Graham's English Cider

maltoftheearth said:

* I am using EC1118 yeast. Should I pitch one full yeast packet if I am doing half the total of the OP's recipe? Will that extra yeast create any issues?

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As for your original question, the full pack won't hurt anything at all.

Not bad at all!
Just tasted the dregs on primary. Pretty good. Could be a touch more appley but I topped up with apple juice so maybe that'll help. I made it with whatever yeast came with my framboise brewferm kit. It fermented quick. I'm carbonating then ageing. I dont care if cloudy. This apple juice not filtered.

Set this up per recipe. This is my first cider and I'm wondering if you guys think it is actually going yet or not - its been in the carboy 24 hours + and isn't bubbling the way I was expecting. Photo:

That's about what mine looked like for the whole three months. Don't worry, it will turn out great!

Bottled mine yesterday, 1 month in primary, 1 month in secondary. Pretty damned good! I am going to start consuming as soon as my tapadrafts carb up and will start another 5 gallons asap.

thx for the recipe

Uhhh no ageing. Tastes fine to me.

Getting ready to make my next batch and this time I'm going to use malic acid and tannins from the brew store instead of teabags and a lime I just did a taste test/comparison of the juice with different concentrations and have settled on using 3/4oz per gallon. I haven't yet tested the tannins.

Great recipe. I just did a "regular" cinnamon stick/maple syrup cider, but this might be my next go!

Made a batch of this last night, woke up this morning to it bubbling nicely.

Thanks for the recipe. I started 5 gallons up. Actually followed the recipe! (well, I used Nottingham yeast rather than US05, as that is what I had). Have it in a swamp cooler trying to keep the temps in the mid to upper 60's.

Nottingham seems to be what everyone has lying around. I just mixed up my second batch of this using some Notty.

Last time I neglected to add yeast nutrient, aerate properly and I did not have the ability to control fermentation temp. This time I add the nutrient and aerated and I'm fermenting it cool. I brewed a Kolsch today that wants to be a 60F so that's what the cider is going to have to ferment at as well. It is still within Notty's range so it should work out. Maybe take longer but hopefully taste cleaner.

Mine started a little warmer. I have Kolsch in a picnic cooler with plenty of ice. It was steady in the low 60's, then I dropped it to 40 by adding more ice bottles and swapping them out daily.

I have the cider in a fermentation bucket and that is in a large plastic bucket filled with water. I kept swapping out ice bottles but it still wasn't much cooler than room temp. I thought about it, and it's really no different than having a huge glass of water and throwing some ice in. It's not going to stay cool for long. Swamp coolers are great in some places, but I think a room with no air flow and high Georgia humidity isn't the best place for one.

So - I wrapped the bucket up in foam (er, foam backpacking mats) and put some styrofoam on top (er, boogie boards). The cider and water surrounding the bucket are staying at a cool 60 degrees measured by a pool thermometer in the water, and the temp stays pretty steady for 12 hours. I let it go closer to 30 hours today, and only gained 5 degrees.

Swapping ice bottle out every 12 to 24 hours is going to get old real fast! But the Kolsch wrapped up 2 weeks fermenting and three weeks kinda lagering at 40. One week to go. Then the cider goes in the big picnic cooler.

(I'm starting to think a fridge will be on the shopping list soon!). Sorry to wander off the thread. Looking forward to trying the cider!

Just curious, i know that adding the juice is to fill headspace, has anyone had experience in adding a gallon of it at secondary? Will it all ferment out or residual sweetness come through since it so much?

Put my first attempt in secondary just last week. I've seen conflicting times required before the cider is drinkable. I understand the original recipe calls for months but I was hoping to get a consensus from those who bottled it earlier on how it was. Great or just tolerable for those who, like me, can't wait?

tapped my keg of this recipe that I started 22 MAR 2011, came out very nice, think it could have stood some more time, but is good. My wife who prefers sweet cider loves its clean taste and doesn't mind the dryness.

Moatengator said:

tapped my keg of this recipe that I started 22 MAR 2011, came out very nice, think it could have stood some more time, but is good. My wife who prefers sweet cider loves its clean taste and doesn't mind the dryness.

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Great thanks! Good to know she enjoyed it. My girlfriend also likes a sweeter cider, so hopefully we'll both be happy with it.

I thought it drinkable as early as 2/3 months but it definitely could stand to wait another month and is way better at 5/6 months.

bpm2000 said:

I thought it drinkable as early as 2/3 months but it definitely could stand to wait another month and is way better at 5/6 months.

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Yea I figured waiting would be best. But with football season finally approaching I am starting to get a little thirsty.

I finally moved mine to secondary this past weekend. Tasted a little bit. It needs more time, but mine is still very early in the process.

Took a sip of mine today and it tasted green. It left the feeling in your mouth like a strong tea would. Also a bit sour like a bit of the lime flavor was lingering along with the tea. Is this normal after a month of secondary??

Gave it a few weeks and it has cleared up perfectly and the flavor is amazing! Can't wait!

Question from a real noob with big artistic aspirations ... I'm looking to make the best stuff I can, and learn it well - not just make something to give me a cheap drunk. This recipe is the most interesting of the cider recipes I've seen thus far, and the discussion gives me some insight, but ...

I've spoken with the cider mill near where I live, and found that I can get fresh, unpasteurized cider from them if I will sign a waiver and promise to not drink it without making hard cider . With that in mind, some of the total noob questions I have are:

If I'm getting the cider from the mill, and not using a processed juice, does that change the need for the teabags?

When you say "Yeast nutrients as needed," how do I recognize when it is needed? or how much is needed?

Would you think that anything else would need to change if I use the cider from the mill instead of the juice?

This year is the first year I have brewed anything of my own, and I don't even know anyone else personally who can answer questions I have. I've just moved to Washington this year just in time to catch the ripening blackberries.My eye is on next catching that fantastic apple harvest up here. I want to get it right, and get it on time. I don't mind experimenting, I just want to know enough to know how to experiment.

I made this recipe with unpasturized fresh pressed orchard cider and don't recommend wasting your money on it. It comes out really bland and nothing tart. It was an expensive experiment. It is best with the cheap store bought apple juice. There may be other good hard cider recipes with fresh pressed but not with this one. Save your money and time.

I just started messing around with small batches of cider. Hopefully I can make something good by the holidays. I was worried that the only juice I could get had ascorbic acid, but after reading the threads, some acid seems like a good thing - yes?. I made one gal batch with an extra lb of corn sugar, SG 1.010, and used a champange yeast. From what I've read now I think that gal may be distilling grade. What is a target SG for a decent cider? And what kind of spice can I be considering?

Thanks Harkin. That's the kind of input I need.

Do you have one you like with the fresh pressed cider?

Answers in line:

SteveHoward said:

If I'm getting the cider from the mill, and not using a processed juice, does that change the need for the teabags?
Depends on the types of apples they use. If the apples have high tanning content in their skins, you can forgo the tea bags.

When you say "Yeast nutrients as needed," how do I recognize when it is needed? or how much is needed?
Generally a good idea to add it, how much depends on the batch size. You can get away without it, but the yeast may throw off some funky smells during the process (sulfur compounds and the like).

Would you think that anything else would need to change if I use the cider from the mill instead of the juice?
Again, this depends on the apples used. Traditional cider apples have a high malic acid level, which FreezeBlade substitutes the lime juice to achieve the desired tartness.

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Southernmost11 said:

I just started messing around with small batches of cider. Hopefully I can make something good by the holidays. I was worried that the only juice I could get had ascorbic acid, but after reading the threads, some acid seems like a good thing - yes?. I made one gal batch with an extra lb of corn sugar, SG 1.010, and used a champange yeast. From what I've read now I think that gal may be distilling grade. What is a target SG for a decent cider? And what kind of spice can I be considering?

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Ascorbic acid, aka Vitamin C, is often used a preservative, and at high levels can hamper yeast growth. You want to find juice without any preservatives. Limes (and all citrus) do contain ascorbic acid naturally, but the amount you're adding with the squeeze lime is negligible compared to the amount added as a preservative. The goal of adding the lime juice is to get the citric acid more so than the ascorbic. As for adding sugar, you're getting into apfelwein territory, which needs 6 months to a year to mature and be ready for drinking. The best target starting gravity of a cider is whatever the apple juice you bought it (around the mid-1.04 range).

A little more on the topic of acid: my last batch I did with wine tannins and malic acid, and am getting ready to keg it tomorrow. Malic acid is actually the acid found in cider apples. I bought a little bag of it and dose a small amount of apple juice until I hit a tartness of the juice I was happy with, and then scaled that up. As for the tannins... I think I just guessed there

SteveHoward said:

Thanks Harkin. That's the kind of input I need.

Do you have one you like with the fresh pressed cider?

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Sorry, I do not. I keep making this one over and over. It is a really really good recipe. I get the kosher apple juice at shop rite. It comes out perfect every time.

Thanks Gremlin. I'm going torun some more batches.

Thank you very much, Gremlyn, and Harkin.

I'm curious if someone can compare and contrast the taste of this with Edwort's Apfelwein: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f25/man-i-love-apfelwein-14860/ I'm sure someone has made both and can tell how they compare .

SteveHoward said:

I'm curious if someone can compare and contrast the taste of this with Edwort's Apfelwein: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f25/man-i-love-apfelwein-14860/ I'm sure someone has made both and can tell how they compare .

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The Edwort's Apfelwein is more white-wine-ish, and is much drier with a lighter apple flavour than this cider recipe. Just as an aside, I officially posted my cider recipe variation of this one right here. I have made both, and though I liked the apfelwein after about a year of aging, the cider is easier to drink more of on a regular basis.

I pitched a batch of this last night using 5 gal. of cider from the nearby farmer's market, Twining's English Breakfast Tea, and some bottled key lime juice. The yeast I'm using is some 3rd-generation washed Wy1098/WLP007. The only major tweak to the recipe was the addition of 8 oz. brown sugar.

Looking forward to trying it in a few months!

Pitched last night with juice from two small lemons, as well as 4 bags of orange / black pekoe tea and 5 tsps of yeast nutrient. S-04 yeast. Starting to bubble this morning, less than 12 hours later.

diablodawg said:

Pitched last night with juice from two small lemons, as well as 4 bags of orange / black pekoe tea and 5 tsps of yeast nutrient. S-04 yeast. Starting to bubble this morning, less than 12 hours later.

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This answers my question. I have only made 3 batches of beer, all from brewers best kits. They seem to start bubbling pretty soon. i came back on here to check how long it takes to start noticing fermentation. I guess its not an hour like i expected. So i know, does anyone have a round about time frame when i should notice? It has been 4 hours now.

Thanks for the recipe also

I made a 2.5 gallon batch of this around 2 1/2 months ago. I needed to free up my 3 gallon BB so I decided to keg it. I did not rack to secondary and it's crystal clear and very very good. I used Wyeast's cider yeast as well. I will def make another batch but in 5 gallons this time and wait it out for 5 or so months. Very good stuff.

I've tried other cider recipes in the last year and this one by far has been the hit of the party. I've tried different types of apple juice/cider and although I hate to say it, the best batches were made with Walmart brand apple juice. It's crystal clear from the get-go so overall appearance is great. I ferment with White Labs Cider Yeast. I back sweeten with frozen apple juice (4 to 5 cans) and keg. I kill the yeast too. I run low Co2 like 4 to 5 psi. just enough to push it thru the line.

I would put this up against any hard cider.

this year I did it using cider from the local press and Wyeast Cider yeast, it was a huge hit with everyone even my wife. It came out dry, but there is an apple taste and aroma, I will do this every year I can get to the press before they run out.

I racked a gallon on a pound of dried montmorency cherries almost a month ago. I was planning on leaving it in the carboy for 2-3 months total.

Can I leave the cider on the fruit until I'm ready to bottle? Or should I rack to another carboy to clear and age? If I rack, what should I do about headspace? There would not be a full gallon of cider due to the displacement of the cherries.

Thanks for any help.

lseabo00 said:

Can I leave the cider on the fruit until I'm ready to bottle? Or should I rack to another carboy to clear and age?

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I bottled a cider in February that sat in primary with raisins since September. I'm pleased with it. I can't, of course, answer what that would do to this thread's recipe.

You can do well with fresh unpasteurized juice/cider from mills, but you have to remember: They are making their blends for drinking, not fermenting, so the benefits are somewhat limited.

Near me, I can actually get a carboy filled up for less than the cost per gallon of buying generic stuff, so I usually go that root.

Another big benefit in my eyes is you can allow some spontaneous fermentation to occur (with or without the aid of brewing yeast)--this gives it a better, more funky flavor IMO.

SteveHoward said:

Question from a real noob with big artistic aspirations ... I'm looking to make the best stuff I can, and learn it well - not just make something to give me a cheap drunk. This recipe is the most interesting of the cider recipes I've seen thus far, and the discussion gives me some insight, but ...

I've spoken with the cider mill near where I live, and found that I can get fresh, unpasteurized cider from them if I will sign a waiver and promise to not drink it without making hard cider . With that in mind, some of the total noob questions I have are:

If I'm getting the cider from the mill, and not using a processed juice, does that change the need for the teabags?

When you say "Yeast nutrients as needed," how do I recognize when it is needed? or how much is needed?

Would you think that anything else would need to change if I use the cider from the mill instead of the juice?

This year is the first year I have brewed anything of my own, and I don't even know anyone else personally who can answer questions I have. I've just moved to Washington this year just in time to catch the ripening blackberries.My eye is on next catching that fantastic apple harvest up here. I want to get it right, and get it on time. I don't mind experimenting, I just want to know enough to know how to experiment.

Click to expand...