Ignore the Instructions,. Do not bottle after 5-10 days!!!!!!

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Orfy

For the love of beer!
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Cheap kits can have crap instructions.
They know you want quick beer so are trying to say their kit can give it to you.

Can any of you experience extract brewers supply a generic set of instructions to replace the crap put on most cans? I think it would help.

The point of this thread is if your instructions recommend bottling in 5 - 10 days then:

A. It's likely to be a poor quality kit.
B. It's likely to be poor quality instructions.
C. The beer will very probably be better for leaving it another 1-2 weeks

If you are experienced enough to know its ready to bottle at 5-10 days then go for it. Otherwise ignore the instructions.

pre-hopped canned kits

1. Clean and sanitize all equipment being used the day of brewing. Namely, the primary fermenter (6 gallon carboy or food grade plastic bucket), airlocks and stoppers. Do this by allowing them to soak in a light bleach water solution for 20-30 minutes (do it in the bathtub). Rinse well and sanitize with an Iodophor solution (food grade Iodine…follow directions on bottle). Do not rinse, allow to air dry.

2. Put 2 gallons of clean, cold water in the primary fermenter, cover and set aside.

3. Put 2 gallons of water in the brew kettle and bring to a boil.

4. Remove from the heat and add 3 pounds of unhopped malt extract. Stir well to dissolve.

5. Return to the heat and bring slowly to a boil (watch carefully for a boil over…avoid this mess…keep an eye on it!).

6. Boil for 30 minutes, remove from heat and add the can of hopped maltextract. stir well to dissolve.

7. Shut off heat and begin to cool your wort as soon as possible in a sink or tub of cold water and/or ice.. When wort is about 75 degrees, or when wort is cool enough to mix with water to reach about 75 degrees, pour and strain the wort into your primary fermenter.

8. Pour the wort from the brew kettle into the primary fermenter that has 2 gallons of cold water waiting. Top the fermenter up to 5 gallons with clean cold water and cover immediately. When pouring the wort into the primary, aerate as much as possible. You can accomplish this by dipping a sanitized container such as a measuring cup into the wort
and pouring back into the wort. You can aslo por through a fine strainer. Create as much foam and bubbles as you can for abou ten minutes.

9. At this point, take a Hydrometer reading of the Specific Gravity by pouring a sample of the wort into the hydrometer jar and float the hydrometer in the sample. Take the reading where the level of your wort intersects on the specific gravity scale of the hydrometer. Write this reading down in your brewing notes. Do NOT return the sample of wort to
the fermenter.

10. Rehydrate the dried yeast (located under the lid of the can) in 1 cup of 80-degree, clean water for 15 Double check your temperature to be sure it is not above 80 degrees and take a hydrometer reading. Now pitch the contents of the yeast pack into the primary fermenter, cover, set-up the sanitized air lock and stopper assembly, and place the primary where it will remain around 68 degrees during fermentation.

11. At this point, your work is done for the day. Clean and sanitize your equipment and store it for the next time, sit back and watch the show.

12. Fermentation may take between 8-72 hours to begin…have patience, the yeast is going through it’s respiration cycle. Once fermentation begins, it will take approximately 5-7 days for it to complete. After 5 and 6 days take hydrometer readings. If no perceptible change in gravity occurs, fermentation is complete. If the gravity keeps reducing, wait. If you are unsure wait one more day. If you are doing a two-stage fermentation, now is the time to transfer your beer to a secondary fermenter (normally a 5 gallon glass carboy). When the transfer is complete, place the stopper and airlock in the fermenter and allow your beer to settle for 5-6 days. For better taste, you may also elect to let it sit longer. You can also choose to let your beer
sit in the primary or, if you are in a hurry you may now bottle.

13. Racking help: Insure that your secondary fermenter and “racking” assembly, (cane and tubing) have been cleaned and sanitized. If you are not using an Auto-Siphon: to get your siphon going, fill the tubing and racking cane with water. Place your thumb over the hose end, trapping the water. Insert the racking cane into the primary fermenter, which will be on the countertop and run the water off into a cup or the sink. The beer will follow the water and when it does, place the tubing
all the way to the bottom of the secondary fermenter, which will be on the floor. Avoid splashing the beer.

14. Bottling:
5 gallons of beer is 640 ounces. This requires 54-12 oz. bottles, 40-16 oz. bottles or 29-22 oz. bottles or any desired combination. Use Non-screw bottles only. Clean and sanitize them along with a matching number of caps.

15. Repeat step #9 to attain the Final Gravity reading. Subtract this reading from the Original Gravity reading and multiply by 105, this will give you the Alcohol by weight (ABW) of your beer. Multiply this number by 1.25 to attain the Alcohol of Volume (ABV).

16. In a sauce pan, bring 1 pint of water to a boil and add ¾ cup of corn sugar or 1 1/4 cups of dry malt extract (not table sugar). Boil for 3 minutes. Pour this mixture into your clean, sanitized bottling bucket.

17. Now repeat the siphoning process of your beer, from the secondary fermenter into the bottling bucket. The bottling sugar (syrup) will mix evenly throughout the beer and give you consistent carbonation in each bottle.

18. Bottle and cap immediately using the siphoning method, allowing 1-1 ½” of air space in each bottle. Again, avoid splashing.

19. Store the bottled beer at room temperature, preferably in a dark area, for 10 - 21 (Suggested) days and allow to carbonate. Cool and drink!

Tips and fine-tuning:
- Try to boil and cool the largest possible volume you can manage.
- Varying the fermentation temperature will result in different
flavors. fermentinging warm (up to 72 degrees) will produce fruity,
estery qualities.
-An LCD stick-on thermometer will allow you to monitor fermentation temperatures.
-Always be sure to sanitize every piece of brewing equipment after your brew session.
 
Howtobrew.com's Brewing Your First Beer with Malt Extract has a good set of instructions, including these critical quotes:
4. Leave it alone! After about 24 hours, the airlock will be bubbling steadily, the exciting evidence of fermentation. The fermentation will proceed like this for two to four days, depending on the conditions of your fermentation. The activity will decrease as most of the malt sugars are consumed by the yeast, though the yeast will continue to ferment the beer long after the bubbling diminishes. Leave the beer in the fermentor for a total of two weeks.
And later, in a more detailed section
Leaving an ale beer in the primary fermentor for a total of 2-3 weeks (instead of just the one week most canned kits recommend), will provide time for the conditioning reactions and improve the beer. This extra time will also let more sediment settle out before bottling, resulting in a clearer beer and easier pouring.

How to Brew should be required reading for all brewers. I'm rereading for the fourth or fifth time and am still finding new things to learn.

Chad
 
Do not bottle after 5-10 days!!!!!!

If its done after 5-10 days why would you not bottle it ?

That makes no sense.

Assuming you are talking about can kits, and yes if you follow the instructions the beer will have dropped from 1.040 or so to 1.011 in 5-10 days. If the hydrometer reads the same two days in a row then its done. Oh yeah thats in the instructions too.
 
If its done after 5-10 days why would you not bottle it ?

Might be 'done', as in active fermentation is finished- but it won't be 'good', IMHO. Give those yeasties a chance to clean up after themselves, as indicated by Palmer in the quote above.
 
It will be just as 'good' as if you let it sit there another couple of weeks, I've brewed it enough to know. More importantly I've drank enough of it to know.
 
Then why not just leave it in the primary for bulk conditioning? I would suspect that bulk aging in primary would be more effective because the yeast is 'forced' to consume the by-products before flocculating out. When you bottle, their attention is focused on consuming the priming sugar. Just thinking out loud.
 
+1

Can it result in drinkable beer if primary fermentation is done and hydrometer readings are consistent? Sure.

Does it hurt anything to wait and let the yeasties clean up after themselves? Nope.

This is the biggest lesson I've learned - just sit back and be patient.
 
JustDave the 10der and mild swap is an experiment/challenge really and not a beginning brew session, likewise it won't be bottle conditioned. Plus the fact that a mild is a very low gravity beer. The yeast has a lot less work to do then in other beers thus less time. That being said, I am even a little apprehensive about it as I ussually let all my beers sit 3 weeks in the intital vessel. Perhaps only 10-14 for a mild or something similar. Then I let it cold condtion for a few more weeks.


Orfy's point I believe is that the kits and even some beginner books lead people to believe a decent beer can be made in a short time. Course these kits also recommend many times using up to 1/2 simple sugars for your fermentables. :cross:
 
I agree, I don't bottle in 10 days either.

But you can't make a blanket statement that no beer can be bottled in 10 days without knowing what the person is brewing. What if they bought a mild kit? :)
 
I have recently started leaving my brews in the primary for 2 weeks minimum, 3 weeks for a standard brew. I haven't been doing it long enough to really be able to speak on the results, though.

What I can say is I hate how kit instructions would have everyone use 5oz of priming sugar in every 5 gallon batch of beer no matter what. Doesn't matter if the beer is 60F at bottling and it's an ordinary bitter. 5oz. I think that's such a crime.
 
What I can say is I hate how kit instructions would have everyone use 5oz of priming sugar in every 5 gallon batch of beer no matter what. Doesn't matter if the beer is 60F at bottling and it's an ordinary bitter. 5oz. I think that's such a crime.

Yep :) I tend to buy my dextrose in bulk, so I can precisely control exactly how much priming sugar makes it into my beer according to style on those occasions when I still bottle.
 
What those instruction usually leave out is the use of a hydrometer to PROVE that fermentation has indeed stopped in 7-10 days.

As most of us now realize, if fermentation can sometimes take 3 days to even begin, there is a high likely hood that it is not really done on the 7th day (come one we KNOW that the inexperience brewer will read 7-10 days and do it on the 7th, I did my first time, it's human nature.)

The kit and kilo or basic kit manufacturers are banking on the fact that they only have a limited window of sales to an individual before he/she moves on to the next step of brewing, either trying recipes in books or online, or going all grain. So the bank on 2-3 sales per new brewer before they discover how to brew beer better.

Also as you ALL know, as you became more experienced, this is a hobby about patience, but in this quick trunover society retailers know that something that takes time, would be less popular than something with a quick turn around time...So they know that even though the beer would be better if they told the n00b to wait even a week further, they want to make this hobby as "pain free" as possible....

They're not technically lying, IF the yeast takes hold within a few hours and finishes in a week, you can bottle a lower to moderate gravity beer in 10 days, as Orfy's 10 for 10 milds proves. They just leave off the fact that waiting even a week more makes for better beer.

If you've noticed, it's mostly the kit and kilo, brew in a bag or mr beer type kits that say to do it quickly. The better kit manufacturers usually tell you to wait, as well as suggest to use a hydrometer. I've noticed the the Norther Brewer Catalog gives the most accurate range of their beers based on gravity and style. They will say, for example, "primary for 14 days, secondary 3-6 months, bottle condition another 6" for a higer grav beer.
 
JustDave.

Don't forget that this is aimed at inexperienced brewers who don't know better or are unable to judge when (if) it is correct.

I believe blanket statements are better than overcomplicated statements in this situation.
 
I think a lot of people panic to bottle at <x> days because they are scared of sanitation or autolysis issues.

I just leave mine till I have time to bottle. I stressed my yeast out on my last batch but left it in the fermenter for 3 weeks I think - had no off flavors. I firmly believe leaving it in the fermenter for 2-3 weeks actually improves the beer.
 
I think a lot of people panic to bottle at <x> days because they are scared of sanitation or autolysis issues.

I just leave mine till I have time to bottle. I stressed my yeast out on my last batch but left it in the fermenter for 3 weeks I think - had no off flavors. I firmly believe leaving it in the fermenter for 2-3 weeks actually improves the beer.

Autolysis is a bugaboo for the homebrewer, most people who quote it get it from Plamer and they fail to notice 2 things, it is talked about it the LAGER section and they don't miss the last paragraph.

As a final note on this subject, I should mention that by brewing with healthy yeast in a well-prepared wort, many experienced brewers, myself included, have been able to leave a beer in the primary fermenter for several months without any evidence of autolysis....


this is one of those myths that will never get dispelled...

Palmer also says this...

The fermentation of malt sugars into beer is a complicated biochemical process. It is more than just the conversion of sugar to alcohol, which can be regarded as the primary activity. Total fermentation is better defined as three phases, the Adaptation or Lagtime phase, the Primary or Attenuative phase and a Secondary or Conditioning phase. The yeast do not end Phase 2 before beginning Phase 3, the processes occur in parallel, but the conditioning processes occur more slowly. As the majority of simple sugars are consumed, more and more of the yeast will transition to eating the larger, more complex sugars and early yeast by-products. This is why beer (and wine) improves with age to a degree, as long as they are on the yeast. Beer that has been filtered or pasteurized will not benefit from aging.

Great reading on the phases of fermentation here: http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter8-2-2.html

oh, and one more passage from the same book:

The conditioning process is a function of the yeast. The vigorous, primary stage is over, the majority of the wort sugars have been converted to alcohol, and a lot of the yeast are going dormant; but there is still yeast activity. During the earlier phases, many different compounds were produced by the yeast in addition to ethanol and CO2, e.g., acetaldehyde, esters, amino acids, ketones- diacetyl, pentanedione, dimethyl sulfide, etc. Once the easy food is gone, the yeast start re-processing these by-products. Diacetyl and pentanedione are two ketones that have buttery and honey-like flavors. These compounds are considered flaws when present in large amounts and can cause flavor stability problems during storage. Acetaldehyde is an aldehyde that has a pronounced green apple smell and taste. It is an intermediate compound in the production of ethanol. The yeast reduce these compounds during the later stages of fermentation.

The yeast also produce an array of fusel alcohols during primary fermentation in addition to ethanol. Fusels are higher molecular weight alcohols that often give harsh solvent-like tastes to beer. During secondary fermentation, the yeast convert these alcohols to more pleasant tasting fruity esters. Warmer temperatures encourage ester production.

That's why I leave mine in primary for a month.
 
I must say i have only brewed once, with the help of a friend that did brew before, we used a kit from Northern Brewer for a Belgian White Ale, I left it in my primary for about...2.5 weeks then put it into a secondary for about 2 weeks, and finished with bottling.

Overall....my first beer turned out great. a bit darker than a Belgian white, but amazing whit great flavor and aroma. It has a 12% alcohol content per the reading my buddy did to help me figure it out.

just my 2 cents
 
kit instructions would have everyone use 5oz of priming sugar in every 5 gallon batch of beer no matter what

Yea - I contacted AHBS about this because every kit had 4.5 oz and they said it was a default. 4.5oz = $0.79. 1lb = 1.79 so it makes sense to buy it in bulk and save a $1 a pound.
 
Orfy, will this work? I've bastardized and added suggestions to a combination of instructions from my 2 LHBS: Feel free to delete if you do not think they will help.

1. Clean and sanitize all equipment being used the day of brewing. Namely, the primary fermenter (6 gallon carboy or food grade plastic bucket), airlocks and stoppers. Do this by allowing them to soak in a light bleach water solution for 20-30 minutes (do it in the bathtub). Rinse well and sanitize with an Iodophor solution (food grade Iodine&#8230;follow directions on bottle). Do not rinse, allow to air dry.

2. Put 2 gallons of clean, cold water in the primary fermenter, cover and set aside.

3. Put 2 gallons of water in the brew kettle and bring to a boil.

4. Remove from the heat and add 3 pounds of unhopped malt extract. Stir well to dissolve.

5. Return to the heat and bring slowly to a boil (watch carefully for a boil over&#8230;avoid this mess&#8230;keep an eye on it!).

6. Boil for 30 minutes, remove from heat and add the can of hopped maltextract. stir well to dissolve.

7. Shut off heat and begin to cool your wort as soon as possible in a sink or tub of cold water and/or ice.. When wort is about 75 degrees, or when wort is cool enough to mix with water to reach about 75 degrees, pour and strain the wort into your primary fermenter.

8. Pour the wort from the brew kettle into the primary fermenter that has 2 gallons of cold water waiting. Top the fermenter up to 5 gallons with clean cold water and cover immediately. When pouring the wort into the primary, aerate as much as possible. You can accomplish this by dipping a sanitized container such as a measuring cup into the wort
and pouring back into the wort. You can aslo por through a fine strainer. Create as much foam and bubbles as you can for abou ten minutes.

9. At this point, take a Hydrometer reading of the Specific Gravity by pouring a sample of the wort into the hydrometer jar and float the hydrometer in the sample. Take the reading where the level of your wort intersects on the specific gravity scale of the hydrometer. Write this reading down in your brewing notes. Do NOT return the sample of wort to
the fermenter.

10. Rehydrate the dried yeast (located under the lid of the can) in 1 cup of 80-degree, clean water for 15 Double check your temperature to be sure it is not above 80 degrees and take a hydrometer reading. Now pitch the contents of the yeast pack into the primary fermenter, cover, set-up the sanitized air lock and stopper assembly, and place the primary where it will remain around 68 degrees during fermentation.

11. At this point, your work is done for the day. Clean and sanitize your equipment and store it for the next time, sit back and watch the show.

12. Fermentation may take between 8-72 hours to begin&#8230;have patience, the yeast is going through it&#8217;s respiration cycle. Once fermentation begins, it will take approximately 5-7 days for it to complete. After 5 and 6 days take hydrometer readings. If no perceptible change in gravity occurs, fermentation is complete. If the gravity keeps reducing, wait. If you are unsure wait one more day. If you are doing a two-stage fermentation, now is the time to transfer your beer to a secondary fermenter (normally a 5 gallon glass carboy). When the transfer is complete, place the stopper and airlock in the fermenter and allow your beer to settle for 5-6 days. For better taste, you may also elect to let it sit longer. You can also choose to let your beer
sit in the primary or, if you are in a hurry you may now bottle.

13. Racking help: Insure that your secondary fermenter and &#8220;racking&#8221; assembly, (cane and tubing) have been cleaned and sanitized. If you are not using an Auto-Siphon: to get your siphon going, fill the tubing and racking cane with water. Place your thumb over the hose end, trapping the water. Insert the racking cane into the primary fermenter, which will be on the countertop and run the water off into a cup or the sink. The beer will follow the water and when it does, place the tubing
all the way to the bottom of the secondary fermenter, which will be on the floor. Avoid splashing the beer.

14. Bottling:
5 gallons of beer is 640 ounces. This requires 54-12 oz. bottles, 40-16 oz. bottles or 29-22 oz. bottles or any desired combination. Use Non-screw bottles only. Clean and sanitize them along with a matching number of caps.

15. Repeat step #9 to attain the Final Gravity reading. Subtract this reading from the Original Gravity reading and multiply by 105, this will give you the Alcohol by weight (ABW) of your beer. Multiply this number by 1.25 to attain the Alcohol of Volume (ABV).

16. In a sauce pan, bring 1 pint of water to a boil and add ¾ cup of corn sugar or 1 1/4 cups of dry malt extract (not table sugar). Boil for 3 minutes. Pour this mixture into your clean, sanitized bottling bucket.

17. Now repeat the siphoning process of your beer, from the secondary fermenter into the bottling bucket. The bottling sugar (syrup) will mix evenly throughout the beer and give you consistent carbonation in each bottle.

18. Bottle and cap immediately using the siphoning method, allowing 1-1 ½&#8221; of air space in each bottle. Again, avoid splashing.

19. Store the bottled beer at room temperature, preferably in a dark area, for 10 - 21 (Suggested) days and allow to carbonate. Cool and drink!

Tips and fine-tuning:
- Try to boil and cool the largest possible volume you can manage.
- Varying the fermentation temperature will result in different
flavors. fermentinging warm (up to 72 degrees) will produce fruity,
estery qualities.
-An LCD stick-on thermometer will allow you to monitor fermentation temperatures.
-Always be sure to sanitize every piece of brewing equipment after your brew session.
 
"14. Bottling:
5 gallons of beer is 640 ounces. This requires 54-12 oz. bottles, 40-16 oz. bottles or 29-22 oz. bottles or any desired combination. Use Non-screw bottles only. Clean and sanitize them along with a matching number of caps."

Does this mean no P.E.T. bottles?
 
"14. Bottling:
5 gallons of beer is 640 ounces. This requires 54-12 oz. bottles, 40-16 oz. bottles or 29-22 oz. bottles or any desired combination. Use Non-screw bottles only. Clean and sanitize them along with a matching number of caps."

Does this mean no P.E.T. bottles?

Nope, sorry, just didn't think of them.
 
Austin Homebrew Supply kits instructions seem to be pretty good. I could scan one and post it for you all to see if you want.
 
16. In a sauce pan, bring 1 pint of water to a boil and add ¾ cup of corn sugar or 1 1/4 cups of dry malt extract (not table sugar). Boil for 3 minutes. Pour this mixture into your clean, sanitized bottling bucket.

Hi everybody! First post so excuse the noobness.

Is this step absolutely necessary? The bottling bucket part, I should say. Can I just add the corn sugar/DME mixture straight to the primary? Why is this step (bottling bucket) needed anyway? For clarity of the brew?

Thanks! :mug:
 
hi all, my first post.

I only recently discovered that home brewing is doable. Unfortunately I live in Cyprus and there are no home brew stores. In addition, few people ship and its very expensive.

Thankfully I found a UK store and Coopers Micro Brewery is on its way to me. It looks much superior than Mr. Beer. There is a hydrometer, carbonation drops (instead of sugar) and a themometer on the fermenter. Anyone have any experience with Coopers?

Anyway, Coopers manual says 4-7 days fermentation and 7 days in bottle. So I guess they too follow the quick make theory.

I'm glad I found such great info on the net. I will follow your advise and ferment for 14 days and bottle for 14 days before trying it.

My only concern is that during the day, the temperature is around 32 degrees celcius.... But I am wondering, will the air temperature and the fermenter have similar temp? From what I read the fermenter will have higher temp than the air temp? Is that right? Any way I can cool down? I've been told I can try wet towels on the fermenter....

Sophocles
 
32 is a bit warm for beer. A cheap and easy solution is a "swamp cooler". You basically fill a bin or plastic tub with water and cool it down with frozen bottles. Draping a shirt over the fermenter will also help because of evaporative cooling. I'd aim to get your beer around 20 if at all possible.
 
32 is a bit warm for beer. A cheap and easy solution is a "swamp cooler". You basically fill a bin or plastic tub with water and cool it down with frozen bottles. Draping a shirt over the fermenter will also help because of evaporative cooling. I'd aim to get your beer around 20 if at all possible.
#

Pointing a fan at the set up will help cool it as well.
I start getting concerened if mine goes over 23c
 
16. In a sauce pan, bring 1 pint of water to a boil and add ¾ cup of corn sugar or 1 1/4 cups of dry malt extract (not table sugar). Boil for 3 minutes. Pour this mixture into your clean, sanitized bottling bucket.

Why not table sugar ? I always use it to carbonate. It's 100% fermentable and you only use a small quantity so I don't see the problem.
 
I am scarred to bottle under 3 weeks, I can't imagine 5-10 days. How much clearing really happens in 5-10 days reallY if it takes 3 to ferment?

Actually some yeast are known to ferment fast, like WLP007 and also floccuates very high so I could see this yeast doing it jobs in 10 days to ferment out and clean up most of the way. I just don't want to try it. I have a 1.084 beer going now with WLP007, I didn't check with a hydrometer but I think it was done after about 48 hours. I had a big starter and lots of o2 though.
 
32 is a bit warm for beer. A cheap and easy solution is a "swamp cooler". You basically fill a bin or plastic tub with water and cool it down with frozen bottles. Draping a shirt over the fermenter will also help because of evaporative cooling. I'd aim to get your beer around 20 if at all possible.


If I use a "swamp cooler" would it matter if the tub is not deep? The thing is that 1/3 of the fermenter will be in the cooler and 2/3 out of it. Do you think it matters much?
 
Thats ok, just make sure to drape a shirt over the fermenter. Water will wick up the shirt and evaporate, which will help to cool the beer even more.
 
My 1.047 stout took about three days to ferment out. I bottled it on day 10. It was carbed by about day 15 and quite delicious before day 21. I'd have no problem serving it to anyone who likes stouts. Factors like yeast health, temperature control and proper water chemistry go a long way to making good beer and in less time. The fact is a screwed up brew probably will never taste as good as this one does. Time is too often used to cover up mistakes and people end up drinking stale beer. I don't want a 1.047 beer around for months.
 
The first beer i made i bottled after 7 days and carbed 2 weeks. Served it up to friends they loved it...
I think they were just being nice because I wasn't happy with it.
Drinking a bottle of graff now. 4 weeks in primary 3+ weeks in bottle...
Heavenly!
Got a batch of amber Belgian ale 4 weeks primary 2 weeks in bottle drinkable but could use some more time.

I'm fairly new to this 30 gallons so far...
Point is just say no and wait!
RDWHAHB!
 
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