First all-grain brew question

I posted this in the Beginner forum and got absolutely no love, can someone here help me out with this?

I just finished brewing an IPA (as my first all-grain brew!) via the BIAB method; nailed my OG thanks to 80.7% mash efficiency. However, I forgot to take boiloff into account and ended up with 4 gallons instead of 5 into the fermenter.

As a result, my OG of 1.066 took a hit to an OG of ~1.052 after adding 1 gallon of top-up water to the fermenter.

I'm thinking of boiling up a solution of 1/2 gallon water to 1.5 pounds table sugar and adding it into the fermenter after primary fermentation is done to take it back up to around 1.066. I was hoping to hit my ~7% ABV target on this, but as it stands, BeerSmith is predicting 5.6% after my absent-minded boiloff oopsie and water top-up.

My question being, how much of a thinning effect (or anything else unpleasant) will this amount of added sugar post-primary fermentation have on my beer? Could the original recipe stand up to this sort of addition with little ill effect? In the recipe below, it would equate to 11.1% of the grain bill, knock the 2-row down to 81.5% and the 40L to 7.4%

If it helps, I mashed at ~153F for an hour. The temperature dropped a bit (to around 148ish) and stayed at that temp for about 15 minutes, and I added hot water to bring the temp back up, and repeated this 2 more times. So during the mash, it was probably at 148-150 for a total of 20 minutes, but around 152-153 the remainder of the time.

Original recipe:

11 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 91.7 %
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 8.3 %
1.00 oz Centennial Hops [9.70 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop
1.00 oz Centennial Hops [9.70 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop
2.00 oz Centennial Hops [9.70 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop
1.0 pkg Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05) [50.28 ml] Yeast
1.00 oz Centennial Type Hops [9.70 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days


And here's a screencap from BeerSmith:

I'm new too, so take this advice with a grain of salt, but I would not add the water/sugar. It will make the brew drier, with higher alcohol, but will also dilute the flavors. I'd add DME/water if anything.
It sounds like your final efficiency was less than calculated (measured at SG instead of OG).
How was your grain crush?
Did you squeeze like a mad man?

Congratulations on your first All-Grain brew! Why not boil up some DME rather than sugar or just leave it as is? There is nothing wrong with a 5.6% beer.

I've used sugar in Saison's to create a light and dry ale, but 1.5 lbs seems like a lot to me. According to Papazian's Joy of Homebrewing, if you have 20+% of your fermentables as simple sugars can leave a “cidery” flavor in the beer. At 11% your probably OK other than creating a light and dry IPA.

spittingglass said:

nailed my OG thanks to 80.7% mash efficiency.

Click to expand...

After reading this comment I couldn't help but think something was off. When I plugged this into Beersmith and with four gallons, that grain bill, and that OG I come up with a 61% efficiency.


Rev.

Gratz on the AG batch! Personally, I would leave it alone. Good excuse to brew another batch and a great lesson about your equipment. I would make a bet that your beer turns out pretty good. If its not what you wanted it to be, you know why. If you make a rescue attempt and it still isn't what you wanted, the problem could be the rescue attempt and you are kind of back to square one.

1 lb of DME will raise it 1.008 points

(1/5) * 38=7.6 or 1.008

Rev2010 said:

After reading this comment I couldn't help but think something was off. When I plugged this into Beersmith and with four gallons, that grain bill, and that OG I come up with a 61% efficiency.


Rev.

Click to expand...

I'm pulling that number from BeerSmith via the pre-boil gravity that I measured:



I adjusted for temperature when doing all hydrometer readings, so I don't know what's off.

I think the consensus is to leave it alone, so I think I'm just going to do that. Renamed it to Math is Hard IPA.

If your pre-boil gravity was 1.070, then your post boil gravity was about 1.086. Diluting that by 1 gallon of water gives an approximate OG of 1.066.

Thus, your likely problem is that you didn't adequately stir the wort after adding the top-off water before taking the gravity reading. Wort can be fickle with dilution since it doesn't readily mix well just by pouring water into it, so I think you're actually right on and are good to go.

EDIT: Assume you missed your OG by up to 2 points. So, just go with 1.063 or 1.064 and you'll get your true efficiency within a couple percentage points.

kylevester said:

If your pre-boil gravity was 1.070, then your post boil gravity was about 1.086. Diluting that by 1 gallon of water gives an approximate OG of 1.066.

Click to expand...

OK, I'm still not getting this. He doesn't mention his preboil gravity and says at 4 gallons it was 1.066 but after topping off with another gallon of water it was 1.052. If I put this 4 gallon OG and grain bill into Beersmith with an 80.7% efficiency it says the OG should be 1.088. Since he got 1.066 Beersmith indicates that's a 61% efficiency. I did an English Ale yesterday with an 8.87lb grain bill with 81% efficiency. I got 1.054 at 5 gallons. If he got 1.052 OG with 5 gallons, or 1.066 at 4 gallons, how is that an 80.7% efficiency with 12lbs of grain?

Rev2010 said:

OK, I'm still not getting this. He doesn't mention his preboil gravity and says at 4 gallons it was 1.066 but after topping off with another gallon of water it was 1.052. If I put this 4 gallon OG and grain bill into Beersmith with an 80.7% efficiency it says the OG should be 1.088. Since he got 1.066 Beersmith indicates that's a 61% efficiency. I did an English Ale yesterday with an 8.87lb grain bill with 81% efficiency. I got 1.054 at 5 gallons. If he got 1.052 OG with 5 gallons, or 1.066 at 4 gallons, how is that an 80.7% efficiency with 12lbs of grain?

Click to expand...

I had to have misread an OG reading at some point for it to come out at 1.70 preboil, 1.066 post and 1.052 after top-up. I guess it will remain as a mystery ABV beer no matter what course of action I take due to that.

I really appreciate your effort in trying to unravel this ball of twine I've made with this brew, but I think I'm just going to take this as a lesson in being more diligent with my calculations and get a bigger pot so I can still do 5 gallon BIAB.

Sugar will thin the beer out, which people tend to find particularly offensive in an IPA where a lot of malt and mouthfeel are expected behind the hops. I'd say either leave it or add DME if you can't handle a 5.6 ABV.

As for the efficiency numbers, something smells fishy. 2-row and crystal 40 are both 34 PPPG and you have 12 lbs of grain. That's 12 x 34 = 408 points total (100% efficiency) After your boil, you had 4 gallons of 1.066 wort. That's 66 * 4 = 264 points. 264 / 408 = .647 = 64.7% brewhouse efficiency. If you actually had 80.7% mash efficiency, then you must have left a ton of wort in the kettle. Otherwise some of the numbers are wrong.

Don't feel bad I had trouble getting good measurements when I started AG. Part of the problem was I was more concerned with getting good efficiency than getting good measurements If you're taking SG readings with a hydrometer, don't rely on temperature correction if you're more than 10 degrees warmer than the baseline. The error gets worse as the temperature difference increases, making your calculated numbers worthless. Also make sure your water measurements are correct. When I started, I was just guessing by eyeballing a 5 gallon bucket to 1/2, 3/5 or 4/5 full. When I started using a calibrated bucket, things started coming into focus. You're headed in the right direction and your beer will be delicious no doubt. Welcome to the world of all-grain brewing!

Rev2010 said:

OK, I'm still not getting this. He doesn't mention his preboil gravity and says at 4 gallons it was 1.066 but after topping off with another gallon of water it was 1.052. If I put this 4 gallon OG and grain bill into Beersmith with an 80.7% efficiency it says the OG should be 1.088. Since he got 1.066 Beersmith indicates that's a 61% efficiency. I did an English Ale yesterday with an 8.87lb grain bill with 81% efficiency. I got 1.054 at 5 gallons. If he got 1.052 OG with 5 gallons, or 1.066 at 4 gallons, how is that an 80.7% efficiency with 12lbs of grain?

Click to expand...

I was going by the screen cap where he has measured boil gravity as 1.070.

His OP said the target OG was 1.066 but ended up being 1.052.

Again, if the numbers in the screen cap are correct, then my calcs are fine and the problem is not stirring well after adding the top up water. This is a VERY common problem with seemingly low gravities. Nearly every thread this comes up. Cheers!

Geez, I scrolled up on my phone and it "liked" the last post. No offense meant, but I still can't see how his numbers equate to his quoted efficiency.


Rev.

Rev2010 said:

Geez, I scrolled up on my phone and it "liked" the last post. No offense meant, but I still can't see how his numbers equate to his quoted efficiency.


Rev.

Click to expand...

Yeah, either he got an inaccurate sg reading, or took the reading before adding water.

Even at 1.052 OG, It's not that bad... the recipe's range is 1.056-1.074

I wouldn't do anything... ferment that *****.

acidrain said:

Yeah, either he got an inaccurate sg reading, or took the reading before adding water.

Even at 1.052 OG, It's not that bad... the recipe's range is 1.056-1.074

I wouldn't do anything... ferment that *****.

Click to expand...

That ***** be fermenting.

kylevester said:

I was going by the screen cap where he has measured boil gravity as 1.070.

His OP said the target OG was 1.066 but ended up being 1.052.

Click to expand...

He didn't say his target was 1.066. This is what the OP said:

As a result, my OG of 1.066 took a hit to an OG of ~1.052 after adding 1 gallon of top-up water to the fermenter.

Click to expand...

I take that to mean that his SG was 1.052 AFTER adding 1 gallon of top-up water. Therefore, a volume of 5 gallons. Working backward from there:

(1.0)52 * 5 gallons = 260 points
260 points / 4 gallons = (1.0)65

So he would have had an SG of 1.065 (or 1.066 depending on measurement accuracy.) in the 4 gallons of post-boil wort. What we really need to know is what the actual post-boil SG was *before* the top-up water was added. It is possible that measurement wasn't taken.

kylevester said:

Again, if the numbers in the screen cap are correct, then my calcs are fine and the problem is not stirring well after adding the top up water. This is a VERY common problem with seemingly low gravities. Nearly every thread this comes up. Cheers!

Click to expand...

I agree with what you're saying that poor mixing of the top-up water with the wort resulting in a lower than actual SG. I'm also saying that the numbers (either in the screen cap or posted in the OP) are *not* correct. There's no way you should be going from a 1.070 pre-boil SG to a 1.066 post-boil SG with a smaller volume. Part of the point of the boiling process is to concentrate the wort by removing water, but keeping the gravity points.

imrook said:

He didn't say his target was 1.066. This is what the OP said:


I take that to mean that his SG was 1.052 AFTER adding 1 gallon of top-up water. Therefore, a volume of 5 gallons. Working backward from there:

(1.0)52 * 5 gallons = 260 points
260 points / 4 gallons = (1.0)65

So he would have had an SG of 1.065 (or 1.066 depending on measurement accuracy.) in the 4 gallons of post-boil wort. What we really need to know is what the actual post-boil SG was *before* the top-up water was added. It is possible that measurement wasn't taken.



I agree with what you're saying that poor mixing of the top-up water with the wort resulting in a lower than actual SG. I'm also saying that the numbers (either in the screen cap or posted in the OP) are *not* correct. There's no way you should be going from a 1.070 pre-boil SG to a 1.066 post-boil SG with a smaller volume. Part of the point of the boiling process is to concentrate the wort by removing water, but keeping the gravity points.

Click to expand...

Fair enough, I interpreted it as his target.

And exactly on the second part. If his pre-boil was 1.070 as in his screen cap, then it's a mixing problem. If the 1.066 was indeed for 4 gallons, then he got much lower efficiency and entered numbers into BeerSmith wrong.

And we can all agree to just leave it and have a little hoppier and not quite as strong alcohol beer. Should still be good.

Indeed. It's going to be a great beer regardless. RDWHAHB

kylevester said:

Fair enough, I interpreted it as his target.

And exactly on the second part. If his pre-boil was 1.070 as in his screen cap, then it's a mixing problem. If the 1.066 was indeed for 4 gallons, then he got much lower efficiency and entered numbers into BeerSmith wrong.

And we can all agree to just leave it and have a little hoppier and not quite as strong alcohol beer. Should still be good.

Click to expand...

Yes, I'm just going to leave it alone and let it be the best beer it can be under the circumstances. Math is Hard IPA will be bottled unmolested.