Negra Modelo Clone

My SWMBO likes Negra Modelo enough that she bought a 6 pack after trying one I was drinking at a Mexican restaurant.

Did some "searching" and there seems to be some disagreement as to weather it's an Austrian Pilsner (can't find a BJCP discription of this style) or a Munchen Dunkel.

I'd like to try to clone it for her but not sure where to start. There were a few recipies here online, but w/o a style base I'm not sure how accurate they were.

Any ideas?

Neither, I don't know where you read those, but it's considered a classic example of a vienna lager.

BJCP-03 Vienna Lager

Commercial Examples: Great Lakes Eliot Ness (unusual in its 6.2% strength and 35 IBUs), Boulevard Bobs 47 Munich-Style Lager, Negra Modelo, Old Dominion Aviator Amber Lager, Gordon Biersch Vienna Lager, Capital Wisconsin Amber, Olde Saratoga Lager, Penn Pilsner

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You can start by looking at My vienna lager recipe in my pulldown, and read the articles and listen to the podcast I cited.

Vienna is your base (European Amber lager)

Dammit Revvy, I'm seconds too slow.
Look for a Graf style Vienna Lager, named after (I believe) Santiago Graf, famed Mexican brewer.

Also;

This is a great info page on brewing mexican beers.

stonehands said:

dammit revvy, i'm seconds too slow.
Look for a graf style vienna lager, named after (i believe) santiago graf, famed mexican brewer.

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lol...

Thank you Revvy, knew someone like you would come up with one. Will check them out now.

Revvy said:

Neither, I don't know where you read those, but it's considered a classic example of a vienna lager.

BJCP-03 Vienna Lager



You can start by looking at My vienna lager recipe in my pulldown, and read the articles and listen to the podcast I cited.

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Thanks again, this is where I got the Munchen Dunkel:

http://beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/75/667

And from the Modelo web page :

http://www.gmodelo.mx/negra_modelo_en.jsp

Guess I mixed up Vienna and Austrian.

The Negra comes out much darker than yours looks in BeerSmith. Guess I have to add some darker malts for color.

The only Caramunich I can get here in the islands is Belgian. OK to use it or should I buy online?

Most reviews mention corn?

Also I can't lager, and will be doing an ale version, yes I know it won't be the same but one has to do what one can. What dry yeast would you suggest?

Thanks again.

This recipe is dead on.

8 lbs. Pilsner
1-1/2 lbs. Vienna
2 oz. chocolate
3/4 oz. Hallertau @90
3/4 oz. Tettnanger @90
1/2 oz. Tettnanger @10
(adjust bittering hops for 27 IBU)
Bavarian lager yeast

bja said:

This recipe is dead on.

8 lbs. Pilsner
1-1/2 lbs. Vienna
2 oz. chocolate
3/4 oz. Hallertau @90
3/4 oz. Tettnanger @90
1/2 oz. Tettnanger @10
(adjust bittering hops for 27 IBU)
Bavarian lager yeast

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Tks, Love your Disclaimer. LOL

By 2 oz of chocolate do you mean hersey cocoa

That almost certainly refers to chocolate malt.

Yes, chocolate malt.

bja said:

This recipe is dead on.

8 lbs. Pilsner
1-1/2 lbs. Vienna
2 oz. chocolate
3/4 oz. Hallertau @90
3/4 oz. Tettnanger @90
1/2 oz. Tettnanger @10
(adjust bittering hops for 27 IBU)
Bavarian lager yeast

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I just put 10 gals of this in my lagering fridge last weekend. Looks good. Should have an update in a couple weeks.

10g batch
Pilsen 15 lb
Vienna 3lb
chocolate 8oz

Tettnang 2.5oz 60 min
Hallertau 1.75oz 60 min
Tettnang 1.5oz 10 min

OG 1.054
FG 1.010
IBU 36 (higher than I wanted but tastes fine to me)

I'll do a side by side soon and again in a month or so to see how it ages.

Looks pretty close to the original.
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holy said:

Looks pretty close to the original.

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Which one is which? The one on the left seems a tad bit lighter.

As you may have guessed, the one on the left is the original.

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My increase in chocolate is noticeable in color and taste, but I like it. I'll definitely brew this again and I may play with the chocolate to see if I can reduce the flavor a bit but keep it slightly darker.

rob-1814 said:

By 2 oz of chocolate do you mean hersey cocoa

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This was a good laugh

holy said:

10g batch
Pilsen 15 lb
Vienna 3lb
chocolate 8oz

Tettnang 2.5oz 60 min
Hallertau 1.75oz 60 min
Tettnang 1.5oz 10 min

OG 1.054
FG 1.010
IBU 36 (higher than I wanted but tastes fine to me)

I'll do a side by side soon and again in a month or so to see how it ages.

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What was your mash temperature? 152 for 60 minutes?

Actually I only did a 45 minute mash at 152

C-Rider said:

Also I can't lager, and will be doing an ale version, yes I know it won't be the same but one has to do what one can. What dry yeast would you suggest?

Thanks again.

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Instead of using ale yeast, try Wyeast California lager. It ferments at ale temps but with lager characteristics. I brewed a Negro Clone a couple years back with a friend of mine and it turned out pretty good. Can't really remember the recipe, but I know we used California lager to ferment it.

What temps did you lager at? and for how long?

Schumed said:

What temps did you lager at? and for how long?

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We actually didn't lager it. It was in the primary for 10 days and then 3-4 weeks in secondary and then it was primed and bottled. Wasn't bad at all. Would probably be better lagered though. If you keg, just lager it for a while before you tap it.

In an effort the clone Negra Modelo, I ended up coming up with a maltier version based on 7lb Vienna, 2lb Munich, 12oz Aromatic, 6oz dark crystal, and about 2oz Carafa III Dehusked. This beer is fermented with Saflager 34/70 (2 packets) and is one of my best recipes, IMHO.

To make it a "real" clone though, I'd swap out some of the Vienna for Pilsner, kill the crystal entirely and maybe use a little dry rice extract too.

Schumed said:

What temps did you lager at? and for how long?

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I lagered mine for 20 days at 54F, then kegged and reduced the temp to 40 for force carbing. I've been drinking it since carbed. I'm continuing to lager one of the kegs to see how it ages.

ghpeel said:

To make it a "real" clone though, I'd swap out some of the Vienna for Pilsner, kill the crystal entirely and maybe use a little dry rice extract too.

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Why would that make it a "real" clone?

bja said:

Why would that make it a "real" clone?

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Maybe "real" wasn't the right word, but those substitutions would make the beer taste more like a 'real' Negra Modelo than my current recipe. Mine is a far bit too malty to be called a clone, but I really like it and don't intend to change it anytime soon.

ghpeel said:

Maybe "real" wasn't the right word, but those substitutions would make the beer taste more like a 'real' Negra Modelo than my current recipe.

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Possibly, but your recipe is nothing like the Negra Modelo recipe.

bja said:

Possibly, but your recipe is nothing like the Negra Modelo recipe.

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"THE" recipe? You've got a hand-written copy of "THE" Negra Modelo recipe in your hand, signed by the brewmaster? Why do you think your recipe is the only one that tastes like a real Negra Modelo?

ghpeel said:

"THE" recipe? You've got a hand-written copy of "THE" Negra Modelo recipe in your hand, signed by the brewmaster? Why do you think your recipe is the only one that tastes like a real Negra Modelo?

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It's directly from the "Clone Brews: Homebrew Recipes for 150 Commerical Beers" book, and it does taste just like the real thing.

Besides, you already said yours doesn't taste like Negra Modelo.

Those recipes are no more THE recipe than any other persons attempt at cloning a NM. Not knocking the book, I have it and have brewed quite a few of the recipes, but they are not necessarily all perfect clones. Have someone pour a triangle test for you of the NM and your homebrew. If you can't tell the difference between any of the samples you cloned it. If you can tell the two beers apart, it's not a perfect clone. Just an FYI.

barrooze said:

Have someone pour a triangle test for you of the NM and your homebrew. If you can't tell the difference between any of the samples you cloned it. Of you can tell the two beers apart, it's not a perfect clone. Just an FYI.

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I have brewed this many times and compared it to the real thing. I couldn't tell them apart.

bja said:

This recipe is dead on.

8 lbs. Pilsner
1-1/2 lbs. Vienna
2 oz. chocolate
3/4 oz. Hallertau @90
3/4 oz. Tettnanger @90
1/2 oz. Tettnanger @10
(adjust bittering hops for 27 IBU)
Bavarian lager yeast

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Bottled this last night and from the sample, spot on! Thanks for that.

Comos said:

Bottled this last night and from the sample, spot on! Thanks for that.

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Got a pic? When I punch in the numbers that is too light...more like modelo special

I also love Negra Modelo and want to make a decent clone and will try this recipe when my American amber is done, but I do see one hanging question. What is Negra Modelo? According to Modelo Corp it is a Munich Dunkel style, however, as Revvy has pointed out BJCP considers it a Vienna Style. I always thought the best known commercial example of a Vienna Style is Dos Equis Amber, which looks and tastes different from Negra Modelo.

I wonder what OG that recipe is supposed to have. My efficiency can be 80-85%. I feel like my GU/BU ratio could be all screwed up.

Here are the numbers listed in Clone Brews:

OG: 1.050 - 1.051
IBU: 27 (I think rager, but I'm not certain)
SRM: 21
ABV: 4.9%

And either I copied the recipe into Beersmith wrong or they updated the recipe in the 2010 edition of Clone Brews: Recipes for 200 Commercial Beers, because the grain bill I have is different than the one posted by bja:

7.75 lbs pilsner
1.50 lbs vienna
6.0 oz crystal 60L
4.0 oz caravienna
2.0 oz chocolate malt

The hop schedule is the same except I have the two 90 min additions listed as 60 min additions, though the boil is still 90 min. And Beersmith gives me the numbers I posted above at 70% efficiency, except my SRM is 11.8.

jwalker1140 said:

And either I copied the recipe into Beersmith wrong or they updated the recipe in the 2010 edition of Clone Brews: Recipes for 200 Commercial Beers, because the grain bill I have is different than the one posted by bja:

7.75 lbs pilsner
1.50 lbs vienna
6.0 oz crystal 60L
4.0 oz caravienna
2.0 oz chocolate malt

The hop schedule is the same except I have the two 90 min additions listed as 60 min additions, though the boil is still 90 min. And Beersmith gives me the numbers I posted above at 70% efficiency, except my SRM is 11.8.

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Has anyone brewed this version? I'm FINALLY going to be doing my first batch of the year coming up pretty soon and I've been dying to clone NM.

10 oz. of crystal malts seems off for Negra Modelo, to me. Also, it's probably a good idea to swap out WLP940 for this recipe since it's Grupo Modelo's strain.