Tell me why my sour plan is bad

I'm a rather new brewer. Three clean extract batches brewed. But I absolutely love sour beers, as does the guy I brew with. So we want to brew some, naturally. And because they take a long time, we want to get started ASAP. So here's what we came up with:

Brew up a 5gal extract batch loosely based on Northern Brewer's "Dawson's Kriek" kit. 3lb Wheat DME, 3lb Pilsen DME, 1oz Hersbruckers. We'll pitch WYeast Rosalaer right into the primary with some dregs.

A couple weeks later, We'll brew up the Northern Brewer Nut Brown kit. We'll rack the first batch into secondary and throw the new batch right onto its old yeast cake (and probably add more dregs). The idea is that the higher proportion of bacteria in the cake will make this one more intensely sour.

After a while, we'll rack the wheat batch onto some fruit. The nut brown will stay as a straight sour, nothing added besides perhaps some wine-soaked oak cubes in the secondary.

And then we'll wait.

So what did we overlook and what are we doing wrong? (It's going to be extract, we're not remotely close to being ready for all grain. Just to nip that in the bud.) Thanks in advance!

I'm no expert, but that all seems sound. The dregs along with the Roselare are important, especially if you want it really sour; I've heard other say the Roselare by itself does not produce an intensely sour beer.

What are you brewing/aging in? Plastic buckets let in oxygen which can allow for acetic acid production, a good or bad thing depending on what you're going for.

Also, all-grain isn't hard, you're probably more ready for it than you think

Well.... It will probably kinda work.... ummm sour and extract usually don't work the greatest, or so I've heard

Extract will work fine. Sounds OK. The best way to learn is to go for it.

Yeah, I don't see how extract would be that different from all-grain for a sour. It's all malt.

I don't have personal experience with sours and extract. As Jamil mentions in BCS, Steve Piatz has won national award using extract for lambics. So I don't think there's automatically anything wrong with it.

Do it! and be patient.

mccann51 said:

I'm no expert, but that all seems sound. The dregs along with the Roselare are important, especially if you want it really sour; I've heard other say the Roselare by itself does not produce an intensely sour beer.

What are you brewing/aging in? Plastic buckets let in oxygen which can allow for acetic acid production, a good or bad thing depending on what you're going for.

Also, all-grain isn't hard, you're probably more ready for it than you think

Click to expand...

We'll be using Better Bottles. From what I've read here (and on their site), they don't let much oxygen in.

As for all-grain, we have a few other investments we need to make first. Like a wort chiller.

lewismd said:

A couple weeks later, We'll brew up the Northern Brewer Nut Brown kit. We'll rack the first batch into secondary and throw the new batch right onto its old yeast cake (and probably add more dregs). The idea is that the higher proportion of bacteria in the cake will make this one more intensely sour.

Click to expand...

it'll work, but i dont think its going to work as well as you're hoping. aside from the extra bacteria from more dregs, in a few weeks time you're mostly just going to be increasing the population of the sacchro strains in the roselare.

dcp27 said:

it'll work, but i dont think its going to work as well as you're hoping. aside from the extra bacteria from more dregs, in a few weeks time you're mostly just going to be increasing the population of the sacchro strains in the roselare.

Click to expand...

Well in that case, we're at least saving the extra six bucks for another smack pack of roeselare.

Might be an idea to add some weat flour in the boil
Read somwhere that lambic need some unconverted starch to help the process along

janivar123 said:

Might be an idea to add some weat flour in the boil
Read somwhere that lambic need some unconverted starch to help the process along

Click to expand...

I kind of had in mind to wait and see where things are at and if the gravity is quite low and it's still not as sour/funky as I'd like after however long, I'll add some flour or maltodextrin.