Serving a Beer Snob

I am a server with a couple good beers in stock at the restaurant. This guy comes in and I greet him. Right away he says "I am a beer snob." I just say okay. Then he asked what we have on tap. I tell him the only two goods ones we have on tap (Dogfish Head 60 min, and Great Lakes Dortmunder).

He has never hear of either of the breweries. I understand he has never heard of Great Lakes, but I would imagine a beer snob would of heard of Dogfish Head. Anyway, He head no idea what an IPA was. He had no clue what a Dortmunder was. So I described them. He wanted me to reccommend one. So,

I am just thinking this guy thinks he is a beer snob but doesn't know much. So I told him to get the Dortmunder (a very tasty brew by the way), I chose it because it seemed like he hasn't tried much beer past a BMC. So this was the closest of the two. In the end he enjoyed very much.

It just caught off guard, having right away proclaim himself a beer snob. Then asking me all these questions. Which I enjoy answering questions about beer for people who have are curious. But this guy was just very snobby.

P.S. I though of this after reading a blog posted from Boerderij_Kabouter, so I thought I would share.

Weird, eh? If he comes back, ask him what some of his favorite beers are. That will tell you a bit about what HE thinks it means to be a "beer snob".

I've starting announcing myself as a beer snob, at some places. Because then, you don't have to say, "Corona, Coors, Coors Light, Bud Light, Budweiser, MGD, etc" when I ask you what kind of beer you have available.

Now, if you answer, "Oh! We have a good selection, with tap beers from DFH and Great Lakes and bottled beers from Great Lakes, Rogue, etc", then we've cut about 3 minutes of your time out of the equation. I thought it would be considerate to do that to a server when I have NO intention of ordering a BMC and really want to just know what craft offerings you have.

I've tried saying, "Hi! Do you have any craft beers available either on tap or in bottles?" but I get the entire litany, "Hello. We have Corona, Coors, Coors Light, Budweiser, Bud Light" etc. because many servers don't know what a craft beer is, but they sure know a beer snob beer, if only by reputation.

That's a good idea. I've got places around here that have huge beer lists.

Julohan said:

Right away he says I am a beer snob.

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I was a bit confused here, I thought he called you a beer snob...then I read the rest.
What beer snob has never heard of DFH?

Julohan said:

I am just thinking this guy thinks he is a beer snob but doesn't know much. So I told him to get the Dortmunder (a very tasty brew by the way), I chose it because it seemed like he hasn't tried much beer past a BMC. So this was the closest of the two. In the end he enjoyed very much.

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This actually doesn't surprise me... IME, most BMC drinkers consider someone a beer snob if they order the "expensive stuff", whatever it is... I've even had someone call me a beer snob for ordering Sam Adams before. So I would think the reverse might be true, that someone that is a "Reformed" BMC drinker considers themselves a beer snob because they order Sam Adams or Shiner Bock. I probably would have been that guy 8 years ago...

I use the term "beer geek" rather than snob. People here kinda' get it and skip the BMC list.

However, this doesn't mean that they won't serve a frozen glass and 32F Belgian Abbeys! I always ask for an unfrozen glass.

Yeah, a a lot of times when I go to a bar I ask for an unfrozen glass and usually get a funny look.

Maybe he is an old school beer snob. He gave up the Bud years ago to move up to the premium stuff.....Michelob

I mean I'm sure there are plenty of premium beer drinkers who don't care for the hop bite of an IPA, but I don't imagine there are too many who have never heard of the style.

I sell restaurant equipment and i have been tempted to call Perlick and the other companies and ask them WTF is up with a 10 degree glass chiller. I don't want ice beer, just a glass that maintains the temp the beer is poured. There is nothing worse than chiseling an iceberg off your glass.

On the OP tip, I am still trying to find the best way to avoid the waste of time a server spends on listing anything BMC on tap with out sounding like an *******.

I suppose my biggest problem is that I haven't really tried enough beers to know which ones I really like... I know, terrible, isn't it?

I always make sure I pass through the bar area (assuming there is one) and survey the tap selection before ordering. It's a little more effort, but you get the info you need.

annasdadhockey said:

I was a bit confused here, I thought he called you a beer snob...then I read the rest.
What beer snob has never heard of DFH?

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A lager aficionado? German beer enthusiast? Who knows? Unless you can name every decent sized regional brewery in the world, I don't think you can question someone's interest in beer based on them not knowing the ones you like.

Funny story. I like the idea of announcing myelf as a beer snob/geek. So many times, I've asked for the beer selection only to be told "bud, bud light, miller....". At that point, I usually ask if they have any craft beer, to which they reply, "Corona, Newcastle, Michelob, Stella...". I try to stop them and ask if they even have anthing like Sierra Nevada or Samuel Adams. "Oh, you want the fancy stuff...no we don't." I always feel sorry for making them go through that, because after they rattle off a huge selection of BMC and BMC Imports, I never order a beer, although I will tip a little extra just for the effort.

remilard said:

A lager aficionado? German beer enthusiast? Who knows? Unless you can name every decent sized regional brewery in the world, I don't think you can question someone's interest in beer based on them not knowing the ones you like.

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Good point.
Although he should still know what an IPA is.

greencoat said:

I always make sure I pass through the bar area (assuming there is one) and survey the tap selection before ordering. It's a little more effort, but you get the info you need.

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I also try to do this.

I gotta admit I've never heard of Dortmunder. But being a beer snob in the US and not knowing what an IPA is?? I'd expect a beer snob in the US to be aware of Dogfish Head. DFH is pretty influential brewery and is available in a lot of areas. Yeah, I suppose it's possible to not have heard of them, but it would still surprise me if they didn't. Maybe that's just because it's so widely available around here and thus I'm a bit biased...

bonzombiekitty said:

I gotta admit I've never heard of Dortmunder. But being a beer snob in the US and not knowing what an IPA is?? I'd expect a beer snob in the US to be aware of Dogfish Head. DFH is pretty influential brewery and is available in a lot of areas. Yeah, I suppose it's possible to not have heard of them, but it would still surprise me if they didn't. Maybe that's just because it's so widely available around here and thus I'm a bit biased...

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Yea, Dortmunder is a fairly obscure light lager style. There are a few breweries that make it here in the US, but Great Lakes (a fairly big brewery in Cleveland) is the only one that actually labels it "Dortmunder". I believe Bell's Lager is also a Dortmunder.

Great Lakes is good beer.

back on topic, I went to a restaurant the other day, and their menu listed this under "Beer":

"Miller Lite, Samuel Adams, Budweiser"

I glanced over and noticed a Sprecher tap, so they were at least shorting themselves there. Also the Sam Adams was their winter, which I wouldn't have expected by just reading "Samuel Adams". Then the waitress came by and said "Oh, we have a lot of stuff in bottles too...."

Why don't restaurants put their full beer list in the menu? I can understand if things change somewhat, but they could at least put the core bottling options in there. You'd think you'd want to push the expensive stuff.

r2eng said:

However, this doesn't mean that they won't serve a frozen glass and 32F Belgian Abbeys! I always ask for an unfrozen glass.

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I actually had a applebees refuse to give me an unfrosted glass. I even had to manager come over and he said its some "law" or something. I proceeded to take the next 10 minutes rolling the glass around in my hands to defrost it.

northernlad said:

On the OP tip, I am still trying to find the best way to avoid the waste of time a server spends on listing anything BMC on tap with out sounding like an *******.

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I usually just say "do you have anything out of the ordinary, anything you have never heard or or can't pronounce". It usually works ok. I had to come up with something because my wife was getting pissed when I would ask what they had then after the 2 minute long BMC list I would just order a water.

motobrewer said:

Great Lakes is good beer.

back on topic, I went to a restaurant the other day, and their menu listed this under "Beer":

"Miller Lite, Samuel Adams, Budweiser"

I glanced over and noticed a Sprecher tap, so they were at least shorting themselves there. Also the Sam Adams was their winter, which I wouldn't have expected by just reading "Samuel Adams". Then the waitress came by and said "Oh, we have a lot of stuff in bottles too...."

Why don't restaurants put their full beer list in the menu? I can understand if things change somewhat, but they could at least put the core bottling options in there. You'd think you'd want to push the expensive stuff.

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Was it a chain restaraunt? Because selection will usually vary between locations but all the menus are the same.

Edcculus said:

Yea, Dortmunder is a fairly obscure light lager style. There are a few breweries that make it here in the US...

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A little off topic, but maybe one downside to the American craft brew explosion over the last 15-20 years is that many formerly available imports have been pushed off the shelf. There used to be several German Dortmunder brews available around here, my favorite being Dortmunder Kronen Classic. Another was Dortmunder Union. I think DAB is still readily available around here, but that one to me just wasn't up to the others.

I've just started trying my hand at Lagers. I think a Dortmunder would be something nice to try.

Back on topic, I'd never go up to a bartender or tell a waitress that I was a "beer snob." I just take notice of the tap handles, even if I have to walk across the establishment to do so. I know that if I have to ask, I'm unlikely to get a satisfying response.

StunnedMonkey said:

Back on topic, I'd never go up to a bartender or tell a waitress that I was a "beer snob." I just take notice of the tap handles, even if I have to walk across the establishment to do so. I know that if I have to ask, I'm unlikely to get a satisfying response.

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Most of the time, especially if I see a lot of handles, I will get up from the table and find what I want so I don't have to trouble the server. I am sure my wife rolls her eyes as I am walking away. Or makes fun of me with the server while I am away.

You don't have to know every regional brewery to be a beer snob, although I would expect you would have heard of DFH as they are stretching boundaries. Not knowing styles automatically disqualifies you.

northernlad said:

Most of the time, especially if I see a lot of handles, I will get up from the table and find what I want so I don't have to trouble the server. I am sure my wife rolls her eyes as I am walking away. Or makes fun of me with the server while I am away.

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I guess I married well, since my wife is the one saying, "Why don't you march your lazy ass to the bar and find out if they have any decent IPA's?" If the best they have is Sam Adams or Newcastle, she orders wine. Or water. The woman won't abide substandard beer.

StunnedMonkey said:

I guess I married well, since my wife is the one saying, "Why don't you march your lazy ass to the bar and find out if they have any decent IPA's?" If the best they have is Sam Adams or Newcastle, she orders wine. Or water. The woman won't abide substandard beer.

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Don't tell my wife, but I think I may be in love (with your wife)

I also feel bad making them rattle off the list then ordering a Pepsi. But I can pretty muhc expect Sam Adam's is the best I have a chance at finding in my area so I don't get annoyed about it.
The walk to the bar is a good bet, ordering from the bar and watching them poor is the best bet. Nothing like ordering a SNPA or Sam's and knowing damn well it's half filled with bud light but not being able to prove it. Or at least suspecting it from a true pour just because they haven't cleaned their lines in 6 months. At least when you see them pour it from the right tap, and it tastes like crap you know you didn't get mediocre beer, just poor cleanliness. Doesn't sound like a big difference, but it changes it froma ****ty establishment to the bartender personally ripping you off.

In short, in my home town, if I'm at a restaurant, I expect to drink Sam's or the occasional castle. I drink the good stuff at home and have accepted that.

My thoughts on beer snobbery can be found in the blog mentioned in the OP. This guy matches the category that I would say fits 85% of self-proclaimed beer snobs. No clue about anything. The other 15% would have berated you about only having 2 good beers and that neither of them are imaginative examples of the style and he'll have a diet soda... yawn. I loath beer snobs.

IME, someone who knows beer will scan the taps themselves, ask a few directed questions, ask if anything interesting is in the bottle then make their decision. If you actually know enough to really be a beer snob, you should assume you know more than the server about your tastes and just be courteous to the server or bar keep. If you really need to tell people how awesome you are, you probably aren't that awesome.

Beer snob is a relative term. I'd say the guy was clueless. Around here, just drinking IPAs (much less what you ran into) doesn't qualify you. Sounds like he was at the "has a cork" wino level. But I admit to being spoiled, as long as you stay away from the family chains, servers know what craft beer is and menus always have beer lists. Even the dinky local restaurants all have craft beers.

IrregularPulse said:

The walk to the bar is a good bet, ordering from the bar and watching them poor is the best bet. Nothing like ordering a SNPA or Sam's and knowing damn well it's half filled with bud light but not being able to prove it. [...]

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I have never even heard of this! Is this common where you live?

I'm fortunate to live in northern Colorado, so I just ask for "local" beers. Granted, that includes Coors, but it shortens the list considerably.

johnnyc said:

I have never even heard of this! Is this common where you live?

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I've heard it mentioned several times on this board, and sometimes I "think" i taste it. It could just be dirty lines, but I could also associate the taste with the beer I ordered being mixed with a cheaper BMC.

If someone tried pulling that crap is WI, they would be a dead man walking. Don't mess with our beer.

Edcculus said:

Yea, Dortmunder is a fairly obscure light lager style. There are a few breweries that make it here in the US, but Great Lakes (a fairly big brewery in Cleveland) is the only one that actually labels it "Dortmunder". I believe Bell's Lager is also a Dortmunder.

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We've misappropriated the word. It really just means a beer from Dortmund, the vast majority of which are not in the Export style. The BJCP guide lists only two beers from Dortmund as "Dortmunder Export" and neither are available in the US (although people are confused and think that the lighter beers that are made by the same breweries and available here are Export beers).

Boerderij_Kabouter said:

If someone tried pulling that crap is WI, they would be a dead man walking. Don't mess with our beer.

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yeah, you'd get your a$$ kicked pretty freakin' hard if a bartender tried to do that here.

Turlian said:

I'm fortunate to live in northern Colorado, so I just ask for "local" beers. Granted, that includes Coors, but it shortens the list considerably.

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Would anyone tell you beers owned by coors? That could broaden the list a lot more.

Frequent brewpubs and microbreweries exclusively, then you won't have this problem.

motobrewer said:

yeah, you'd get your a$$ kicked pretty freakin' hard if a bartender tried to do that here.

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It also seems like a big fat waste of time. The amount of money 'saved' through this practice is probably going to be wasted in the labor of making the mix and loss of business.


I'd lay odds that the 'mix taste' is a combination of poorly maintained lines/tap head and low volume resulting in 'old' beer (probably with a dash of 'extra keg stored in a variable temp environment' effect).

I never considered myself a beer snob until I pinpointed both low levels of diacetyl and a hint of infection in a few sample beers poured at a local resturant. when i complained about the taste the manager came over to assure me that the beers tasted as they were intended to. After some polite discussion about the styles and some reccomendations on what to look for in the draft system he parted ways and refunded my beers.

Before dinner was done he came back to tell me he in fact found beer copious amounts of beer stone in several lines and had also talked to the brewer only to be advised that they, in fact, had been having some diacetyl reduction issues at the time.

The manager bought our dinner (Me, Wife, and Son) and now knows me by name.

If you actually know enough to really be a beer snob, you should assume you know more than the server about your tastes and just be courteous to the server or bar keep. If you really need to tell people how awesome you are, you probably aren't that awesome.

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This ^.

Also I like to ask if they have anything 'local'. Or asking directly what Micros are on tap is a good way of skipping the BMC usual suspects list.

Finally I think we have all thought of this particular customer in the wrong terms. We assigned him the snob catagory that we all fall into, that is open and willing to enjoy beer. Instead perhaps his snobbery is the type that only drinks one particular beer and thus his taste is very specific and snobbish. This would fit even if he only drinks BMC. I know someone who I certainly think of as beer snob because he refuses to drink anything other than Bud Lite, because 'it all tastes like grass'. That is a VERY closed and snobby opinion by my standards...

I don't expect to find much more than the standard Canadian big boys when I go out. If there is something that I haven't heard of or had in a while I'll give it a try. I'm not that much of a snob that I won't have a beer. I choose the best of the worst.