Not bubbling. Add yeast cake?

hindsy said:

Okay I got a question...

I made a batch of Oatmeal stout saturday. It was rolling bubbles like mad. I had to leave to work on the road so I had the wife watch it. She added water to the air lock this morning. She added so much water it ran into the brew. It has stopped bubbling.(not sure if it was becasue of the water) IS my brew in trouble? This was my first beer brew. I am wondering should I pull the airlock off and take a sample from the tap at the bottom? throw the therm and Hydr in it? see what we got?

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Everything is fine. This is where you guys who instantly equate a bubbling airlock with "FERMENTATION" seem to miss...An airlock is simply a valve, a vent to release excess co2, to keep your lid on your fermenter and your beer off the ceiling.

It's always going to slow down eventually. The yeast are going to have less fermentables to consume, than they did in the first few days, so they are not going to produce that much EXTRA co2, and therefore the airlock is not going to NEED to blip as fast, if at all.

But that DOESN'T mean the yeast has stopped doing their job....they just don't have that much food to chew....but they're not going to stop, they just don't go to sleep unless the temp dips down to the low 50's, and they just don't die....they MAY eat all the consumables they can in the case of a high grav wort and shut down, like in a barlewine.

But in your NORMAL beer, they are just going to keep working. They are going to slowly slug away until the job is done. Just not as dynamically as they do when they are having the gluttonous orgy of sex and food....it's just like us on thanksgiving....we start slowing down eventually...but we more than likely keep eating. At least until we get to the pumpkin pie...or the midnight snack......

Besides, fermenting the beer is just a part of what the yeast do. If you leave the beer alone, they will go back and clean up the byproducts of fermentation that often lead to off flavors. That's why many brewers skip secondary and leave our beers alone in primary for a month. It leaves plenty of time for the yeast to ferment, clean up after themselves and then fall out, leveing our beers crystal clear, with a tight yeast cake.

Your HYDROMETER is the only BEST indicator of fermentation activity. Nothing else is accurate or consistent...

Unless you take a gravity reading you don't know what's really going on, not by airlock bubbling or by krausen formation. Neither of those signs are effective, they don't tell you exactly where on the fermentation process you are.

The amount of krausen can vary for whatever reason, it can come quick and depart quickly or it can linger long after fermentation is complete, and it all be normal.

And airlocks sometimes bubble or they don't. And airlock is a valve, a vent to release excess co2...NOT a fermentation gauge. It's important to make that distinction, or you'll be panicking everytime a an airlock doesn't bubble, or stops bubbling.

Fermentation is not always "dynamic," just because you don't SEE anything happening, doesn't mean that any-thing's wrong,, and also doesn't mean that the yeast are still not working diligently away, doing what they've been doing for over 4,000 years.

That's why you need to take a gravity reading to know how your fermentation is going, NOT go by airlocks, or size of krausen, or a calendar, the horoscope or the phases of the moon (those things in my mind are equally accurate).

The most important tool you can use is a hydrometer. It's the only way you will truly know when your beer is ready...airlock bubbles and other things are faulty.

The only way to truly know what is going on in your fermenter is with your hydrometer. Like I said here in my blog, which I encourage you to read, Think evaluation before action you sure as HELL wouldn't want a doctor to start cutting on you unless he used the proper diagnostic instuments like x-rays first, right? You wouldn't want him to just take a look in your eyes briefly and say "I'm cutting into your chest first thing in the morning." You would want them to use the right diagnostic tools before the slice and dice, right? You'd cry malpractice, I would hope, if they didn't say they were sending you for an MRI and other things before going in....

Thinking about "doing anything" like repitching, or bottling, or racking, without first taking a hydrometer reading is tantamount to the doctor deciding to cut you open without running any diagnostic tests....Taking one look at you and saying, "Yeah I'm going in." You would really want the doctor to use all means to properly diagnose what's going on?

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RobWalker said:

I had this problem just a few days ago and the reason was because i'd killed the yeast by adding it to a mixture that was too hot. Can you think of anything you might have done that killed the yeast? Always wait 72 hours before acting too!

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lilwiggum said:

Don't forget, no bubbles doesn't mean fermentation isn't occurring. Have you checked the gravities with a hydrometer?

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bluntsandbeers said:

So i moved fermenter to a warmer spot in the house nd it has now slowly started bubbling. Yes! Hopefully all is well. bout to get the stuff for my first IIPA this week!

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bluntsandbeers said:

Dang should i not have moved the fermenter? That was last night and today it has started bubbling plus i was real careful when moving it. So i just thought i was gonna wing it without taking the final grav reading, i have just started brewing about a month ago and i honestly still havnt read the purpose or importance of doing this. Next thing on the to do list.

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Revvy said:

What you should have done, was to wait 72 hours, and take a hydrometer reading. And not care whether the airlock bubbles or not. Half my beers NEVER have a bubbling airlock, but I've never had a fermentation not happen before. Like I was quoted above.

Airlock bubbling and fermentation are not the same thing. You have to separate that from your mindset. Airlock bubbling can be a sign of fermentation, but not a good one, because the airlock will often blip or not blip for various other reasons...so it is a tenuous connection at best.

If your airlock was bubbling and stopped---It doesn't mean fermentation has stopped.

If you airlock isn't bubbling, it doesn't mean your fermentation hasn't started....

If your airlock starts bubbling, it really doesn't matter.

If your airlock NEVER bubbles, it doesn't mean anything is wrong or right.

Your airlock is not a fermentation gauge, it is a VALVE to release excess co2. If it bubbles it is because it needs to, if it doesn't, it just means it doesn't need too...

Often an airlock will bubble if the fermenter has been disturbed in some way, like a change in temperature, change in atmospheric pressure, the cat brushing against it, opening it up to take a hydro reading, any number of things. The co2 has sat in stasis for a period of time, then it was disturbed so it is not longer at equilibrium with everything else now. And therefore it is blipping in your airlock...

Or you could indeed have fermentation happening, since maybe your fermentation was laggy and a change in temp restarted fermentation.

Airlock bubbling only tells you that co2 is coming out of the airlock, it is not telling you why. And there's various reasons. That's why it's not a good idea to equate airlock bubbling with fermentation...It could be because it is fermenting, or it could not be because of fermentation...so it's not a trustworthy tool.

And airlocks sometimes bubble or they don't. And airlock is a valve, a vent to release excess co2...NOT a fermentation gauge. It's important to make that distinction, or you'll be panicking everytime a an airlock doesn't bubble, or stops bubbling.

Fermentation is not always "dynamic," just because you don't SEE anything happening, doesn't mean that any-thing's wrong,, and also doesn't mean that the yeast are still not working diligently away, doing what they've been doing for over 4,000 years.

That's why you need to take a gravity reading to know how your fermentation is going, NOT go by airlocks, or size of krausen, or a calendar, the horoscope or the phases of the moon (those things in my mind are equally accurate).

The most important tool you can use is a hydrometer. It's the only way you will truly know when your beer is ready...airlock bubbles and other things are faulty.

The only way to truly know what is going on in your fermenter is with your hydrometer. Like I said here in my blog, which I encourage you to read, Think evaluation before action you sure as HELL wouldn't want a doctor to start cutting on you unless he used the proper diagnostic instuments like x-rays first, right? You wouldn't want him to just take a look in your eyes briefly and say "I'm cutting into your chest first thing in the morning." You would want them to use the right diagnostic tools before the slice and dice, right? You'd cry malpractice, I would hope, if they didn't say they were sending you for an MRI and other things before going in....

Thinking about "doing anything" like repitching, or bottling, or racking, without first taking a hydrometer reading is tantamount to the doctor deciding to cut you open without running any diagnostic tests....Taking one look at you and saying, "Yeah I'm going in." You would really want the doctor to use all means to properly diagnose what's going on?

Next time just ignore the airlock and if you are concerned take a gravity reading.

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Revvy said:

One of our members, Bobby M, has a decent video on how to use it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtQt7HiObuU

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bluntsandbeers said:

right on, pretty good vid but trying to follow the math, i just cant do it. My parents used to do my homework for me. I will have someone help me with that part cuase i see the importance. Gonna just keep trying and learning as i go i appreciate the help Big Time!

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bluntsandbeers said:

no never really do but i know i should.

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Yooper said:

You want to know if your beer is ok, since it may not have fermented, or it might have. But you didn't use the hydrometer to see if it did ferment. This is a great forum, but there is no way for us to tell you if it fermented or not without you taking a SG reading.

I'm the Queen of Analogies around here, so I'll use one in this instance.

I wonder if you guys could tell me if my car needs gas? I drove quite a bit yesterday, and I a full tank yesterday. I could check the gas gauge, but I didn't. I don't really want to learn how to do something that basic. Should I put more gas in it?

Well, the question is sort of the same. Without knowing your "gauge" of fermentation (the specific gravity), we just can't tell you what to do. If the SG isn't moving after three days, then you need more yeast. It's more than likely that fermentation has occurred, though.

Moving a fermenter can cause airlock bubbling. So can temperature change, and so can fermentation. The lack of bubbling doesn't mean anything, though.

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bluntsandbeers said:

HuuuH?

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Yooper said:

I wanna know if I need gas in my car?

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FensterBos said:

I have a few batches under my belt and I still consider myself a noob, but I've definitely have gotten better at brewing by asking questions and doing the right research.
One thing that has helped me the most is using the hydrometer. Without it I would have relied on the airlock method and would have bottled beer way too early. It only takes an extra minute to extract some wort and fill up the little plastic tube that comes with the hydrometer.

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bluntsandbeers said:

Im still not 100% convinced it is really gonna matter doing extract beers. Im leaving it in the primary for 10 days and secondary for 2 weeks and then carbing in keg the slow way how Will my beer seriously need more time than this?

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D0ug said:

Well, say for instance where you are fermenting is on the cool side, say 60. Maybe when you made your kit you decided to "up" the abv by adding another pound or two of extract or sugar or whatever...

Then your yeast had a long lag time, say three days. So you rack on day 10 and you have had active fermentation for 6 or 7 of those days, but it was slow because of the cool temps.
You rack on day 10 and the yeast craps out because you've only reached 50% attenuation and you've reduced the yeast population to a fraction of what it was.

So you're left with a sweet, low alcohol brew that might have been awesome if you'd taken some readings to find out what was going on.

It will still be beer, and your friends will tell you it's great, but it wont be what you had hoped for.

Maybe it's an extreme example, but people want to rack 4-5 days or a week after they've pitched, and not worry about the SG readings or taking advice that's been offered to them. This is the same thing.

Most people are on this site because they want to make better beer, one of the basic tools used for this is a hydrometer, it's not that hard to take a reading.

just sayin...

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Yooper said:

No one knows. Without a hydrometer reading, we're only guessing. Just like I asked you to guess if my car needs gas. I'm kidding, but it's the same thing. Without reading your "gauge", you can only guess.

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bluntsandbeers said:

well i see what everyone is saying especially for my next brews, gonna work on some Imperial recipes. But wouldnt most simple extract recipes that call for say 6 lbs of lME and 1 lb of dry extract most always be done in 10 days in the primary and giving it another week or 2 in the secondary? I dont know just kind of what i was thinkin.

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bluntsandbeers said:

How often would you take a reading? Or "check you fuel gage" haha?

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Yooper said:

A good time to take a reading is whenever you are concerned, or when you plan to do something with the knowledge.

For example, I brewed a pale ale last Thursday. I'm going to open it and take a reading today, because if it's finished and clear, I'm going to dryhop it.

I know it fermented, as there are plenty of indications last week that fermentation was taking place.

So I'll check the SG today and dryhop it. In another week, I'll check the SG. If it's the same, I'll bottle or keg it.

If I'm worried that a beer isn't fermenting, I check the SG. If I am getting ready to bottle the beer, or do something else with it, I check the SG. Otherwise, I just leave it alone.

I think one of the reasons I'm more laid back is because I have a lot more carboys! I really don't have much time to worry about one fermenter, because I have about 6 carboys of wine right now, one ale pail of beer, and I'm brewing today. Brewing is a great hobby for procrastinators, since the beer and wine are better if left alone and allowed to "clean up" after themselves in the fermenter.

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Revvy said:

What you should have done, was to wait 72 hours, and take a hydrometer reading. And not care whether the airlock bubbles or not. Half my beers NEVER have a bubbling airlock, but I've never had a fermentation not happen before. Like I was quoted above.

Airlock bubbling and fermentation are not the same thing. You have to separate that from your mindset. Airlock bubbling can be a sign of fermentation, but not a good one, because the airlock will often blip or not blip for various other reasons...so it is a tenuous connection at best.

If your airlock was bubbling and stopped---It doesn't mean fermentation has stopped.

If you airlock isn't bubbling, it doesn't mean your fermentation hasn't started....

If your airlock starts bubbling, it really doesn't matter.

If your airlock NEVER bubbles, it doesn't mean anything is wrong or right.

Your airlock is not a fermentation gauge, it is a VALVE to release excess co2. If it bubbles it is because it needs to, if it doesn't, it just means it doesn't need too...

Often an airlock will bubble if the fermenter has been disturbed in some way, like a change in temperature, change in atmospheric pressure, the cat brushing against it, opening it up to take a hydro reading, any number of things. The co2 has sat in stasis for a period of time, then it was disturbed so it is not longer at equilibrium with everything else now. And therefore it is blipping in your airlock...

Or you could indeed have fermentation happening, since maybe your fermentation was laggy and a change in temp restarted fermentation.

Airlock bubbling only tells you that co2 is coming out of the airlock, it is not telling you why. And there's various reasons. That's why it's not a good idea to equate airlock bubbling with fermentation...It could be because it is fermenting, or it could not be because of fermentation...so it's not a trustworthy tool.

And airlocks sometimes bubble or they don't. And airlock is a valve, a vent to release excess co2...NOT a fermentation gauge. It's important to make that distinction, or you'll be panicking everytime a an airlock doesn't bubble, or stops bubbling.

Fermentation is not always "dynamic," just because you don't SEE anything happening, doesn't mean that any-thing's wrong,, and also doesn't mean that the yeast are still not working diligently away, doing what they've been doing for over 4,000 years.

That's why you need to take a gravity reading to know how your fermentation is going, NOT go by airlocks, or size of krausen, or a calendar, the horoscope or the phases of the moon (those things in my mind are equally accurate).

The most important tool you can use is a hydrometer. It's the only way you will truly know when your beer is ready...airlock bubbles and other things are faulty.

The only way to truly know what is going on in your fermenter is with your hydrometer. Like I said here in my blog, which I encourage you to read, Think evaluation before action you sure as HELL wouldn't want a doctor to start cutting on you unless he used the proper diagnostic instuments like x-rays first, right? You wouldn't want him to just take a look in your eyes briefly and say "I'm cutting into your chest first thing in the morning." You would want them to use the right diagnostic tools before the slice and dice, right? You'd cry malpractice, I would hope, if they didn't say they were sending you for an MRI and other things before going in....

Thinking about "doing anything" like repitching, or bottling, or racking, without first taking a hydrometer reading is tantamount to the doctor deciding to cut you open without running any diagnostic tests....Taking one look at you and saying, "Yeah I'm going in." You would really want the doctor to use all means to properly diagnose what's going on?

Next time just ignore the airlock and if you are concerned take a gravity reading.

Click to expand...