Let's talk about Foam Control drops (aka Fermcap)

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What do you think of Foam Control/Fermcap Drops?

  • I've tried it -- love the stuff!

  • I've tried it -- meh.

  • I haven't tried it, but mean to.

  • I haven't even heard of this before.

  • Don't put that in my beer -- Reinheitsgebot baby!


Results are only viewable after voting.
++ on using for starters. I've ruined apartment stoves making them, finally got the foam control when I got my own place.
 
If you use fermcap in the boil do you need to put more of it into the fermenter to prevent the blow off or is the amount added to the boil sufficient?
 
If you use fermcap in the boil do you need to put more of it into the fermenter to prevent the blow off or is the amount added to the boil sufficient?

Yes.

Fermcap stays on the top of the brew in the kettle. It will stay behind in the kettle when transferred to your fermenter. 1-2 drops per gallon would have to be added to the beer when in your fermenter.
 
Ive used Fermcap in my last several batches and it works as advertised. HOWEVER, I am trying to troubleshoot this strange off flavor I have been having in the (how do I best describe this) my "Pre burps" taste kind of strange since I started using it. I bought a bigger kettle as well as FC (kind of redundant) but I notice that 'plastic-y' taste on my last few batches. Thus far, this is the only known thing that has changed in my brewing process.
I guess Ill see when this next batch comes out of the primary that I didnt use FC in the boil for.
-Me
 
Plastic (phenolic) off-flavours are generally a problem with chlorinated water or yeast/fermentation. I suspect it is purely coincidental that these popped up at the same time that you began using fermcap. The active ingredients in fermcap are non-reactive and should never make it in your glass.

You could try alternating between using and not using fermcap in your next 4 or 5 batches to see if the pattern holds. That might help eliminate coincidences a bit.

:mug:
 
I didn't read all 13 pages of posts to this thread so if this is a repeat of info I'll say sorry in advance.

From Midwest Supplies website:

Used in the fermenter, it increases the bitterness of your beer (retained IBUs) by about 10%!
 
Yeah, Joe, investigate a little further. I've used Fermcap for many years and have never had any plastic flavors or aromas in my beer (or ever had anyone comment to that effect).


TL
 
so I do a MSDS search on the stuff:
http://www.yesmsds.com/chemicals2/c...FermCap S 5D01530 MSDS Apr07 Update/index.asp
So what is FermCap??

The MSDS says it's an emulsion of Dimethylpolysiloxane (E900) using food grade
emulsifier

So I google Dimethylpolysiloxane
All I really learn is it's got a lot to do with silicone.

Silicone is funny stuff. Put a drop on a concrete floor and it wants to spread itself out one molecule thick so you get an eventual coverage of like 30 feet diameter or so. It's also got electrical properties.

I'm sure there is so much in food and everywhere else that a little more won't mean much. But still........................................................
 
I'm sure there is so much in food and everywhere else that a little more won't mean much. But still........................................................

If used properly, it will never even make it into your finished beer. It is also very inert stuff -- they even use it to make de-gassing drops for infants.

I would worry more about that aluminum pot you boil your wort in, or those brass fittings on your mash tun!!!

;) :D
 
I have used the five star equivalent of fermcap in my boil kettle, and it really didn't seem to do anything. It still boiled over, or was going to. I didn't notice any difference whatsoever.

I also tried it in my corny keg fermenter and it blew off just the same.

Was mine just defective or what?
 
I have used the five star equivalent of fermcap in my boil kettle, and it really didn't seem to do anything. It still boiled over, or was going to. I didn't notice any difference whatsoever.

I also tried it in my corny keg fermenter and it blew off just the same.

Was mine just defective or what?

Clearly. The stuff I got from Morebeer is like night and day. I can put it in the boil kettle and literally go have a nap. NO chance of boilovers.

Or perhaps you forgot to shake it up REALLY well?
 
Clearly. The stuff I got from Morebeer is like night and day. I can put it in the boil kettle and literally go have a nap. NO chance of boilovers.

Or perhaps you forgot to shake it up REALLY well?

Hmmm, i didnt shake it. Damn directions not being made for idiots like me...
 
This stuff is amazing! I have never used it in my kettle but I use it in all my fermentations. I can now add more to my fermentors and get a solid 5 cases for every 10g batch! I can also vouch it does not effect flavor or heead retention!
 
Haven't had a problem yet!

gold.jpg


Ghey pic I know... But really, I have noticed no effects to my finished product... I would rather like to see the MSDS sheets of the 400+ products in Budweiser!

:) :)

A great start would be here:

http://www.brewerssupplygroup.com/brewing_aids/foam_control.php

Budweiser has ingredients?
 
I use it on all hot side boiling including my BK and my erlenmeyer when making starters, I have a 15 gallon pot that I fill to the brim with 13.5 gallons of wort and hit it with fermcap-s and go eat lunch and come back for the 60 minute addition (90 min boil).
 
My LHBS recommends StillSpirits Top Shelf Distilling Conditioner (Defoaming Agent) to minimize boil over. This product works great but I am somewhat apprehensive about putting Silicone into my beer. The ingredients are Silicone and propylene glycol and I think it is designed for distilling, not brewing.

I used about 1/2 capful (1.5 mls)/5 gal in two batches. Have I poisoned my beer?

Thanks for any input.
 
Has anyone experienced a decrease in how vigorous of a boil you get when using fermcap? It does not make sense that it would cause the actual boiling to decrease, just the foam.
 
The major cause of foaming prior to the hot break is due to the protein not being fully coagulated. Once the colloidal protein coagulates and drops out in the hot break foaming is less of an issue. Since copper can hasten the process, I simply keep three or four pennies around by kettle. If the foaming becomes too intense I throw the pennies into the boil and watch the foam recede. Works every time and the pennies are reusable.
 
I start my boil and watch for when the foam starts to rise. At that point I start adding drops of fermcap until it drops back down. At that point I can get a nice vigorous rolling boil with no boilovers.
 
I've used it a couple of times in my beer and never noticed any off-flavors and it really does the trick in a turkey fryer when you only have maybe 1 inch of pot above the wort.

I've also had some brewing sessions where the boil just seems to behave itself and the drops were not necessary. Haven't figured out why exactly yet.

I did a stout a couple of weeks ago with McStout and we used gas drops from the store. Tamed the wild foam. We'll see soon how the flavor turned out.

And as an FYI, I boiled a small amount of wort separately on the stove, and that did not get the drops. The 2 quarts of beer that did not get the drops developed a LOT of krausen. My very quick peek into the bucket of the stuff I used drops in seems to have little to no krausen marks. I am thinking that the stuff managed to get transferred into the fermenter from the kettle, as I no-chilled the kettle outside in the snow and poured it through a strainer going into the fermenter.
 
Here's info on baby antigas drops from the insert. Simethicone is listed as the active ingredient. fyi, polydimethlysiloxane = dimethlypolysiloxane

simethicone - A mixture of polydimethylsiloxanes with antifoaming and anti-bloating effects. Simethicone reduces the surface tension of gas bubbles causing them to coalesce into larger bubbles.
 
Any comments on Silicone and/or Propylene Glycol used in the yeast starter or brew kettle?

Thanks for your input.
 
Any comments on Silicone and/or Propylene Glycol used in the yeast starter or brew kettle?

dimethlypolysiloxane is composed of silicone in some large part

I wonder it it also decreases head. (NO~!! get your mind out of the gutter NOT THAT KIND OF HEAD~!!!)
If it reduces surface tension leading to lower incidence of boil foam and krausen it's pretty much an obvious a fortori conclusion that it'll carry over into the finished product.

I won't use it. I got enough crap in my food and water as it is.
 
I wonder it it also decreases head. (NO~!! get your mind out of the gutter NOT THAT KIND OF HEAD~!!!)
If it reduces surface tension leading to lower incidence of boil foam and krausen it's pretty much an obvious a fortori conclusion that it'll carry over into the finished product.
Actually, it tends to INCREASE head. Read the early parts of the thread to find out why.

I won't use it. I got enough crap in my food and water as it is.
There are lots of people with the same reaction as you. If the added convenience of it (magic stuff) is not enough to outweigh your fear of the product, then obviously there is no reason to use it.
 
Any comments on Silicone and/or Propylene Glycol used in the yeast starter or brew kettle?

Thanks for your input.

Sorry -- I can't help here. I have no knowledge of this product (except that silicone is a major ingredient in fermcap as well).
 
The major cause of foaming prior to the hot break is due to the protein not being fully coagulated. Once the colloidal protein coagulates and drops out in the hot break foaming is less of an issue. Since copper can hasten the process, I simply keep three or four pennies around by kettle. If the foaming becomes too intense I throw the pennies into the boil and watch the foam recede. Works every time and the pennies are reusable.

Interesting tip. For any brewers that try this, make sure the pennies are actually copper (1981 or earlier).

I recently gave RebelBrewer a try because they have great prices on DME. My first batches using wheat DME in place of wheat LME resulted in mega blowoffs (5 gal wort in 6 gal Better Bottle.)

Many posters assured me this was no problem, but I lost so much material from the blowoff I have to assume my brew has changed (lost bitterness as well as head retention and hazyness).

One small concern is that I do not use a bottling bucket (severe lack of storage space). I carefully stir sugar water directly into the primary and bottle from there. I assume that this will stir up some of the fermcap from the trub but I am willing to give it a try anyway.
 
Regarding my question about Silicone and Propylene Glycol being used as anti-foaming agent, which it works great for, here is what BrewCraft had to say:

Distilling conditioner is fine. Propylene Glycol is a very common flavour carrier in a wide variety of “Natural Fruit Flavors.” That’s not what it’s purpose is here – but, it’s pretty common. Silicon is fine too. It’s not “toxic”. You also shouldn’t use a ton of it, but it’s used commonly in commercial Spirits as a way to add “weight” and “Mouthfeel”. I’ve heard that it will give you a headache in large quantities, though. For the amount suggested in the instructions, it’s basically non-existent in the final product. I think a lab would have a hard time detecting it.

Thank you for the inquiry, though.

Cheers,

Adam J. Southard
USA SALES ACCOUNT MANAGER

Next time I'll use a drop or two instead of a capful, though.
 
dimethlypolysiloxane is composed of silicone in some large part

I wonder it it also decreases head. (NO~!! get your mind out of the gutter NOT THAT KIND OF HEAD~!!!)
If it reduces surface tension leading to lower incidence of boil foam and krausen it's pretty much an obvious a fortori conclusion that it'll carry over into the finished product.

I won't use it. I got enough crap in my food and water as it is.

Dimethylpolysiloxane IS a silicone. Perhaps you meant that it is partly composed of silicon? Silicones are everywhere, Fermcap-S is my favorite use of silicones, but a tastefully done couple of implants can be almost as beautiful.
 
Lately I've been putting 5.375 gals in the fermenter, and bought some of the anti foam to put more wort in the fermenter without having foam go into the airlock when brewing high og batches.

I like the stuff..it works...I can 'squeeze' larger batches in a 6 gal bucket fermenter without worries of foamover.

My wheat IPA oozed foam for 3 days...had to remove the airlock and use a blow off tube...this would have prevented that episode and saved me a mess.
 
I've been having some vicious blowoffs recently...well ever since I got my stirplate.

And you say this will help me?

I fill a 6G BB with 5.25G of wort. (I Really want a 7G BB)


I've read this will make my final more bitter...thoughts?
 
Actually, it tends to INCREASE head. Read the early parts of the thread to find out why.

Mili grazi


There are lots of people with the same reaction as you. If the added convenience of it (magic stuff) is not enough to outweigh your fear of the product, then obviously there is no reason to use it.

Indeed.

It is actually designed to NOT make it into your beer. This is clever stuff. On its own, it is relatively heavy and does not carry a charge, meaning that it won't dissolve in water. However, with a bit of agitation (e.g., a rolling boil or active fermentation), it gets stirred up and suspends in the wort/beer. That's when it does its magic. When activity calms down, it drops out. When you siphon or rack off your beer or wort, it stays behind in the trub.

So it's miscible in water, but not soluble? And heavier than water so it precipitates out of solution?
 
I've been having some vicious blowoffs recently...well ever since I got my stirplate.

And you say this will help me?

I fill a 6G BB with 5.25G of wort. (I Really want a 7G BB)


I've read this will make my final more bitter...thoughts?

I just brewed and fermented (2) 5.25 gallon batches with Belgian yeast strains and 6 lbs of wheat DME. Normally that would be 24-36 hours of nonstop foam and goop blowoff. I added 3 drops of Fermcap S and I am glad to report ZERO blowoff. There was a healthy krausen which almost perfectly filled the headspace. This is a game changer for me because it allows me to use wheat DME rather than wheat LME.

I imagine there will be increased bitterness because a lot escapes during the blowoff (taste the blowoff foam sometime). If hope there is because my last brew came out too sweet and so far I am blaming it on the loss of bitterness from blowoff. Luckily the sweetness if mellowing out a bit with time.

One thing I am concerned about though, when to add the fermcap? On my first batch I added it right after I pitched the yeast. I added 3 drops and swirled the bottle to mix in the fermcap and the foam instantly disappeared. When I shook the bottle it would be smooth as glass and when I stopped a bunch of bubbles came up. In other words I suspect that the fermcap may have released some of the gas that I painstakingly aerated into the wort (by shaking violently for a few minutes)

On my second batch I waited until the krausen began to form before I added the fermcap. As far as I understand the yeast will gobble up the oxygen in the first few hours.
 
How far up the sides are people filling carboys when using Fermcap S?

I did a three gallon IPA batch in a three gallon carboy (the three gallon mark on mine is right where it starts to taper at the top) and got some blowoff after adding Fermcap s drops.

I'm not surprised it had some blowoff but I'm curious what other people are doing in carboy's. A picture would be great.

Do you just drop the drops in and forget about it or do you shake it up after adding the drops to disperse the Fermcap?
 
I added some of this stuff to my first batch last week during the boil and it did prevent boilover. There was hardly any foaming going on at any point during the boil. However, I did not put any in the primary fermenter as I've read that it will add about 10 IBU's to your beer, and I didn't want to make it anymore bitter. I did have to use a blowoff tube to handle the krausen when the yeast got going. Can anyone attest to the extra bitterness that this stuff supposedly creates when added to the fermenter?
 
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