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So my postings here and on my blog have been all over the place, because the recipe is changing all the time. I settled on something close 90/5/5 for this 2nd attempt, but it might have been more like 90/6/4/, Pearl/Munich/Dextrose. Was going to do all Pearl, but once I got the right lovibond in there for my new batch of Pearl, it wasn't dark enough and I pulled a draft off the ol' kegerator and didn't think my 1st attempt was sweet enough. I didn't think going even less munich and sugar would have been a good idea. I did drop the carapils though.

I haven't dry hopped, but I did 70IBUs of hopshot (1st attempt wasn't bitter enough). Hops change was due to too little orange and too much grapefruit. Not talking huge problems here, just minor things I wanted to adjust.

5 minute addition was 1 ounce each of Simcoe, Cascade, and 0.75 of Centennial. 0.5 of Chinook and Columbus, and 0.25 of Nugget. Total 4 ounces.
Whirlpool was the same at 180-185 for 30 minutes.

Dryhop will be very similar. So far, side by side of the tester and clone 1 I did yesterday and my brewed batch is more orange and less grapefruit. I think the bitterness is correct. Per beersmith, with my whirlpool entered as a 6 minute editions for each hop, I was at 125.5IBU.

I know I said I was going to do Amarillo, but I felt a lack of cascade was my problem. If I'm not there yet, I will actually do Amarillo next time.

I will also say that Skinnypete is definitely onto something with the sweetness. It's not quite right with my malt bill, too dry. I don't think I addressed it in my 2nd attempt because I wasn't really sure what to do and didn't have enough time to research ideas. I'll see if this extra citrus I'm getting can help the perception of sweetness, if not, I'll be changing the grain bill again.
 
Just a follow-up on my latest attempt. My first tasting after 10 days in primary was pretty spot on..very exciting. Might have been a little less bitter, and maybe slightly less citrusy, but really close. The aroma from the whirlpooling was insane - like I had already dry hopped. Aroma was near perfect - fruity with a hint of pungent pine hops. I left it in primary for 4 more days and racked to secondary. Going into secondary, no more aroma. In 4 days, just completely gone. The taste changed quite a bit too. Pungent pine hops mellowed and the alcohol punch came through pretty strong, after only going down from 1.015 to 1.012 in 4 days. Still good, but I'm now thinking I may be less close than I first thought, but still too early to tell. Still has a very Heady taste...but not strong enough I don't think. I'm going to do the second round of dry-hopping right in the keg, then cold crash and chill for a week or so. I'll update again when it is done.

If you want to do a side by side tasting with some fresh Heady, I got some. We're in the same town, PM me if you are interested.

-Mike
 
Sounds like a great beer, looking forward to more great info and hopefully trying to brew something similar.

Did anyone figure out if this yeast is a lager, ale or combo of each? the yeast sounds like it plays a huge role.
 
Sounds like a great beer, looking forward to more great info and hopefully trying to brew something similar.

Did anyone figure out if this yeast is a lager, ale or combo of each? the yeast sounds like it plays a huge role.

I think it's safe to say it is not a lager yeast. False alarm.
 
I will also say I think the recipes I've tried are close enough that I really won't be able to tell much more how close they are without a side by side of a fresh can. I'm going to have to get a trade going.
 
My first attempt is brewed and chugging away. Mashed at 149 with the ~90/5/5 grain bill. Hit 1.068. ~6 ml of Shot, 3 hops adds; at 5 min, knockout (20 min stand) and then a second stand with the third add from ~200 down to ~185 (~30 mins). Very interesting brew, the break material was like none other and the fermenter really does resemble the color of khaki pants or Bailey's. Kinda psyched...
 
Just for fun, what is everyone's opinion on solving a possible sweetness issue? We know SkinnyPete's, what about everyone else? Not sure if my 2nd attempt will have the same problem or if it even is a problem, but if it is, I'm all ears for fixes. If it really does end at 1.010 and we assume somewhere around 85%+ of Pearl, what can be done to sweeten it up a bit?

I'm thinking now I might split this batch before I dryhop so I can test out adding Amarillo again.
 
I built up a nice starter of Conan, but didn't have time to brew, so I let my friend use it. He has a great DIPA recipe so he figured he would just brew that but ferment with Conan. I guess I forgot to tell him that Conan does best at cooler temps (60-62). His brew is one week in and he said the yeast kicked ass, but the beer tastes like peach. Not a little peach, a ton of peach! Be careful with your temps! As always, it's very important!

-Mike
 
I guess I forgot to tell him that Conan does best at cooler temps (60-62). His brew is one week in and he said the yeast kicked ass, but the beer tastes like peach. Not a little peach, a ton of peach! Be careful with your temps! As always, it's very important!

-Mike

Interesting. I had the opposite experience. My last attempt, I ended up with 6.5gal of wort so I threw 1 gallon in a jug and fermented warm (71) to see the difference. I felt the cooler temp (64-ish) was much peachier than the 71. They both finished at 1.012 from a starting of 1.072 (little high), but the 71 had less fruity flavor and a much harsher alcohol bite. The 71 was also much clearer. Who knows if there was some other unknown factor here, but that's what I experienced.

Vegan, how long did you let yours cold condition before the flavor actually stayed consistent. Mine is all over the place. Seems like every other day, when I taste it - it's a different beer. As I said, first taste after 10 days was amazingly close...since then, every day gets further away. It's been cold conditioning in a keg for only 2 days but it's gone from "not bitter enough" going into the keg to a very harsh piney bitterness. I've seen hoppy beers change from day to day, but this one is all over the board. I'm not going to touch it for a week and let things mellow out.
 
Interesting. I had the opposite experience. My last attempt, I ended up with 6.5gal of wort so I threw 1 gallon in a jug and fermented warm (71) to see the difference. I felt the cooler temp (64-ish) was much peachier than the 71. They both finished at 1.012 from a starting of 1.072 (little high), but the 71 had less fruity flavor and a much harsher alcohol bite. The 71 was also much clearer. Who knows if there was some other unknown factor here, but that's what I experienced.

Vegan, how long did you let yours cold condition before the flavor actually stayed consistent. Mine is all over the place. Seems like every other day, when I taste it - it's a different beer. As I said, first taste after 10 days was amazingly close...since then, every day gets further away. It's been cold conditioning in a keg for only 2 days but it's gone from "not bitter enough" going into the keg to a very harsh piney bitterness. I've seen hoppy beers change from day to day, but this one is all over the board. I'm not going to touch it for a week and let things mellow out.

I have experience quite a bit of the inconsistency you talked about. I think I've had mine on tap for about 2 weeks. I can't remember but I think I tapped it short of day 28 of the process. For the first week or so I was surprised at how often the tastes changed. I remember the first set of pours was good, then decent, then great, but each pour was different. Every few pours I'd be like, did I even dry hop this? Then randomly one day last week I took a pour and it was perfect. Everything lined up and I was like wow, this beer tastes amazing.

It has settled now and is the same beer pour after pour. At this point, I think the nose has settled into tropical floral with a grapefruit and dank pine in the background. It's very floral, people that have tried it say it's like tropical fruit punch with a side of grapefruit. I think the taste is more towards grapefruit than I'd like though.
 
Buddy of mine just came back from an 8 hour round trip to snag some on canning day. Having one now and all I can say is this stuff is absolutely amazing, pumped out of my mind you guys are cloning it. Thank you!
 
Buddy of mine just came back from an 8 hour round trip to snag some on canning day. Having one now and all I can say is this stuff is absolutely amazing, pumped out of my mind you guys are cloning it. Thank you!

If you brew you should save the yeast if you haven't finished the can off yet.
 
Here are my results with Conan on 3 attempts, 2 clones, and one regular IPA. I crashed Clone 1 once reaching 1.010, let the IPA go on it's own and it hit 1.008, and have just reached 1.010 with attempt 3, will give it one day and see if it goes lower before crashing.

Conan-Profile.png
 
You guys seem to be getting better attenuation then me with Conan so far. My Heady clone went from 1.072 to 1.014. I am still waiting for my second beer with Conan to finish.

I gave a big slurry to my LHBS guys to work with, hopefully they report back with some more data on the strain. I think they are waiting to taste my beer before they use it though, which should be by Super Bowl Sunday.

I pulled the last stage of dry hops the other day and put it on gas, the entire room smelled amazing for a few hours. Big peach, mango and pineapple notes engulfed the room. Really the most aromatic beer I have ever brewed. I am so anxious for this beer to be in my belly.
 
Here are my results with Conan on 3 attempts, 2 clones, and one regular IPA. I crashed Clone 1 once reaching 1.010, let the IPA go on it's own and it hit 1.008, and have just reached 1.010 with attempt 3, will give it one day and see if it goes lower before crashing.

theveganbrewer: I took a look through your blog and Heady recipe. Looks really good, just one piece of feedback. 1 mL of Hopshot provides 10 ibu in 5 gallons of 1.050 wort. Given that the Heady clone's OG is 1.070, you probably need to add more like 8 or 9 mL to achieve 60 ibu (rather than 6 mL). There's a conversion chart on the paperwork that comes with the hopshot, I just don't have one near me.
 
theveganbrewer: I took a look through your blog and Heady recipe. Looks really good, just one piece of feedback. 1 mL of Hopshot provides 10 ibu in 5 gallons of 1.050 wort. Given that the Heady clone's OG is 1.070, you probably need to add more like 8 or 9 mL to achieve 60 ibu (rather than 6 mL). There's a conversion chart on the paperwork that comes with the hopshot, I just don't have one near me.

This chart?


View attachment hopshot.pdf <-- quick download the chart here


FWIW, I went with just over 6 mls. Wort sample tasted plenty bitter, I'll report on the fermented sample in a few days.
 
theveganbrewer: I took a look through your blog and Heady recipe. Looks really good, just one piece of feedback. 1 mL of Hopshot provides 10 ibu in 5 gallons of 1.050 wort. Given that the Heady clone's OG is 1.070, you probably need to add more like 8 or 9 mL to achieve 60 ibu (rather than 6 mL). There's a conversion chart on the paperwork that comes with the hopshot, I just don't have one near me.

Appreciate the feedback, I am just going off the chart I got with my hop extract product, which said at 1.070, 6mL was 60IBU. The chart says anything 1.070 and under needs the same, then from 1.080-1.100 it needs a little more, than 1.110-1.150 a little more.

According to the chart, the most accurate number would probably be around 6.06mL for 1.071.
 
Appreciate the feedback, I am just going off the chart I got with my hop extract product, which said at 1.070, 6mL was 60IBU. The chart says anything 1.070 and under needs the same, then from 1.080-1.100 it needs a little more, than 1.110-1.150 a little more.

According to the chart, the most accurate number would probably be around 6.06mL for 1.071.

That'll teach me to go from memory!
 
OK, results are somewhat in. Real thing is darker than I remembered but is the exact same in my clone. Aroma is off, bitterness too weak, body too thin. I would say mine is too much grapefruit and too much flower.

0201132273.jpg


Aroma on the Heady was not as strong as mine, but it was definitely different and better. Mine was a light grapefruit, really sweet and fragrant, thin and airy comes to mind. The Heady seems much denser, full of flavor, dank. I get some lemon zest in there for sure, mango, tangerine, earth. There is definitely some Heady present in the clone, but there is so much more of the dankiness, that hop candy taste in the Heady.

I'm getting the sense that there is something in the malt bill that I'm picking up in the nose. I think it's either oats or honey, I don't get any crystal from it at all. I'm tempted to say it's oats, not sure the nuttiness is there for Golden Naked oats, but the creaminess is definitely reminiscent of my oat IPAs, like Abrasive.

I am going to split my 5 gallons of wort into two batches and dry hop with different mixes. I'm going to go overboard on one hop on each to see if I can pick up the aroma. I will do one predominantly Columbus/Centennial/Nugget and the other Simcoe/Columbus
 
OK, results are somewhat in. Real thing is darker than I remembered but is the exact same in my clone. Aroma is off, bitterness too weak, body too thin. I would say mine is too much grapefruit and too much flower.

0201132273.jpg


Aroma on the Heady was not as strong as mine, but it was definitely different and better. Mine was a light grapefruit, really sweet and fragrant, thin and airy comes to mind. The Heady seems much denser, full of flavor, dank. I get some lemon zest in there for sure, mango, tangerine, earth. There is definitely some Heady present in the clone, but there is so much more of the dankiness, that hop candy taste in the Heady.

I'm getting the sense that there is something in the malt bill that I'm picking up in the nose. I think it's either oats or honey, I don't get any crystal from it at all. I'm tempted to say it's oats, not sure the nuttiness is there for Golden Naked oats, but the creaminess is definitely reminiscent of my oat IPAs, like Abrasive.

I am going to split my 5 gallons of wort into two batches and dry hop with different mixes. I'm going to go overboard on one hop on each to see if I can pick up the aroma. I will do one predominantly Columbus/Centennial/Nugget and the other Simcoe/Columbus

Dude! Yes!!! That looks amazing and your dry hop plan sounds awesome!! I'm gonna do an all Pearl/corn sugar test batch on Saturday, and then I will try a Pearl/oat/corn sugar batch next. I think there's something to the feel of Heady that we won't get with Pearl and carapils or Munich alone. :mug:
 
In case anyone is wondering, the beer looks a lot darker because of the baking sheet behind it, up to the light, they are the exact same too.
 
Well, I might as well post mine as well. Mine is slightly darker although it's hard to tell exactly since the Heady sample is about 6 months old so it's crystal clear. Notice in the second picture how cloudy mine is and how clear the Heady is. The cloudiness of mine may make it seem darker than it is, but it's definitely slightly darker. I should also point out, tasting notes were compared to about a month or so old Heady, took this pic when my buddy was killing the 6 month old.

Definitely not enough hops in mine to drown out the alcohol bite. Mine is sweet but this time I think it's not as sweet as Heady. Close but maybe slightly less sweet. I do get the creaminess though. I think mine is actually creamier than Heady. Mine is much fuller bodied with insane head retention in comparison. Heady tastes dry and light next to it. So, As with Vegan's, too much citrus, not enough dank pungent aroma or flavor. The aroma in mine is barely present - very disappointing. The flavor that IS there definitely has a Heady-ness to it, but I wonder if that's just the Conan. The thing that knocks me down is how prominent the smell of simcoe is in Heady side by side. Never really got a heavy one-hopped sense from the beer until I compared it to mine. I got VERY heavy simcoe in the Heady, so next attempt I'm going to step it up. My experience with simcoe is that it mellows quickly. I'm considering going stupid strong with Simcoe/Centennial in the whirlpool and dry hop next time.

So, yeah, not as close as I thought. Sounds like Vegan's attempt is much closer. I like my hop combinations but will probably go heavier on the columbus/simcoe next shot around. I may actually remove the amarillo entirely. I'm sticking with cascade though (probably the lone wolf on this one).

Vegan, I'm interested in the oats idea. Curious to see how that turns out. I'm going to up the sugar and honey malt, lower the munich (or remove entirely) to hopefully get a drier but slightly sweeter malt character with the same color.

photo 1.JPG


photo 2.JPG
 
I should have tasting notes on mine this week sometime, my cousin will be coming by with a 3 month old can for comparison. So people can keep up it might be good to post your recipe along with your tasting notes, I am sure you posted it in the thread already but that way someone can hop in and go.

I poured a quick flat sample (full of yeast) just to get a whiff and the aroma was massive...really excited to try this.
 
Oh hell yeah, mine's been in the fermenter for a week now! Once I get a cup of coffee and clear the fog, I'll take a reading and post back. Sure do wish I had some Heady for comparison (yes, that's directed at you people up over there :D )
 
Long time reader, first time poster..

Successfully harvested Conan from some cans. I am going to use it alongside EdWort's Haus Pale Ale's grainbill mostly so I can understand its properties, and so I have a lot more yeast. Then I'm going to do a clone, in large part based on tastings here, in small part based on experimentation. My goal isn't necessarily a dead-on clone, but moreso for a badass IPA inspired by it.
 
Looks great Vegan and Skinny.....:rockin:

Do you guys taste any biscuit in Heady? Maybe Vienna?

I've got to break down and start a real search for some Heady. I've got all my equipment free, so it's time to get my A$$ in gear.
 
Looks great Vegan and Skinny.....:rockin:

Do you guys taste any biscuit in Heady? Maybe Vienna?

I've got to break down and start a real search or some Heady. I've got all my equipment free, so it's time to get my A$$ in gear.

Hard to tell, Pearl is a bit dry and bready on it's own. I only put other stuff (Munich) in there for a little sweetness and to get it up towards 5.7-5.9SRM.
 
Dry hop update on my 2nd attempt. I split the 5.25 gallons or so into 2 kegs evenly. I wanted to simplify the hop additions to see if I could get the dominant heady characteristic to come out. I did one keg with the 5-gallon-batch-equivalent of 3 ounces of Simcoe and 1.5 ounces of Centennial, the other keg was 3 ounces Simcoe and 1.5 ounces of Columbus.

I figure I can add to the dry hop after a few days if I taste something missing. On the first attempt, I couldn't take out hops, so was limited to adding more on top of the 6 I put in already.
 
Super fast ferm, right? I've been sub to this thread since the beginning.
I appreciate all you brewers have done to get this right. Unfortunately, I am still working to all grain brewing, and don't have the equipment (or knowledge) to work on it. I cannot wait to try the 'final' recipe for my first all grain in the next couple months.

Thank you.
 
Super fast ferm, right? I've been sub to this thread since the beginning.
I appreciate all you brewers have done to get this right. Unfortunately, I am still working to all grain brewing, and don't have the equipment (or knowledge) to work on it. I cannot wait to try the 'final' recipe for my first all grain in the next couple months.

Thank you.

Pretty avg. for my beers. 5-7 days is what I usually see with ales, and after seeing Conan get up and go in starters, I figured he'd chew through this wort fast. I went 62 up to 64 degrees over the first three days and bumped it up to ~67 today. Couple days at ~50 and then dry hops at room temp.
 
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