Belgian Golden Strong Ale Pink Elephant (Delirium Tremens clone)

I pitched Wyeast 1388 Belgian Strong Ale yeast.

sudsmcgee said:

I pitched Wyeast 1388 Belgian Strong Ale yeast.

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I will be using this for my Duvel clone.

Tagging this one for future a future brew..

Pulled a pint of mine. It's been 7 weeks total, still green I'd say. I went 3 weeks primary 2 weeks fridge and in the keg in the fridge the past two. I didn't do a warm condition because I'm kegging, does this matter? I did bottle some for later comparison.

The green flavours should go away quicker when it's warmer. Depends how eager you are to drink it I suppose! Mine (when done) is going into bottles and I probably won't touch them for a while, apart from the odd one to see how it develops.

It's already carbed, will warming it affect it adversely?

Nope!

i am brewing this today. using wlp550 instead. we shall see. shouldnt be that big of a deal right?

all done. in the carboy in the tub with some water. been hot in AZ lately. i was so disappointed becuase i thought i missed my SG. i was at 1072 and came inside after brew to right everything down and damn it i was spot on...

Thanks for the recipe

I just racked the first 5 gals (of 10) to a keg, and although the beer tastes delicious, it doesn't have any Belgian taste to it. All I can taste is S-04 character. I ended up substituting Wyeast 1388 and I only pitched a half pack of S-04 per bucket. My OG was 1.072 and my FG is 1.005. I fermented it at around 70-72 until it stalled at 1.020. I then warmed it up to 78 to let it finish. After that I cold crashed it for 2 days at 25 degrees and racked to my keg.

This is my first Belgian, but I'm a little surprised that it doesn't have much Belgian character. Any chance of it developing over time? Did my high 60's/low 70's ferment cause this, and should I have gone warmer?

I pitched 1L from the active 2L starter into each fermentor, and as mentioned above, I pitched 1/2 pack of S-04 per bucket. Both were pitched at the same time. Would pitching the belgian yeast first and S-04 12 hours later help?

Trust me in that I'll have zero problem drinking this delicious beer, but it's just not Delirium Tremens.

Mine with Wlp550 is freaking awesome.

It's seems like Wyeast 1388 is not an adequate substitute. Oh well, it will still be easy to drink!

Brewing this tomorrow, will keep people posted. Sounds great!

sudsmcgee said:

It's seems like Wyeast 1388 is not an adequate substitute. Oh well, it will still be easy to drink!

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How did it come out? I'm convinced that s04 should not be in a pink elephant clone.

It came out tasting like only s04 was used. It tastes clean and good, but it has zero belgian yeast character. If I make it again I'm leaving the s04 out. I don't see the point of it, and in my case it completely took over. At the very least I would pitch the s04 12-hours later than the belgian strain.

Most of the yeast flavor is produced in the first 12-36 hours during the growth and lag phases.

Agreed. I read that PE has multiple yeasts but I don't think a malty, English yeast is one of them. I'm tempted to substitute s05 since it leaves a clean, even citrus profile. I also think that fermenting at a too warm of a temperature is not ideal. May have to brew this one again sooner rather than later.

I'd seriously suggested bottle harvesting some dt yeast, mine tastes very good already and it's only been in bottles just over two weeks (had one to check carbonation).

It took it from 1.086 to 1.013 (83% attenuation).

Will let the rest age or at least go easy on them to start with.

I think the S-04 can be used, but you pitch it when it's 75% fermented...the S0-4 is the finisher and bottle conditioning yeast. I am about to make my fourth batch...I really like having a little munich and aromatic in mine, so the all pilsener recipe isn't as interesting to me. Mine always tastes green until 6-7 weeks in the bottle and at that point it's half gone as I keep checking.

Can you store it long term warm....mines 8 weeks in the bottle now and still in the garage around 70 degrees by day and 50-55 at night...don't have a cold room or room in the fridge.

Also if you just re culture DT you may not be getting their main ferment yeast....they may ferment open top and skim krausen batch to batch for primary fermentation and then use a different strain when they bottle.

I was talking to a buddy this morning and we were both wondering why it needs so long in the bottle. I don't think this style is far off Russian River's Damnation or Alesmith's Horny Devil and they apparently release theirs in a months turnaround. ABV is comparable I believe so I'm trying to figure out how theirs is so clean so quick. I think many people who have done these strong golden belgians or tripels will agree they take awhile to hit their peak...I wonder where shortcuts might be made, thoughts?

Perhaps a single temp infusion mash and cutting back on the spices (or making a tea from them?) and maybe starting the ferment off on the cool side would speed the ungreening process?)

Thoughts?

enricocoron said:

Also if you just re culture DT you may not be getting their main ferment yeast....they may ferment open top and skim krausen batch to batch for primary fermentation and then use a different strain when they bottle.

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Maybe, maybe not. However I've use cultured dt yeast and has worked very well. It's definitely Belgian, attenuates well, has very Belgian characteristics, I'd be surprised if it wasn't their main yeast.

Where I work, we centrifuge our beer and If it's something we want to bottle condition, we'll propagate it with fresh yeast (same strain, but not what it was fermented with). Otherwise, we'll just add co2 artificially.

Any idea a good substition amount on the fresh ginger with powdered?

I'm currently drinking some of the real mccoy. Oddly enough, I do think that my clone attempt came a little close in some attributes and way off in others. The aroma I feel is pretty close. My clone didn't smell too malty but instead somewhat like a belgian. The taste is off but not terribly off I feel. The main thing is that the belgian character in the real thing is very pronounced, yet there's a subtle maltiness...very subtle. I think using the Duvel yeast strain (Wyeast 1388) might be an excellent choice. Personally, I would make a huge starter of this. I would add the s04 anywhere between 50-75% attenuation so that the english, malty flavor isn't so pronounced. I think, in my amateur opinion, that the spice addition in the clone recipe is fine as is. Also, I wouldn't let the fermentation temperature creep above 75 degrees. This is all just my humble opinion.

Brewing this as we speak. Just added the Styrian to the boil. Kind of worried about my starter, it was going strong this morning (started it last night) and it smelled fantastic of cloves and bananas, then this afternoon all activity completely stopped. I hope my little bugs are ok.

Using the standard recipe, 5 gallon, 10 lbs of belgian pils. Substituted 1tsp of powdered ginger for the fresh stuff. Mixed it in with the coriander and SoP that I pulverized, and it smells amazing. Guessing this beer will be a winner - at least I can hope.

I tried to use the mashing schedule from the OP, but my temps were kind of wandering. I think I hit 125, then I was between 140 and 148 for the 2nd step, then between 148 and 158 for the third. My tun is too small, so my mash was extremely thick and I think it caused major striations (sp?).

I will let everyone know how things turn out in a few months.

Pretty long brew night, fermenter is sitting in it's home and all wrapped up in a blanket for the night. I'm hoping it doesn't take off and explode way over 75F tonight... kept the S04 out of the ferment, I will add that on day 3.

TriangleIL said:

Pretty long brew night, fermenter is sitting in it's home and all wrapped up in a blanket for the night. I'm hoping it doesn't take off and explode way over 75F tonight... kept the S04 out of the ferment, I will add that on day 3.

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Keep us informed. Thanks.

Yeah, I'm very interested as well. I also believe that with a Belgian yeast you have to be careful not to pitch your yeast too cold. They need to have a warmer lag phase to start the phenol/ester production they're known for. I'd say pitching at 70 degrees is probably about right. I unfortunately pitched at 64 degrees.

Will be interesting how this beer turns out, I am actually really excited about it. The fermentation smells amazing. First time I have used the ebay temp contorller for heat rather than cooling. I pitched at 68, and have ramped up to 75 over 2 days. As I ramped the temps the fermentation smelled better and better. Pitching the S04 tomorrow, the krausen appears to want to fall soon, so I hope the S04 isn't too late.

BTW, I'm going to reuse the yeast cake in 2 weeks for a belgian IPA. I think the combination of the 1388 and the S04 would make a pretty wicked belgian IPA ferment...

I honestly don't think the S04 is needed. Belgians strains attenuate well enough on heir own.

I just pulled first pint of mine. Wow what great fing beer. My color is off . Little lighter. I have more banana taste in mine but that's the yeast. Uses Wlp550. Started in low 60s then ramped up to 70 over a week. Drinking in 5 weeks. Cold conditioned for 2 weeks. Clear as Hell

FWIW, I've always done the WLP570 / S-04 combo and had great results. I do suspect some of you are fermenting too cool, leading to weak Belgian flavors. Start at 67-68F and it should reach well into the 70s for full flavor development.

jkarp said:

FWIW, I've always done the WLP570 / S-04 combo and had great results. I do suspect some of you are fermenting too cool, leading to weak Belgian flavors. Start at 67-68F and it should reach well into the 70s for full flavor development.

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I think that the warm fermentation temps cause the s04 to be too dominant in flavor.

I've done just the WL570 and also in conjuntion with the S-04 and both come out very well....I think the key is to not be afraid to start this in the high 60's and ramp it all they way to78-80 at the end.

enricocoron said:

I've done just the WL570 and also in conjuntion with the S-04 and both come out very well....I think the key is to not be afraid to start this in the high 60's and ramp it all they way to78-80 at the end.

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That's what I did... Will see.

Just brewed this, everything went well. Got an OG of 1.071, pitched the WLP570 starter at 68 degrees and am going to wait about 6-12 hours to pitch the S-04.

The amount of break material is tremendous! Did you all encounter that as well? In my 3 gal carboy, theres about 2 inches of material.

I had all my hops & spices in hop bags. All this material generated after the irish moss.

Pils malt is high in protein also...

I'm doing my fourth batch....I decided to only do a protein rest and then mash at 149. I'm holding at 68 for 3-4 days and bumping to 70 for a few days and then 72 and then ramp it up to 78-80 right at the end. I backed the ginger addition off to 8 minutes and corriander and seeds of P to 5 minutes and halved the seeds of P addition. Overshot a little at 1.080 but hopefully can still get down to 1.008 by jacking the temp up towards the end. I'm looking for a version that can be drunk out of a keg after only a few weeks of conditioning. I also went with only 4 oz each of biscuit and aromatic and 8 oz of munich.....

I don't see how you guys are drinking after a couple weeks. Mine was still harsh/boozy at 8 weeks. Around 13 now, it's pretty nice. I'd opt out of the S-04 next time, could have been more Belgiany.

After about 4 weeks mine was a little warm but not boozey like some stronger beers I've had or made.

I did end up with 8.9% and fg 1.013 with a 3 step mash. Hopefully most of the batch will last long enough to try aged.

Mine was 1.074 to 1.011, 8.4%. I did rush mine a bit. I wouldn't advise cold crashing until you keg or bottle. Warm condition as long as you can wait.