Gelatin in secondary

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JeepGuy

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I'm about to rack my fifth brew to secondary tonight. I'm going to put some gelatin in it about 8 days before I bottle (per the LHBS instructions), to maybe get rid of some chill haze. It's my understanding that the gelatin pulls out most of the yeast in suspension, leaving enough to bottle condition the brew. My question is: Do I have to let the brew bottle condition longer to make up for the lowered amount of yeast, or will my usual 3 weeks to carbonation suffice? I know the brew gets better with some age, but I'm usually pretty eager to try it and drink some, so at least a few disappear right around the 3 week mark. I'd like to know when I can let some friends try it and be realtively certain that it's close to the final carbonation level.
 
Are you guys really that concerned with having a crystal clear pour? I mean, if we were drinking water I'd question a bit of cloudiness but this is beer and chill haze doesn't affect taste as far as I can tell.
 
Bobby_M said:
Are you guys really that concerned with having a crystal clear pour? I mean, if we were drinking water I'd question a bit of cloudiness but this is beer and chill haze doesn't affect taste as far as I can tell.

Some people might be interested in prefecting all aspects of their beer. If you are going into a competetion with your beer, chill haze could be considered a flaw.

Me? I settle for flavor/body/color, but I have tried finings before, just to see how much of an impoct they would make.
 
Bobby_M said:
Are you guys really that concerned with having a crystal clear pour? I mean, if we were drinking water I'd question a bit of cloudiness but this is beer and chill haze doesn't affect taste as far as I can tell.


Yeah . . . I get where you are coming from. However, I take almost as much pride in the appearance of my beer as I do in the flavor. There is something very satisfying about quaffing a brilliantly clear beverage - especially when that fits the style profile. I've used gelatin before, and I will use it again.

Here is for a crystal clear pint! :mug:

Carry on . . .
 
Walker-san said:
Some people might be interested in prefecting all aspects of their beer. If you are going into a competetion with your beer, chill haze could be considered a flaw.

Me? I settle for flavor/body/color, but I have tried finings before, just to see how much of an impoct they would make.

You criticized my beer for being hazy! ;)
 
sonvolt said:
Yeah . . .Here is for a crystal clear pint! :mug:

Carry on . . .

:mug: to you also. I like a clear beer also and will do anything I can to see it done.
In the odd case that I don't get clear beer, I don't worry about it. Still
tastes the same.:)
 
Thanks guys. You're all right. It's really not that big of a deal to me, but I do like the idea of presenting a crystal clear beer. It does all taste the same to me, but I'm simply trying to improve on every aspect of it as best I can. It is possible that I should focus on other aspects of my brews right now before I worry about such small things as chill haze, but if doing something as simple as adding some gelatin to it will clear it up, then why not? That's just where I'm coming from on it.

Thanks again.
 
Finings may also strip a bit of flavor. The chemical reaction that allows the haze to flocc out also results in some flavor compounds floccing out. I have never noticed, but I have read this.

You may also want to try isinglass if you can find it. I think that isinglass is more traditional for use in ales/lagers than is gelatin.
 
beer4breakfast said:
How about whirlfloc? Does it floc away flavor too? I plan to use it on my next brew.

I've used it on maybe 5 batches now with no noticeable loss of flavor. It makes the beer super clear (provided you cool the wort quickly) and more drinkable.
 
beer4breakfast said:
How about whirlfloc? Does it floc away flavor too? I plan to use it on my next brew.

I sure hope not. I just bought a container of whirlfloc tablets at LHBS on Friday. I plan on using a tablet on my brew this afternoon (American Amber Ale...sort of my own recipe). I was going to get some irish moss, but the owner showed me that, and it seemed a little easier than hydrating the seaweed. The cost difference was negligible.

My main concern for this batch is the Pacman yeast i washed from a Dead Guy clone I racked last week. The starter took off fine, but it seems like there's some film type material on top of the starter beer. I think it's just fallen krausen that hasn't settled to the bottom yet, but the little pessimist in me is whispering in my ear that it's some nasty bacteria...I think it's due time to RDWHAHB.
 
Isn't whirfloc basicly Irish Moss that's been powdered and compressed into tablet form? I never hydrate my IM and have good results, I get really good clarity if I add the IM withthe bittering hops. Don't know if I'm losing anything, but it does the job. With some beers I don't think it matters (stout) and some I almost expect to be cloudy (hefeweizen, Trappist style).
 
My HB Club had commented on how clear my beers were. They asked if I used Irish Moss or if I filtered. I do neither.

I don't add anything to remove chill haze, because I don't ever see it in my beer. I brew light to dark. Even the darker ambers are very clear. No translucency whatsoever. Just clear

Everything I brew goes into the fridge after two weeks of carbonating in the bottle. My first beer is about 2-3 "Months" later. So it sits for a while. I have alot on hand so I'm never w/o a beer to drink while waiting it out.

I always use dry ale yeast; usually Muntons Premium Gold or Danstar Nottingham Ale.
 
Carne de Perro said:
Isn't whirfloc basicly Irish Moss that's been powdered and compressed into tablet form? I never hydrate my IM and have good results, I get really good clarity if I add the IM withthe bittering hops. Don't know if I'm losing anything, but it does the job. With some beers I don't think it matters (stout) and some I almost expect to be cloudy (hefeweizen, Trappist style).

On my whirlfloc container, it says it's an Irish Moss product, so, yes. So, if some people claim that Irish Moss can detract on some flavors, than it stands to reason that whirlfloc tablets would do the same. In all honesty, I don't think it's anything to worry about, however.
 
Schlenkerla said:
My HB Club had commented on how clear my beers were. They asked if I used Irish Moss or if I filtered. I do neither.

I don't add anything to remove chill haze, because I don't ever see it in my beer. I brew light to dark. Even the darker ambers are very clear. No translucency whatsoever. Just clear

Everything I brew goes into the fridge after two weeks of carbonating in the bottle. My first beer is about 2-3 "Months" later. So it sits for a while. I have alot on hand so I'm never w/o a beer to drink while waiting it out.

I always use dry ale yeast; usually Muntons Premium Gold or Danstar Nottingham Ale.

Well no wonder you're getting clear beer, you're lagering it! :D
(Lagering ale, what will they think of next...)
 
Carne de Perro said:
Well no wonder you're getting clear beer, you're lagering it! :D
(Lagering ale, what will they think of next...)

Yah, I guess your right. I am lagering. Duh... I never thought prior to writting the post that not everyone has an extra fridge.

Very good point. :mug:
 
Out of curiosity, have you done a side-by-side comparison of your lagered ale beside on that hasn't had the cold treatment to see how they differ? I'm curious as I haven't heard of anyone doing this before.
 
I don't think that clarifying agents in the boil will result in a loss of flavor compounds. Most people who make this complaint apply it to the use of gelatin in the secondary.
 
Carne de Perro said:
Out of curiosity, have you done a side-by-side comparison of your lagered ale beside on that hasn't had the cold treatment to see how they differ? I'm curious as I haven't heard of anyone doing this before.

No, I haven't done a side by side. When I first started homebrewing all of my brews were warm conditioned, then refridgerated up to about two days to as little as an hour before drinking. I don't recall any haze but it wasn't long until I bought a fridge. Right after batch #2. I think... Since then all have gone straight to the fridge after carbonation.

I did some reading on making bottle conditioned lagers. "Better Beer & How to Brew It" by M.R. Reese. He talks about the traditional lager fermentation methods and then goes on to say that you can ferment at lager yeast temp ~ 50-60F and then bottle, carbonate and refridge for 6-8weeks. He claims the end results improve the quality but not as good as the true lagering method. Which is what I have done every time from batch #3. I'm on my 14th so far. All Ales!

I just bottled my 1st cream ale made w/ superior lager yeast. Even with 60'F fermentation is pretty smooth. Used 6lbs Light DME and 1.5oz cascade. I'll see how good it is in January. Probably at Superbowl Time. :ban:
 
Schlenkerla said:
Everything I brew goes into the fridge after two weeks of carbonating in the bottle. My first beer is about 2-3 "Months" later. So it sits for a while. I have alot on hand so I'm never w/o a beer to drink while waiting it out.

Dang. You must have a heck of a big fridge or you don't brew that often. I have a dedicated beer fridge, a 21 cubic foot one, out in my garage. I could no way keep all of my beer in it that I've recently brewed. I can't fix six cases in it, and I'll soon have two more cases.
 
I have a decent sized fridge, 28cuft. I also bottle into quarts so it takes up less space. I usually have about 15 gallons in the fridge at all times. The most I have had is 18 without really trying to pack 'em in. I brew pretty regularly in 2.5 gallon sizes about once a month. I do 5 gallon sizes every 3-4 months.
 
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