"Bratwursts and Shillelaghs" -- The Bar Project

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Dude

Dude

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As many of you know, we are in the process of buying a house. The garage has potential to be a future bar, and I'd like to get some ideas of what you guys would do. The idea is for this room to be a hangout. I'll have my kegerator up there, as well as at least 2 TVs. I'd like to put a bar with a few stools in it, and possibly even some pub tables/chairs.

I am toying with the idea of making half of it a bar area and the other half kind of a Packer shrine. I'd put all of the Packer paraphenelia I've saved over the years on shelves and on the walls.

What I need is possible suggestions on how to make it work, considerignthe room is a very odd shape as far as dealign with the slant of the roof. The working space in the room is approximately 20 feet long by 12 feet wide.

I've goofed around a little bit on powerpoint trying a layout. Take a look and see what you guys would do?

First some pics from the room:

At the top of the stairs
pub1.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y20/orrelse/pub1.jpg

180° turn, looking at the stairs
pub2.jpg


My powerpoint rough version of a possible set up.
BratwurstsandShillelaghs.jpg


As you can see, it is going to be tight--but I have to make it work.
Discuss. Please.
 
with the stairs where they are the bar where you have it planned, I don't see a good spot for a dart board!
What kind of tv's are you thinking about? Regular or flat panel?
 
I agree with the last comments, but I have some to add...

1) Put the bar on wheels...the kind that can lock if you want it stationary. This way you can unlock the wheels and move it around easily to different areas of the room for rearranging.

2) Insulate the ceiling well prior to drywalling.

3) For the short side walls you can design a sliding door system or a removable framed panel system so you can have access to that area for storage. Build in some shelves in the same area. Do a search on Google for using hidden storage space. They usually have some great ideas.:D

4) Do you "technically" need a second escape route? You may want to consider a small 3-4' wide deck with stairs (or fireman's pole) outside one of the windows, or put in a door, but I'm sure that would not be feasible since you need a wall for the dartboard...

5) Speaking of dartboards...After you're finished the drywalling you can install a dartboard from the ceiling on a system like the basketball backboards at the high school...where they tuck away (fold up to the ceiling) when not in use....just a thought...
 
BratwurstsandShillelaghs.jpg



  • Put the dartboard next to the TV to the left if you are looking at the stairs.
  • straighten the bar out, put it on wheels, when the bars NOT in use you'll be able to roll it against the wall opposit of the stairs.
  • Put cabinets and shelves alont the entire length of the wall with the bar, build your kererator into that space, buy a plasma TV and hang it behind the bar.
  • Get rid of the shelves along the right wall, replace them with a couch or 2 - few reason for this . . . gives ya a place to strach out and watch the game if you're alone, gives ya more seating besides just the stools, gives ya a place to crash when ya piss of the wife.
  • Someone mentioned a 2nd escape route - I wouldnt worry about it odds are you're grandfathered and wont need it
 
You can make it work, it'll be good.

One thought is that it looks kinda dark, and will be even moreso if you put a window AC unit in as I would expect you to. Not the end of the world for a bar, but if it wasn't too much $$ you might consider having some skylights installed.

I think the real challenge you will have is temperature control. What kind of ventilation do you have in there? These small garages can get very hot in the atti space, even up north by me. You may need to install a ridge vent or something to keep air moving. If temps can be controlled, you've got lots of built-in storage behind those little side walls - but again, temperature is going to be key. If you can control that, I would hesitate a little in putting up permanant shelves, as you could do some deep aging and storage in those spaces.

Is the space heated in the winter? What's the electical situation look like? Do you have enough juice to run a couple TVs, an AC, and everything else? I guess I'm more concerned with those issues, the "bones," more than the layout. You'll figure that out with lots of trial and error (the bar-on-wheels is a good idea).

Here's another thought; if you're going to built a real NICE bar-on-wheels, you may want to design it in such a way that you can easily disassemble it and bring it with you when you moved (since the stairs don't look any too big). Sounded like this was not your "forever" house, if you're going to be moving again in the not-too-distant future I'd keep this in mind.

I've actually thought about doing something similar in our attic, although it would be an office instead of a bar. Decided against it because I don't have enough headroom, I'd need another eighteen inches for it to make sense.
 
I would line up the couches on one side of the wall and get a flat screen tv that can be mounted across from the couches on the roof and drop down when wanting to watch tv. under the tv you can have shelf to hold all your Packer stuff. Possible run the bar the across whole back of the room.

just some ideas... wish I had a house to do cool stuff with :)
 
The problem I see is that your bar is going to suck up a bunch of space because of it's shape. In an area where space it at a premium, that's probably not the best idea.

Have you considered running the bar right on the other side of the rail for the stairs? You could do a "L" shape there are you wouldn't be very intrusive.
 
Initially, I think:

the bar comes out straight from the bottom right, no fancy angles or whatever. Put some nice shelving behind the bar, maybe some cases with glass doors, to hold your Packer memorabelia. If you have a TV over there, either a small one hung on the wall or hang one from the ceiling in the corner.

The big TV stays where it is.

Couch along the upper left hand side. If room, darts are to the immediate left of the big TV, although they might be in the wal of the couch. Better would be for the dart board to be at the very top of the stairs.

Behind the wall opposite the coach is beer storage / long-term aging. Have some access panels on that wall instead of or in addition to shelves. In front of that wall, you need to have a nice wing chair, ideally leather. Something you can sit and relax in, a place to have a nice cigar and be king. Your throne, as it is.

And since you're The Dude, you have to find a rug to bring the room together.
 
See, when I think of the Packers, I think of doormats, not area rugs.... :D

sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry... don't ban me :D
 
Thanks for all the suggestions.

A couple of things to clarify why I "proposed" it the way I did.

1. The bar shape was just a wag to maximize seats. After your suggestions, yes, I am actually leaning more towards a portable type bar now. I mean, who is actually going to sit at the bar? I dunno.

2. I do think I'm going to add a couch at some point, but damn I gotta keep costs down. I have a feelign after I purchase all the drywall and a window A/C unit my costs are going to be outrageous. I have to do this as cheaply as I can, but I don't want this place to be cheesy.

3. I also have to worry about flooring. Im a total retard when it comes to home improvement, so I have no idea where to start.

4. My TVs will have to be what I have right now. I have an extra 36 incher that flickers pretty badly but it will have to do for now. The other one in the left corner is a small 19 incher that will go on a shelf in the corner. So, shoot me getting a plasma out of the sky for a LONG, LONG time. If I got a plasma I'd have a hard time convincing SWMBO that it belongs up there.

5. Lighting, yes, may be a problem. I'll prolly add track lighting or something down the road. For now, that flourescent light in the center along with some cheap stand-up lamps will do for the time brewing.

6. I don't know if I can line up couches on the sides or not. The roof slope is so steep right there that my first inclination is the only thing that will work will be shelves. We'll see.

6. The roof has ventilation fans. Shouldn't be a problem. I'll prolly heat it with an electric heat fan. It really never gets too cold here anyway.

7. Yes, dartboard is absolutely mandatory. If you notice in the drawing, the first place I imagined it was hanging on the wall at the top of the steps. The red line at the top of the steps is the throwing line, just for reference. Would suck if you popped somebody with a dart as they walk up the steps though. So now, if I go with a smaller bar, I could move it to the opposite corner. That'll work better.

8. Electricity. The downstairs part of the garage has outlets, so I'll prolly end up getting an electrician to maximize the power on the second floor. Plus I'll need to up the power anyway for the window unit.
 
I’ve lived in an apartment with a sloping roof. Its tempting to put a couch under the sloping part of the roof because it minimizes the dead space. Just make sure you don’t stand up too fast when your team scores a touchdown.

I will not elaborate on this incident or comment on how long I lay on the floor unconscious.
 
the_bird said:
See, when I think of the Packers, I think of doormats, not area rugs.... :D

sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry... don't ban me :D
Click to expand...

God, that is getting so old. I can take the Packer insults with the best of them, but hijacking every damn thread with the same crap is really pushing my patience.
 
C'mon, it's a joke. I'm waiting for you to start back with the "Is that Tom Brady or Jan Brady playing QB for the Pats?" cracks. It's all in fun.
 
7. I don't think I would want to be that close to a stairwell while playing darts after having a few homebrews. One thing you know you're going to retrieve your darts and then all of a sudden you fall down the stairs and your shoes fall off.
 
todd_k said:
7. I don't think I would want to be that close to a stairwell while playing darts after having a few homebrews. One thing you know you're going to retrieve your darts and then all of a sudden you fall down the stairs and your shoes fall off.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it was jsut a first suggestion. It'll be on the back wall.
 
I agree with the others couchs are would be great. My personal opinions are that the bar should be by the stairs ,since you would be serving your back would be to the stairs. The TV on the other end of the room. With couchs on the side walls this should give you space the a dart board right by the stairs and every one will be able to see one TV. 20x12 is quite a big space, the couchs wouldn't need alot of hieght. Shelves could be put on either side of the tv.
 
Dude said:
Thanks for all the suggestions.

A couple of things to clarify why I "proposed" it the way I did.

1. The bar shape was just a wag to maximize seats. After your suggestions, yes, I am actually leaning more towards a portable type bar now. I mean, who is actually going to sit at the bar? I dunno.

2. I do think I'm going to add a couch at some point, but damn I gotta keep costs down. I have a feelign after I purchase all the drywall and a window A/C unit my costs are going to be outrageous. I have to do this as cheaply as I can, but I don't want this place to be cheesy.

3. I also have to worry about flooring. Im a total retard when it comes to home improvement, so I have no idea where to start.

4. My TVs will have to be what I have right now. I have an extra 36 incher that flickers pretty badly but it will have to do for now. The other one in the left corner is a small 19 incher that will go on a shelf in the corner. So, shoot me getting a plasma out of the sky for a LONG, LONG time. If I got a plasma I'd have a hard time convincing SWMBO that it belongs up there.

5. Lighting, yes, may be a problem. I'll prolly add track lighting or something down the road. For now, that flourescent light in the center along with some cheap stand-up lamps will do for the time brewing.

6. I don't know if I can line up couches on the sides or not. The roof slope is so steep right there that my first inclination is the only thing that will work will be shelves. We'll see.

6. The roof has ventilation fans. Shouldn't be a problem. I'll prolly heat it with an electric heat fan. It really never gets too cold here anyway.

7. Yes, dartboard is absolutely mandatory. If you notice in the drawing, the first place I imagined it was hanging on the wall at the top of the steps. The red line at the top of the steps is the throwing line, just for reference. Would suck if you popped somebody with a dart as they walk up the steps though. So now, if I go with a smaller bar, I could move it to the opposite corner. That'll work better.

8. Electricity. The downstairs part of the garage has outlets, so I'll prolly end up getting an electrician to maximize the power on the second floor. Plus I'll need to up the power anyway for the window unit.
Click to expand...

First of all, -HOLY CRAP DUDE, if i didn't know any better Id've thought I was looking at pics of my own garage upstairs. It looks almost exactly the same 'cept mine has a small dormer going out one side.

A couple thoughts:
I dunno about the dartboard. The ceiling is kinda low, and your darts may wind up hitting the ceiling. Just a thought.

Don't be too shocked when the electrician gives you his bill. You're probably going to need a decent sized subpanel out there to feed all the toys that you'll be putting in (assuming there isn't already one out there.) That means trenching from the house to the garage, burying pipe, coax for the TVs, phone lines, etc. I'd volunteer, but VA is kinda far......

I wouldn't use a heat fan out there if I wuz you. IMHO they are a fire waiting to happen. Have the electrician put in one or two baseboard heaters. Much more efficient, and a lot safer, and can be controlled by a line-voltage thermostat. That's all I can think of at the moment. I'll post more if I think of anything else.
Sorry if this was kinda negative....
 
You could also install a trapdoor that goes over the stairwell entrance, thereby creating a needed "safety net" so to speak (for the drunkards).
 
As to the floor, it depends a little bit on what condition the current floor is in. You might be able to put down a cheap hardwood laminate, that's a pretty easy project, but you would need to have a pretty level base to begin with (which I doubt they concerned themselves too highly with when they built this).

Do you have a budget in mind?
 
Floor wise I always wanted to have a astro turf type floor, and with the Packer decore it just might work for ya. Head to Home Depot and check out prices on that plastic grass indoor/outdoor "carpet". It's not too expensive, ya wont have to worry about things being spilt on it and you can paint yard lines onto it :tank:

As for the stairs I figured you were going to put up a few studs and dry wall them off just dont put a door in at the top
 
Pumbaa said:
Floor wise I always wanted to have a astro turf type floor, and with the Packer decore it just might work for ya. Head to Home Depot and check out prices on that plastic grass indoor/outdoor "carpet". It's not too expensive, ya wont have to worry about things being spilt on it and you can paint yard lines onto it :tank:

As for the stairs I figured you were going to put up a few studs and dry wall them off just dont put a door in at the top
Click to expand...
...or you could paint a field with yard markers right on your floor...:D
 
Don't think that this has been suggested yet, and I am not sure of your budget, but I would dorma one side of the roof. I would do this before I bought the TV or any of the other toys. Before you get comfy, jack half the roof and dorma it if it is in your budget. You will gain more useable floorspace, and it will work better in the long run.

check out a quick drawing that shows the available space w/wo a dorma

dorma.JPG
 
ablrbrau said:
First of all, -HOLY CRAP DUDE, if i didn't know any better Id've thought I was looking at pics of my own garage upstairs. It looks almost exactly the same 'cept mine has a small dormer going out one side.

A couple thoughts:
I dunno about the dartboard. The ceiling is kinda low, and your darts may wind up hitting the ceiling. Just a thought.

Don't be too shocked when the electrician gives you his bill. You're probably going to need a decent sized subpanel out there to feed all the toys that you'll be putting in (assuming there isn't already one out there.) That means trenching from the house to the garage, burying pipe, coax for the TVs, phone lines, etc. I'd volunteer, but VA is kinda far......

I wouldn't use a heat fan out there if I wuz you. IMHO they are a fire waiting to happen. Have the electrician put in one or two baseboard heaters. Much more efficient, and a lot safer, and can be controlled by a line-voltage thermostat. That's all I can think of at the moment. I'll post more if I think of anything else.
Sorry if this was kinda negative....
Click to expand...


Not negative at all--big help. We fully plan on spending a bunch for an electrician to come out. I need to look and see exactly what kind of power is out there already. Might even be a sub-panel--not sure.

Wouldn't they just be able to tap into the outside power lines and add a panel? I'd rather that instead of trenching through the yard and crap.

Good idea on the baseboard heaters--with all of that unused space on the sides that is a great idea.

Pumbaa said:
Floor wise I always wanted to have a astro turf type floor, and with the Packer decore it just might work for ya. Head to Home Depot and check out prices on that plastic grass indoor/outdoor "carpet". It's not too expensive, ya wont have to worry about things being spilt on it and you can paint yard lines onto it :tank:

As for the stairs I figured you were going to put up a few studs and dry wall them off just dont put a door in at the top
Click to expand...

Actually was already leanign towards that option for at least part of the floor in the "Packer" part of the room. Near the bar area I was considering a laminate so it would be easier to clean spills and such.
homebrewer_99 said:
...or you could paint a field with yard markers right on your floor...:D
Click to expand...

Most definitely.
 
Dude said:
Might even be a sub-panel--not sure.

Wouldn't they just be able to tap into the outside power lines and add a panel? I'd rather that instead of trenching through the yard and crap.
Click to expand...

What you are describing is adding an additional electrical service to your property. That means another meter, another monthly service charge, and possibly a more expensive installation, and definitely more expensive in the long run. Besides, you still need to get your coax for the TV's out there, and also a phone line, and I'm sure you're gonna want your computer out there so you can post with us losers at HBT. As long as you're running that stuff, you might as well run a decent electrical supply. If you do end up digging a trench, it will only be about six inches wide and will be backfilled the same day. All you'll need to do is plant a little grass seed.
 
ablrbrau said:
What you are describing is adding an additional electrical service to your property. That means another meter, another monthly service charge, and possibly a more expensive installation, and definitely more expensive in the long run. Besides, you still need to get your coax for the TV's out there, and also a phone line, and I'm sure you're gonna want your computer out there so you can post with us losers at HBT. As long as you're running that stuff, you might as well run a decent electrical supply. If you do end up digging a trench, it will only be about six inches wide and will be backfilled the same day. All you'll need to do is plant a little grass seed.
Click to expand...

Oh, got ya. Thanks.

I'll see what happens when the time comes. I'm getting concerned we may not even get the place unless the owners budge on some maintenance issues.
 
Assuming that you do end up getting the place...

Is there a basement? To get this place the way you want it, you might be able to do it a LOT cheaper working in the basement, leaving the space above the garage for deep-storage and whatever else you usually WOULD use the basement for. You've already got plenty of power down there. Easier to tap into the cable. Won't have to worry about heating the place, or cooling it too much. Much easier all the way around.

Not as cool as having the space above the garage, but that's going to be a huge project, and if you aren't terribly handy and have to pay someone to do a lot of it will quickly get very expensive.

You'd still use the garage as Brew HQ, but you wouldn't have to worry about additional power (unless you have a lot of fridges out there, or heating, or cooling, or any of that.

Just a thought, you might end up with a lot nicer space for the same money if you work underground instead of skyward.
 
the_bird said:
Assuming that you do end up getting the place...

Is there a basement? To get this place the way you want it, you might be able to do it a LOT cheaper working in the basement, leaving the space above the garage for deep-storage and whatever else you usually WOULD use the basement for. You've already got plenty of power down there. Easier to tap into the cable. Won't have to worry about heating the place, or cooling it too much. Much easier all the way around.

Not as cool as having the space above the garage, but that's going to be a huge project, and if you aren't terribly handy and have to pay someone to do a lot of it will quickly get very expensive.

You'd still use the garage as Brew HQ, but you wouldn't have to worry about additional power (unless you have a lot of fridges out there, or heating, or cooling, or any of that.

Just a thought, you might end up with a lot nicer space for the same money if you work underground instead of skyward.
Click to expand...

Nope. Basements in houses around here are pretty rare.

My only option is the upstairs garage. Cost won't really be a problem--I'll try to keep it low and do everything myself. If I screw it up, I rip it out and buy new materials. This way I should get some pretty cool new tools too, so it is win-win.
I won't fukc with electricity though. :)
 
Dude said:
Nope. Basements in houses around here are pretty rare.

My only option is the upstairs garage. Cost won't really be a problem--I'll try to keep it low and do everything myself. If I screw it up, I rip it out and buy new materials. This way I should get some pretty cool new tools too, so it is win-win.
I won't fukc with electricity though. :)
Click to expand...

Ah come on, Dude- It only hurts for a little while:D And the fireworks are really cool:rockin:
 
ablrbrau said:
Ah come on, Dude- It only hurts for a little while:D And the fireworks are really cool:rockin:
Click to expand...

In my automotive electricity class, the instructor kept saying if you screwed something up, "you'd let the smoke out", meaning the wires frying and smoking meant you were a tool.

Let's just say I was letting lots of smoke out of those wires. Ummm...I'll be needing to take that class again before I get my automotive degree. :rolleyes:
 
Well, taking the pics down. We released ourselves from the contract today because the current owners refuse to do the maintenance issues we asked for.

Stay tuned for a "Bratwursts and Shillelaghs II" thread, hopefully in the coming weeks.

Thanks everyone for the valuable input though--maybe we can put those ideas together later! :)
 
Maybe you should just buy and move into a bar. You know, set up a little room with cots in the back for the wife and little one. Maybe a wash board in the slop sink. But then you would have a great place to hang out and drink with tons of space for the toys. Maybe there is an old TGIFridays or something you can pick up cheap.
 
Brewpastor said:
Maybe you should just buy and move into a bar. You know, set up a little room with cots in the back for the wife and little one. Maybe a wash board in the slop sink. But then you would have a great place to hang out and drink with tons of space for the toys. Maybe there is an old TGIFridays or something you can pick up cheap.
Click to expand...

Best. Idea. Ever.
 

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