Efficiency

So here's the word's stupidest question. How do you measure efficiency? I see a lot of posts boasting about high efficiency, but I'm pretty lost on how it's calculated or estimated. Any beginner info on efficiency would be great. If there's a page or a site or whatever that explains a lot, that would be as good as anything. I've only done Partial mash but I just got my 10g brewpot and am looking to do my first AG this weekend. Danke.

A few searches would bring up these and quite a bit more.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Efficiency

or you can use a calculator like this

And you can read this:

http://www.suebob.com/brew/allgrain.htm

OK so I understand the efficiency and I know how to measure from the max ratio however I am confused on one item and I cannot seem to find the answers I am looking for. In a nut shell when I mash I usually mash ten pounds. I know my system requires 7 gallons to boil to 5.5 in 1.5 hours. So I try to arrange it so I end up with 7 gallons pre boil. But I think that I am over mashing and sparging and I think its hurting my outcome.

Say that I prefer a stiff mash of 1 quart of water/pound of grain. For 8 pounds of grain (using a different mash size than previously mentioned) the amount of water for the mash comes to 2 gallons of water for the mash. To sparge (batch) I would use 2 quarts per pound which comes to 5 gallons split in two separate sparges of 2.5 gallons each. So far total water used is 7 gallons of which I collected 5.5 due to loss from grain absorption etc. So for a pre boil gravity I hit 85%. see figure 1 below:

Fig 1.

Pale Malt = 38 ppg x #s used (6) / 5.5gal = ~42 points

Crystal 10 = 34 ppg x #'s used (1) / 5.5gal = ~6.2 points

Carapils = 32 ppg x #'s used (1) / 5.5gal = ~5.8 points

So my Pre Boil Gravity Max Target comes to 42 + 6.2 + 5.8 = 54 points or 1.054 @ 100% of the available sugars. So 85% percent of this figure is 43 or 1.043.

Here is where I am lost. Since I require a total amount of boil volume to be 7 gallons I need to add 1.5 gallons to the collection. When I do this How do I add the 1.5 gallons back into the equation to understand what my efficiency is? Do I figure the pre boil volume at 7 gallons? Or do I need to wait until the boil is complete and then take a measure. Hmmm. If my preboil wort volume is 5.5 and it is suppose to be 43 points at best case scenario it should be the same when I am finished if I add 1.5 gallons and then boil it down to 5.5. If this is correct maybe I just answered my question.

Can anyone let me know if this is the case?

Thanks

- WW

Efficiency is a myth like hot side aeration and bigfoot. I wouldn't worry about it too much.

Efficiency is a myth? It's a measured thing, like gravity or temperature.

Willie, the reason you're having trouble is you need to think in two different modes, one is mash/lauter and the other is brewhouse. If you're working with preboil wort, all calculations have to be done with a measured preboil volume. In your calculation above, you were figuring out brewhouse by using the finished volume of 5.5 gallons.

If you want to figure for preboil, you have to use the higher volume (7gallons in your calculations).

Pale Malt = 38 ppg x #s used (6) / 7gal = ~32.5 points

Crystal 10 = 34 ppg x #'s used (1) / 7gal = ~4.8 points

Carapils = 32 ppg x #'s used (1) / 7gal = ~4.5 points

That's a total of 41.8 points measured at 7 gallons preboil at 100% extract.

My only other point to make is that you shouldn't sparge based on a fixed water/grain ratio. Sparge to reach the desired preboil volume. If you have to measure your first runnings to find out what that volume of sparge water needs to be, do it.

Bobby,

Thanks for the tip. Hey I'm from Hackettstown. Next time we brew maybe we can make a day of it together with my brother-in-law who is also a brewer.

Let me know.

- WW

Bobby_M said:

My only other point to make is that you shouldn't sparge based on a fixed water/grain ratio. Sparge to reach the desired preboil volume. If you have to measure your first runnings to find out what that volume of sparge water needs to be, do it.

Click to expand...

I completely agree with this. In your example, you would need to sparge with two batches of 3.25g sparge water to achieve the pre-boil volume of 7g. If you want to sparge with twice the amount of sparge water, you would need to add an extra 0.5g mash water, and 2 batches of 3g sparge water.
On the other hand, I prefer your method of determining your mash/lauter efficiency. It's what Promash does, and the way I calculate it. Both methods however are flawed in that they don't take the moisture content of the grain into account.

-a.

If you sparge with too much water wouldn't you leech tannins?

-WW

You can, but it's really hard to do with batch sparging when you stick with fixed preboil volumes. When the OG you're shooting for is lower, like 1.040 and less, it becomes easier to oversparge. Anything higher than that and it's almost impossible unless you're collecting 9 gallons for a 5 gallon batch.

So when are you brewing again? I just ordered 50 more pounds of Am 2 Row and have about the same in a variety of specialty grains. I have 4 different batches fermenting or conditioning and need to start another batch to keep the line going.

This weekend is out but let me know and we can set a date to brew in NJ!

Thanks for the information and help on H2O quantities.

Talk to you soon!

- WW

The next couple weekends are going to be tough for me because I have some business travel and home remodeling projects going on. I don't want to shrug it off though so keep in touch so we can work it out in the near future. If it happens at my place, I have a Belgian Wit in the plans. My system is not portable at all so if yours is, we can plan to brew here.

Unless you are running off 8 gallons for a 5 gallon batch making a 1.040 beer with water that has a pH of 8.5, I doubt you will extract any tannins.

RDWHAHB