Bourbon style Ice Beer at 30-40% ABV

Revision: When done reading this, go to post #107 for an update. A link is posted at the bottom of this post.

Iced Beer is not a new style, but it is to me. I've just dived into this idea of freezing out the water and concentrating the alcohol and beer. Why not take this and have some fun with it? Like, make a concentrated beer that tastes like a Barrel Aged Bourbon, right? Can I do this? The answer is yes, yes I can.

Iced Beer means that the beer has undergone some degree of fractional freezing somewhat similar to the German Eis bock. Fractional freezing is used in a process to separate substances with different melting points such as water and alcohol's melting points.

First and foremost, there's always someone that calls this illegal distillation. This method is concentration through fractional freezing. Distillation methods that are illegal requires fire, alcohol must be converted to a gas to separate it from the "beer," then converted back to a liquid to form a pure alcohol. The question has already been run by ATF (Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms) and TTB, which said that freeze concentration is not distillation and that there are no laws against it. Their only concern is commercial breweries labeling and taxes.

My first attempt to ice a beer was on a Wee Heavy at 10% ABV aged on wood. In addition, it was too simple of a recipe to win any competitions, which by the way didn't win a darn thing. However, the simple recipe is perfect for an Ice Beer. You don't want a bunch of adjuncts or caramel malts to concentrate in the Ice Beer.

When I first made the beer, I let it sit on wood a couple weeks. I took a gallon of the Wee Heavy and froze it solid. I turned the frozen beer upside down and within about 60-90 minutes I had a quarter gallon of what I believe to be 40% ABV (The ABV is directly related to the volume of liquids. If you know the ABV prior to fractional freezing, it's only a matter of math. If you reduce the volume by 75% with 25% remaining, divide the original ABV by the remaining percentage of the original volume, or 10%ABV/25% of original volume).

My friends and I took our first sip of my Ice Beer and...Holy cow it tasted awesome! It was like sipping on a nice Bourbon, seriously. My friends and I immediately contemplated how we could make more. A lot more...

Here is my original recipe. It is full of character, dry and slightly roasty after icing the final beer. I would let it sit for 30 days, or Ice it right away and let it sit a minimum of 30 days. However, it's best at 6-12 months. Young beer at a high ABV doesn't taste good. It needs to sit a while before drinking it.

Ferment at 55F to keep the hot liquor flavors to a minimum. If you ferment too high of a temperature, you'll get "hot liquor" flavors (nail polish remover).

Good Luck, and feel free to post your results, or opinions etc.,

09-E Scottish and Irish Ale, Strong Scotch Ale (Wee Heavy)
Min OG: 1.070 Max OG: 1.130
Min IBU: 17 Max IBU: 35
Min Clr: 14 Max Clr: 25 Color in SRM, Lovibond

Recipe Specifics
----------------
Batch Size (Gal): 6.00 Wort Size (Gal): 6.00
Total Grain (Lbs): 17.60
Anticipated OG: 1.091 Plato: 21.78
Anticipated SRM: 18.7
Anticipated IBU: 25.7
Brewhouse Efficiency: 82 %
Wort Boil Time: 180 Minutes

Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate: 15.00 Percent Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size: 10.91 Gal
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.050 SG 12.40 Plato

Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
96.6 17.00 lbs. Pale Malt (Maris Otter) UK 1.038 4
3.4 0.60 lbs. Roasted Barley USA 1.033 300

Hops
Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
1.75 oz. Fuggle Whole 4.75 25.7 60 min.

Yeast
-----
WYeast 1728 Scotish Ale


Water Profile
-------------
Profile: Reverse Osmosis
pH: 5.2

Near the end of mashing, pour off about 1 gallon of the wort and boil it alone until it caramelizes to almost a syrup. This will give the Wee Heavy its characteristics.

Mash-out Rest Temp : 158 Time: 60
Sparge Temp : 170 Time: 30

update on my experiments: SELECT HERE


.

I will be trying this soon thanks

Freeze distillation in the US is illegal, point blank. Ice beer however is not. The difference is how much water is removed. I doubt you will get busted as long as you ain't bragging about it. That said, I don't see most people freezing their beer or cider to make it stronger are testing and measuring to stay on the legal side.

If you want more info than just hearsay and wiki info look at atf ruling 94-3. That gives you the info on how much can be removed and stay legal.

ATF Ruling 94-3 applies to professional breweries. I would still tend to doubt the legality of it at home.

That said, I don't think you could actually fractionally freeze up to 40% ABV at home, I would imagine you need better equipment to do something like that, even assuming it was legal. Did you actually find a method for measuring the alcohol content?

neo71665 said:

Freeze distillation in the US is illegal, point blank. Ice beer however is not. The difference is how much water is removed. I doubt you will get busted as long as you ain't bragging about it. That said, I don't see most people freezing their beer or cider to make it stronger are testing and measuring to stay on the legal side.

If you want more info than just hearsay and wiki info look at atf ruling 94-3. That gives you the info on how much can be removed and stay legal.

Click to expand...

I may, or may not have, made some apple jack with this method...

However, the evidence, if there was any, is long gone...

I, may have, fought the law.. and I, might have, Won!

But I never thought of doing it with beer... Not sure how I feel about a 35% abv beer.

Worst hangovers ever....

neo71665 said:

Freeze distillation in the US is illegal, point blank. Ice beer however is not. The difference is how much water is removed. I doubt you will get busted as long as you ain't bragging about it. That said, I don't see most people freezing their beer or cider to make it stronger are testing and measuring to stay on the legal side.

If you want more info than just hearsay and wiki info look at atf ruling 94-3. That gives you the info on how much can be removed and stay legal.

Click to expand...

Show me the link to the ruling and I'll read it.

Cheers

neo71665 said:

Freeze distillation in the US is illegal, point blank. Ice beer however is not. The difference is how much water is removed. I doubt you will get busted as long as you ain't bragging about it. That said, I don't see most people freezing their beer or cider to make it stronger are testing and measuring to stay on the legal side.

If you want more info than just hearsay and wiki info look at ATF ruling 94-3. That gives you the info on how much can be removed and stay legal.

Click to expand...

First and foremost, the term freeze distillation, only exists within the brewing community, not the dictionary or within the regulatory entities of the US Government. Therefore, is not illegal. The term does not exist outside of the brewing community. Distillation is the practice of heating beer, changing a liquid to a gas to remove alcohol from the beer, and changing it back to a liquid, or pure alcohol. It has nothing to do with ice.

I read Ruling 94-3 on the ATF and TTB sites, and determined that your argument that the ATF ruling 94-3 is an argument to say that the production of Ice Beer is illegal (by using the term Freeze Distillation), or limits the amount of alcohol concentration is preposterous. It in fact, authorizes the practice of beer concentration, and when applied to home brewing, I would believe that it is authorized.

Section 25.261 authorizes the production of concentrate from beer, and the reconstitution of beer from concentrate, at the brewery.

27 CFR 25.11 defines concentrate as "Concentrate produced from beer by the removal of water under the provisions of Subpart R of this part." This section further states that the processes of concentration and reconstitution of beer are authorized processes in the production of beer.

When ATF authorized the production of Ice Beer through concentration, with tax and label restrictions, the major Breweries took off and made Ice Beer, including Bud Ice.

A fact in point is multiple breweries throughout the United States produce an Ice Beer. In Fact, Redhook's Ice Bock 28 was officially approved and supported by regulators.

In conclusion, Ruling 94-2 was published to address beer concentration and reconstitution by commercial Breweries and address Ice Beer in light of Ruling 94-3. The ATF and TTB have allowed Ice Beers within their restrictions of taxes and labeling. And, using the term Freeze Distillation is outright incorrect in terms of use.

I have a small sample of a cider freezing right now actually to try this out.

My wife is enamored with the idea, and is pushing to start doing this more often with more beer styles.

I'm very interested to see how it comes out.

chri5 said:

I have a small sample of a cider freezing right now actually to try this out.

My wife is enamored with the idea, and is pushing to start doing this more often with more beer styles.

I'm very interested to see how it comes out.

Click to expand...

Man... Now I have to turn you into the Feds.

But for real, not sure how small of a sample it is, but you might need more... To give you an idea. When I might have done this, I may have used a wine bottle worth of cider. That wine bottle possibly reduced to a bit less than a cup of apple jack. And it could have gone down more if the freezer was cold enough... Of course assuming I actually did this.

You can actually control the amount of alcohol based off the freezing temp.

insanim8er said:

Man... Now I have to turn you into the Feds.

But for real, not sure how small of a sample it is, but you might need more... To give you an idea.

Click to expand...

It is not illegal.

I was going to do a growler to start but the hydrometer sample was not as good as I had hoped. I simply used that for sampling the concentrated version. I'm only really hoping to get a couple of ounces for testing.

chri5 said:

I have a small sample of a cider freezing right now actually to try this out.

My wife is enamored with the idea, and is pushing to start doing this more often with more beer styles.

I'm very interested to see how it comes out.

Click to expand...

I have just started a cider to freeze. Some on this site call it Apple Jack, I think it's a great idea.

I plan on freezing 1 gallon of every beer I make to sample it.

If anyone here makes a starter for your beers, instead of throwing it out, freeze it and throw it in a bottle to combine with all your future starters. You should get a couple ounces per gallon. However, combined over time should get you a couple bottles.

insanim8er said:

Man... Now I have to turn you into the Feds.

But for real, not sure how small of a sample it is, but you might need more... To give you an idea. When I might have done this, I may have used a wine bottle worth of cider. That wine bottle possibly reduced to a bit less than a cup of apple jack. And it could have gone down more if the freezer was cold enough... Of course assuming I actually did this.

You can actually control the amount of alcohol based off the freezing temp.

Click to expand...

A whole cup from a bottle is too much. If you have a 10%ABV beer/wine in a 750 ML bottle, you should get 75 ML of alcohol plus residual liquids, which is probaby 1 to 2 ounces. That is if you were to actually try this, wink.

And yes, it does take alot of beer/wine. You should get 1/8 to 1/4 gallon from one gallon of beer/wine.

dlester said:

I have just started a cider to freeze. Some on this site call it Apple Jack,

Click to expand...

I would be one of those people.
The "jacking" = freeze concentration.
If you jacked a strawberry wine you'd get "strawberry jack"
Do it apple wine you get "apple jack"
ect,ect

dlester, I liked your post for being informative and quite jacked up.
To the others, with a freezer control that can be set to a exact degree, the amount and proof of hardened cider within reason can be done. A gallon of average cider hits around 10% or so, and when it is frozen approximately 12 ounces of pure alcohol are in it, but you won't get it all the first time in a standard freezer I drain my cider until the ice is almost white and the concentrate now being collected is approx. 50 proof. Remelt the ice portion, then re freeze it to collect the cider that is left. As far as the first running's go, refreezing will raise the concentration, and significantly reduce the volume. My suggestion,make a sweet cider, ferment it a couple of weeks, throw it in the freezer, and have some really nice schnapps sort of beverage.
This information is not provided to interest anyone in breaking the law as the whole story is speculation and untested theory.

MindenMan said:

dlester, I liked your post for being informative and quite jacked up.
To the others, with a freezer control that can be set to a exact degree, the amount and proof of hardened cider within reason can be done. A gallon of average cider hits around 10% or so, and when it is frozen approximately 12 ounces of pure alcohol are in it, but you won't get it all the first time in a standard freezer I drain my cider until the ice is almost white and the concentrate now being collected is approx. 50 proof. Remelt the ice portion, then re freeze it to collect the cider that is left. As far as the first running's go, refreezing will raise the concentration, and significantly reduce the volume. My suggestion,make a sweet cider, ferment it a couple of weeks, throw it in the freezer, and have some really nice schnapps sort of beverage.
This information is not provided to interest anyone in breaking the law as the whole story is speculation and untested theory.

Click to expand...

Thanks, good info. I'll have to try multiple freezing to see how it tastes.

dlester said:

I have just started a cider to freeze. Some on this site call it Apple Jack, I think it's a great idea.

I plan on freezing 1 gallon of every beer I make to sample it.

Click to expand...

My wife wants me to do exactly that! She saw the basic brewing video where they freeze concentrated a barleywine, and that has her hooked. lol.

I honestly only want to get it up to 24-25% ABV. I'm looking for something in the strength of a well watered scotch or whiskey.

To get 40% alcohol/80 proof you will need to freeze the beer down to approximately -30°C (-22° fahrenheit), lower than most home freezers get to.

http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2013-01/beersci-how-make-strong-beer-stronger

pdxal said:

To get 40% alcohol/80 proof you will need to freeze the beer down to approximately -30°C (-22° fahrenheit), lower than most home freezers get to.

http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2013-01/beersci-how-make-strong-beer-stronger

Click to expand...

thanks for the article. I'm not sure where he gets a data, but I am sure that volume has something to do with the temperature scale. I would assume that a small volume of beer would be easier to freeze than a large carboy. I am not an expert at this, however I think that ultimately we're just having some fun here and enjoy experimenting.

At this point I think I'm going to Jack everything I brew.

dlester said:

At this point I think I'm going to Jack everything I brew.

Click to expand...

Why not just do it the right way instead of doing it the painful, long-drawn-out way just to toe the legal line?

broadbill said:

Why not just do it the right way instead of doing it the painful, long-drawn-out way just to toe the legal line?

Click to expand...

In some ways I agree with this. If you're really looking for 40% abv I don't think this is the way to do it.

However, for a nice strong beer with a magnified flavor profile this seems like an easier method than babying (and praying) a beer up to 25% through staggered sugar additions.

My next freeze concentrated beer is going to be a lightly hopped smash (MO probably) in the 12% range before freezing.

dlester said:

At this point I think I'm going to Jack everything I brew.

Click to expand...

Allow me to be the first on this thread with a cheesy joke.
SWMBO walks into your brew area and says "what are you doing?"
You reply "Jacking my wee heavy."

broadbill said:

Why not just do it the right way instead of doing it the painful, long-drawn-out way just to toe the legal line?

Click to expand...

If by "the right way" you mean the big D - word (that we cant mention on these forums without getting bithcslapped by a moderator)
you basically strip away most if not all of the flavor profile depending on the D - word equipment used which i don't think is the goal here.
What i do think the goal is, is to make something still flavorfull as a beer but just with a much higher ABV than attainable with your normal beer yeasts.

Also freeze concentrating is a much less dangerous procedure.
Put in freezer and come back a few hours later vs a process involving a HIGLY FLAMMABLE vapor right next to an open flame.

Aside from that,freeze concentration doesn't require any extra gear vs D -word.So combine legal/no danger/no gear vs illegal/potential fire hazard/gear needed & it sounds like freeze concentration is the better option here especially for somebody trying to make something tastefull.

Paps said:

Allow me to be the first on this thread with a cheesy joke.
SWMBO walks into your brew area and says "what are you doing?"
You reply "Jacking my wee heavy."

Click to expand...

Thank you, thank you...I'll be here all week. Go try the brisket. Love it...

broadbill said:

Why not just do it the right way instead of doing it the painful, long-drawn-out way just to toe the legal line?

Click to expand...

Well Mr. Broadbill, doing something illegal, like what I think your hinting at, is a choice. I choose to do the right thing because I want to. I also work in a position of trust. Doing something of that nature would put me, and the family that depends on me, at risk. For what? A few bottles of booze? I can buy that anywhere without any risk.

Plus, I think that the flavors you get off of fractional freezing is fantastic. I would rather Jack my wee heavy, LOL, than attempt to distill spirits. Love the joke made earlier.

Paps said:

If by "the right way" you mean the big D - word (that we cant mention on these forums without getting bithcslapped by a moderator)
you basically strip away most if not all of the flavor profile depending on the D - word equipment used which i don't think is the goal here.
What i do think the goal is, is to make something still flavorfull as a beer but just with a much higher ABV than attainable with your normal beer yeasts.

Also freeze concentrating is a much less dangerous procedure.
Put in freezer and come back a few hours later vs a process involving a HIGLY FLAMMABLE vapor right next to an open flame.

Aside from that,freeze concentration doesn't require any extra gear vs D -word.So combine legal/no danger/no gear vs illegal/potential fire hazard/gear needed & it sounds like freeze concentration is the better option here especially for somebody trying to make something tastefull.

Click to expand...

Well said Paps...

Thanks for all the information!

I do have 2 questions:

1. After the alcohol is concentrated how would you measure the alcohol content?

2. Could you naturally carbonate the beer after this process? (would the yeast still be viable?)

Thanks,

MT

MT_Keg said:

Thanks for all the information!

I do have 2 questions:

1. After the alcohol is concentrated how would you measure the alcohol content?

2. Could you naturally carbonate the beer after this process? (would the yeast still be viable?)

Thanks,

MT

Click to expand...

1. The ABV is directly related to the volume of liquids. If you know the ABV prior to fractional freezing, it's only a matter of math. If you reduce the volume by 75% with 25% remaining, divide the original ABV by the remaining percentage of the original volume, or 10%ABV/25% of original volume.

Equation: Original ABV/remaining percentage of original volume of liquid.

Example: If you have 10% in one gallon, and after you freeze, you have a quarter gallon remaining (25% of original volume), the math is this: 10%/.25 gallons = 40% ABV.

2. Forget carbonation, the C02 will not bind to pure alcohol molecules, at least I don't think they do. The proof is that I can't carbonate concentrated beer.

chri5 said:

In some ways I agree with this. If you're really looking for 40% abv I don't think this is the way to do it.

However, for a nice strong beer with a magnified flavor profile this seems like an easier method than babying (and praying) a beer up to 25% through staggered sugar additions.

My next freeze concentrated beer is going to be a lightly hopped smash (MO probably) in the 12% range before freezing.

Click to expand...

If you fractionally freeze 1 gallon of 12% beer down to a 1/4 gallon, your ABV will be 48%. However, it is my opinion that anything above 8% ABV will ferment hot (nail polish flavors) and require at minimum of one year to mellow. My 10% beer did and it took a year to mellow.

Paps said:

Allow me to be the first on this thread with a cheesy joke.
SWMBO walks into your brew area and says "what are you doing?"
You reply "Jacking my wee heavy."

Click to expand...

Many lols

chri5 said:

I have a small sample of a cider freezing right now actually to try this out.

My wife is enamored with the idea, and is pushing to start doing this more often with more beer styles.

I'm very interested to see how it comes out.

Click to expand...

Chri5, did you try your Apple Jack yet? If not, please come back and share. If so, please detail the tasting.

Regards,
dlester

dlester said:

Chri5, did you try your Apple Jack yet? If not, please come back and share. If so, please detail the tasting.

Regards,
dlester

Click to expand...

It was as hot tasting as the original. I had a feeling it would be though. Concentrating a bad flavor can only make it worse right? Lol

Ive made numerous beers that abv that were drinkable in a few weeks. Looks like I need to tweak this some more. I still have 3+ gallons of this on the yeast. I'm moving it to secondary this week for aging, I'll try again with 2L of it when I think its ready for bottling.

I'll update this thread when I try it again.

chri5 said:

It was as hot tasting as the original. I had a feeling it would be though. Concentrating a bad flavor can only make it worse right? Lol

Ive made numerous beers that abv that were drinkable in a few weeks. Looks like I need to tweak this some more. I still have 3+ gallons of this on the yeast. I'm moving it to secondary this week for aging, I'll try again with 2L of it when I think its ready for bottling.

I'll update this thread when I try it again.

Click to expand...

The drink is just young. You may have fermented it too hot. Give it a year. Pull out the bottle next xmas.

Cheers

dlester said:

The drink is just young. You may have fermented it too hot. Give it a year. Pull out the bottle next xmas.

Cheers

Click to expand...

I had to try some tonight after replying.

It was very sour/tart. Reminded me of a sour beer, the good kind of sour beer.

I Plan on letting the non-concentrated stuff go for a while still. I have less than 1/4 cup of the concentrated version. It will be gone the next time I have a friend over.

I turned 500-ml of my cider recipe into 200-ml of apple-jack a ways back.
To my suprise the flavor was subdued instead of `in your face concentrated` like i was expecting it to be.It didn't burn going down at all.
Now the cider started close to 20% ABV before concentrating.
I'm not sure on the math but i think it was nearing bourbon range ABV.
I can see that becoming pretty deadly as a person could be very tempted to down an entire 5th of it in a sitting rather quikly.
Reminds me of a quote somebody on here has.
I don't remember exactly how it went but it was something like.
`a man on too much wisky might kill his wife and burn his house down but a man on apple jack could burn the whole town down."
or something to that effect.I can see that happening.

I've been freeze distilling for awhile. I got the idea after reading about how the pioneers would make Apple Jack. They would let barrels of apple cider sit out in the winter.. every morning they would go out with a spoon and scoop off the ice that had formed on top. What was eventually left was Apple Jack.

When ever I make apple wine, I usually take about 2 gallons of it, freeze it and make Apple Jack. Just put it in a water jug, freeze it, and turn it upside down over a pitcher.

Good stuff..

Paps said:

I turned 500-ml of my cider recipe into 200-ml of apple-jack a ways back.
To my suprise the flavor was subdued instead of `in your face concentrated` like i was expecting it to be.It didn't burn going down at all.
Now the cider started close to 20% ABV before concentrating.
I'm not sure on the math but i think it was nearing bourbon range ABV.
I can see that becoming pretty deadly as a person could be very tempted to down an entire 5th of it in a sitting rather quikly.
Reminds me of a quote somebody on here has.
I don't remember exactly how it went but it was something like.
`a man on too much wisky might kill his wife and burn his house down but a man on apple jack could burn the whole town down."
or something to that effect.I can see that happening.

Click to expand...

No, I remember it as " a man on too much whiskey saw an alien craft crash near town. Later it became a sensation." LOL, kidding, I see where your from. Will have to visit sometime.

This sounds like a great idea. I will have to give it a try soon. Is there any specific temperature that I need to freeze the liquid in question? Also how long is a good amount of time to let it sit upside down while it thaws?

Paps said:

I turned 500-ml of my cider recipe into 200-ml of apple-jack a ways back.
To my suprise the flavor was subdued instead of `in your face concentrated` like i was expecting it to be.It didn't burn going down at all.
Now the cider started close to 20% ABV before concentrating.
I'm not sure on the math but i think it was nearing bourbon range ABV.
I can see that becoming pretty deadly as a person could be very tempted to down an entire 5th of it in a sitting rather quikly.
Reminds me of a quote somebody on here has.
I don't remember exactly how it went but it was something like.
`a man on too much wisky might kill his wife and burn his house down but a man on apple jack could burn the whole town down."
or something to that effect.I can see that happening.

Click to expand...

It looks like you got about 40% of the volume. At 20% original ABV, which is damn high, the concentrate should be about 50% ABV (assuming all alcohol was extracted). It must have been a good time.

I'm doing an apple cider around 8% with dark brown and white sugar. I'm adding acid for a nice bite. I should be able to concentrate it down to between 30-35% ABV.