Lagering

So I will be biteing the bullet and getting a chest freezer so I can keep my kegs cold and do some lagering.

What temps are normal for lagering? I cant seem to find any real info on this.

Maybe I am not using the ouija search correctly

MikeFlynn74 said:

So I will be biteing the bullet and getting a chest freezer so I can keep my kegs cold and do some lagering.

What temps are normal for lagering? I cant seem to find any real info on this.

Maybe I am not using the ouija search correctly

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I believe 34F is the magic number for the lagering process. We push the temp as low as we can without seeing any ice crystals forming. We've had a couple batches get as low as 30F. Of course, your actual fermentation temperature depends on which lager yeast you're using.

interesting- and with lagering it takes longer to ferment?

Well, not exactly. You finish the fermentation before you begin the lagering process.

I ferment most of my lagers (depending on the yeast strain) at around 50 degrees until they are finished which might take 10 - 14 days or so. I taste for diacetyl (and John Palmer has a great read on testing for diacetyl in How to Brew) and if I need a diacetyl rest I do one then, or when it's about 75% done fermenting. I usually do NOT need a diacetyl rest, because I pitch cold and let it finish up, and it cleans up the diacetyl just fine, plus some yeasts don't produce much diacetyl. If you need one, though, you can bring it up to room temperature for 48 hours or so to make sure. I think Kaiser talks about this in some of his posts- if you leave it to ferment long enough at 50 degrees, that should also clean up any diacetyl.

After that, I rack to secondary and slowly drop the temp 5 degrees per day until I'm lagering at 34 degrees for about 6 weeks or so.

wow- what a pain. Hrmm.

Oh, no it's not a pain at all! I didn't mean to give you that impression. It's just as easy to set it at 50 degrees and leave it alone as it is at 65 degrees for ales!

It's a little more involved, but in a good way. I don't make a ton of lagers, a little because of the "babying" I have to do, and because they aren't my favorite styles, but I enjoy making them and will continue to make them. It's not that bad. They key is to make sure it finishes up before you start lagering, and taste for diacetyl before you lager, too. It's really not much more difficult than a typical ale.

As the mistress said, it's really not any more involved than an ale. It does require additional equipment that your typical ale brewer might not have on hand. It's alot longer from brewing to drinking also, but worth the wait!

It's really not difficult. And you'll be blown away by the results!

What does it do thats so appealing?

Well, the lagers are "smoother" than ales. They tend to be crisp and not fruity like an ale. If there is some fruitiness, it's considered a flaw.

If there is some fruitiness, it's considered a flaw.

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So if my beer is gay then I screwed up.... I see

Gay beer and Screwed up, interesting choice of words.............

Yoop, do you add more yeast at bottling time? How long do you bottle condition at what temp?

Jesus mike lol.

I lager in the bottle. Meaning that after primary I bottle and carb. That takes one step out and makes it a little easier. My first 2 have turned out incredibly. Working on my 3rd.

IMHO. I think that lagering also cuts down on the risk of contamination. The lower temps slow down or make dormant a lot of contaminants, while the lager yeast do well at those lower temps.

Yea- Ive been kegging. I only bottle specifics RIS888 and such.

MikeFlynn74 said:

Yea- Ive been kegging. I only bottle specifics RIS888 and such.

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Ok, then all you do differently from ales is:


1. Ferment a little colder
2. Do a d-rest by putting your carboy in a warm area for a couple days just before racking.
3. Rack to keg for your secondary and throw into the cold for 6-8 weeks.

Easy-peasy!

Lager temp is dictated by the yeast strain more than the recipe, I personally do the initial fermentation (with a huge starter) at around 50 degrees then once primary fermentation is done I drop it down to just above freezing for about 4 weeks. My last one came out very nice, the one before had a few off notes, but all in all an easy process once you invest in the proper equipment.

I've been using the method they talked about on the Brewing Network.

1- Pitch vial warm, then gradually drop down to 50 degrees after 12 hours.
2- Skip secondary, and lager in bottle to avoid repitching.

Bottles fit nicely in the fridge, despite what my wife thinks.

Every here says that pitching warm, and pitching a single vial is a terrible practice, and I believed that too, until I heard the owner of White Labs say there was NO DIFFERENCE between pitching a vial warm, verses pitching a starter cold.

He claims you are doing the exact same thing with a warm vial, or a cold starter. Diacetly is not produced, he said, until after the replication phase.

I was amazed by that statement, but since then I've used the WhiteLabs method, and produced excellent lagers.

I see posts claiming that lager is too hard to make and takes too long therefore you don't want to wait.

All I can reply is that you must not be making enough beer so you have some to drink while the lager is in process. The only other item you need is a temp controlled freezer to lager in so you can control the temperature. I use my freezer for both ales and lagers. If I have lager in the box I use a cooler box and put in some carboys of ale to ferment and add ice as necessary to keep it 60 F to 65 F depending on the yeast used.

Make some German lagers, they are very good ........

Helles (a malty low hopped beer)
Schworzbier (black beer)
Dunkel Weizen
Boch

Links:
http://www.germanbeerinstitute.com/

I also pitch my yeast warm and cool the wort down afterwards. I have very clean lagers. One of these days, I may pitch the yeast after cooling down to 50F, but I do get a little impatient about pitching. Do not get impatient about fermenting them, though. Lagers take a while, and big lagers take a long while. If you like lagers, though, it is well worth the wait.

Some of the best information you can get about brewing lagers is in Noonan's New Brewing Lager Beer. I go to that book as a reference all the time.


TL

quickerNu said:

Yoop, do you add more yeast at bottling time? How long do you bottle condition at what temp?

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If the lager is super super clear, and if it been in secondary more than 6 weeks at lagering temps, I do add a little more yeast at bottling time. And since the beer's flavor profile is already set, I bottle condition at room temperature until carbonated.

Groovy. I am in the middle of my first bock. I think I just tied up my lagerator for the next 8 weeks, though. I guess I should brew up 2 or three 5 gallon batches in one day from now on.

quickerNu said:

Groovy. I am in the middle of my first bock. I think I just tied up my lagerator for the next 8 weeks, though. I guess I should brew up 2 or three 5 gallon batches in one day from now on.

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Yeah, the guy I brew with who has a chest freezer has a strict schedule for lagers and if I want to brew one it has to be on the same day or the day after in order to get on the same lagering schedule as his batch.

Well since im going to force carb- I guess its really simple!

Yes, it really is. All the lagers need is more time, and temperature control. If you have got that, you're golden!

And, it's March now- so it's time to make a Marzen/Oktoberfest!