to bash anyone here, I just don't care to see others misled or severely injured.

Its safer to transfer your mash or liquids into another bucket or vessel. I think taking an extra few minutes is a better option then putting oneself at risk of severe burns, IMO.

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I have an idea, if it feels hot, pull your arm out.

Imagine a HBer cobbling together untested items like, oh, I dont know... electric brewing rigs and such. Anyone would have to be insane to do that.

I see your point, but on a DIY HB forum, isnt cobbling together dangerous items pretty much what we do? Thankfully we have a little common sense when doing so.

I was an OSHA comlpliance manager for an automotive company years back... I trained safety. I would never throw something like this out there at my old company simply because I represent the company and therefore there is liability involved.

By the same token, I would not be advising the guys on the shop floor on how to to do electrical work on thier machines by cobbling things together like we do here, in copious threads, for the same reason.

I see your point, but I thiink most people here have enough frontal lobe to realize there is a risk involved. Just like every time they fill thier rig with 10-20 gallons of water and turn on the 240VAC there is implicit risk.

The same, or worse, could be said about the threads on steam mashing... holy crap! A DIY guy in a garage building a pressurized steam generator? There are instructions here on how to build one, because that is what we do, we cobble and use some level of common sense to do so. The difference with the makeshift insulated glove is that you can FEEL if it is getting warm/hot so you will natuturally react and remove your hand. With something like steam mashing, you have no idea if that seal is going to blow, a tube rupture... and you get your face melted off.

It wasnt about time either, it took me LONGER to think up the damn idea than it would have taken to transfer the mash. The problem was ruining the mash temp.

Clever, very clever. I'll remember that one.

Yambor44 said:

Thats a great idea. If you don't have a food saver you could maybe do the same with a kitchen trash bag maybe?

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Take it from someone who once dumped all of his still-hot spent grains into a big trash bag (while brewing my Old Legburn Imperial Stout) and then tried to lift it...don't use a trash bag.

I'm guilty as charged. I do truly care about the well being of others, regardless of whether I am at work or home. But this isn't the DIY HBT sub forum. This is the General Techniques sub forum. Your discussing your technique for submerging your arm in 140F - 158F liquid. At the very least you could add a disclaimer to your OP for those without a frontal lobe. Much like Yuri does with his posts in the DIY sub forum when an inherent risk is involved.

I'm not going to debate the merit of submerging ones arm into liquids of damaging temperatures. For me, and I hope many others, its a non issue.

xiang said:

I'm guilty as charged. I do truly care about the well being of others, regardless of whether I am at work or home. But this isn't the DIY HBT sub forum. This is the General Techniques sub forum. Your discussing your technique for submerging your arm in 140F - 158F liquid. At the very least you could add a disclaimer to your OP for those without a frontal lobe. Much like Yuri does with his posts in the DIY sub forum when an inherent risk is involved.

I'm not going to debate the merit of submerging ones arm into liquids of damaging temperatures. For me, and I hope many others, its a non issue.

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Honestly the same could be said for using a propane burner within 50 feet of combustible material, like your house, storing your propane tanks inside your garage, lifting heavy 6.5 gallon 45 pound glass jugs, storing potentially explosive 12 oz bottles while conditioning, building hobbled together stir plates, messing with canasters of compressed CO2 etc, I could go on for days. All potentially dangerous things that pretty much every home brewer does from extract to AG, talked about several thousand time a week in the beginners section, bottling and kegging etc, none of which carries a warning when the suggestion is brought up.

I for one am not going to post a warning every time I see someone talking about a potentially dangerous scenario involving Homebrewing, it would be a full time job and TxBrew is not paying.

ThePols suggestion is sound, hell it's a safer suggestion then advising someone to pick up a MLT full of 155 mash and water and attempting to dump it.

......sitting here with a bag of popcorn & a beer.

this is an interesting thread.

I get burned fairly often at work. Those who know me know what I do for a living.

Ill leave it at that.

I dont like....no Im not going to finish that sentence.

Whiskey said:

Honestly the same could be said for using a propane burner within 50 feet of combustible material, like your house, storing your propane tanks inside your garage, lifting heavy 6.5 gallon 45 pound glass jugs, storing potentially explosive 12 oz bottles while conditioning, building hobbled together stir plates, messing with canasters of compressed CO2 etc, I could go on for days. All potentially dangerous things that pretty much every home brewer does from extract to AG, talked about several thousand time a week in the beginners section, bottling and kegging etc, none of which carries a warning when the suggestion is brought up.

I for one am not going to post a warning every time I see someone talking about a potentially dangerous scenario involving Homebrewing, it would be a full time job and TxBrew is not paying.

ThePols suggestion is sound, hell it's a safer suggestion then advising someone to pick up a MLT full of 155 mash and water and attempting to dump it.

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Like I said, I'm not going to debate the merits of what the OP is about. Nor do I plan on jumping on any band wagons based on a members post count. Or any members failed attempts at justifying it through double talk. If the OP cares the slightest bit about the safety of others in this virtual community, he would add a disclaimer.

xiang said:

Like I said, I'm not going to debate the merits of what the OP is about. Nor do I plan on jumping on any band wagons based on a members post count. Or any members failed attempts at justifying it through double talk. If the OP cares the slightest bit about the safety of others in this virtual community, he would add a disclaimer.

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Now that is pure comedy.

There's no need for a pissing match. Expressing concern for safety should be encouraged.

This is good information:

At 140F it only takes 5 - 6 seconds for second degree burns to occur. The rate drops to 1sec at 158F.

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I'm deleteing all the OT stuff. Keep it on topic, please.

So do you believe that a plastic foodsaver bag filled with a marginal amount of water will instantly drop 154F of water down to a safe temperature, lets say below 130F?

It doesnt drop the temp. of the water.

An oven glove doesnt cool the oven.

It is an insulator.

The water is an insualtor.

The thermal mass of both will take time to change.

ollllllllo, im not pissing.

These are genuine concerns of mine.

It provides a buffer between the heat and your hand, kind of like how thermal gloves work.

The Pol said:

Well, FoodSaver bags are suitalbe for boiling, I am not sure if a thin trash bag will provide the strength necessary. All I KNOW is that FoodSaver bags will work.

If you get 3rd degree burns (which can happen to bare skin at these temps in about 1 second) using a trash bag, well, you do.

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This guy makes a valid point about the danger involved. Good for him, looking out for others.

It's a good idea with inherent risks. The less risky option would be to empty the grain out and connect it that way.

In the end it's up to the person doing it to determine if it's worth the risk. Personally, after having had to empty everything out before, I'd consider this method if it happened again, knowing full well that I could placing myself at risk.

I would just hook up my false bottom or wahtever before I began my mash, but what do I know, I use a stainless steel braid for filtering..

Hegh said:

I did it with dishwashing gloves. But instead of filling it with cool water, I would reach in with the glove for about 5 seconds, then pull it out and run it under tap water until it was cool enough to try again.

Time consuming, but it worked. Might have to try filling it with cold water next time... Hopefully there won't be a next time, though...

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PS This was at the end of mashing, and was because my manifold came apart and was letting grain out with the wort, so I drained the grainy wort and then pushed the grain around wearing the rubber glove, squeezed the manifold back together, and poured the wort back in to properly filter.

So basically, if you can, wait until the mash is done and drain the liquid before reaching in there, it'll be a lot easier and safer.