About time I built a stand

Hello everyone. I have decided to invest in a brewing stand to make my brew day easier and more efficient. This thread will hopefully allow others to help me to identify any weaknesses in my plan. Thank you in advance to those who take the time!

First, I haven't yet found a method to scan my drawings but the stand is modeled after the B3 tippy dump sculpture using 1 1/2" x 3/4" 16 gauge rectangular tubing. The differences are that I will not be making the MLT on a tippy swing - just a burner, and the kettles are 15.5 gallon sanke kegs - because they're cheaper. I already own a converted sanke MLT.

As I am beginning to order parts I realized that I am unsure of what propane regulator to buy. Here is my current plan:
3 cast propane burners - one for each tier. I plan to pipe these in rigidly with a cheap black pipe manifold with 1/4 turn valves to cut the gas. Attached to the manifold will be a 20 psi regulator. Does this sound reasonable?

To move the wort I plan to purchase a march 809 with the 3/4" MPT face centered inlet and 1/2 MPT outlet. This will be attached at the base of the stand to avoid priming issues. All connections will be made with the brass mcmaster quick disconnects that are so popular - and again cheap. I am omitting the list of couplings and QD parts.

Currently, I chill with a copper immersion chiller. I plan to upgrade to a stand-mounted plate chiller. There are several models available on e-bay, but I plan to purchase dudadiesel's 30 plate heat exchanger for about $75.

I hope to have some pictures up soon. I know I love 'em.

Also, does anyone know where to find back connecting 1/2" NPT dial thermometers for a good price? B3 has some fairly nice ones for ~$35, but the are sold out. Mcmaster sells dial thermometers for insanely high prices, and I find the units available through sabco difficult to read.

Take a look at Bargain Fittings

Wayne offers quite a lot of goodies at very nice prices.

Those burners are going to be loud if you brew in a garage/enclosed space.

Good call on the bargainfittings.com! Ball valves are ~$5 cheaper than I found and Thermometers are ~$10 less.

Wildwest - do you have another burner suggestion? The cast burners are cheap (loud, but I have survived on a single burner of the same kind for years) and I hope to some day upgrade to natural gas...

Dultmeier Sales has good prices on thermometers, but they are wholesale and only sell business to business. Not sure how they would know for sure though. http://www.dultmeier.com/products/search/78

Here is another place to get your burners from. Cheaper.

http://www.agrisupply.com/cast-iron-burner/p/30295/cn/5400000/

I am thinking about getting couplers welded to my keg kettles, rather than having weldless fittings all over my new brewing stand, but I am unsure of who or what I am looking for in a welder. I live in the Minneapolis metro area if anyone knows a good/reasonably priced tig welder in this area.

WoweeZowee said:

Wildwest - do you have another burner suggestion? The cast burners are cheap (loud, but I have survived on a single burner of the same kind for years) and I hope to some day upgrade to natural gas...

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Yes, I realize they are expensive, but are quiet and have nearly unlimited heating capacity.
http://bayouclassicdepot.com/bg14_cast_iron_burner.htm


If you need something cheaper, these are less powerful, but also quiet.
http://bayouclassicdepot.com/bg12_cast_iron_burner.htm

WoweeZowee said:

I am thinking about getting couplers welded to my keg kettles, rather than having weldless fittings all over my new brewing stand, but I am unsure of who or what I am looking for in a welder. I live in the Minneapolis metro area if anyone knows a good/reasonably priced tig welder in this area.

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OhioEd has a great thread about finding a weldor. If I come across the link I will post it for you. Questions to ask and what not.

wildwest450 said:

Yes, I realize they are expensive, but are quiet and have nearly unlimited heating capacity.
http://bayouclassicdepot.com/bg14_cast_iron_burner.htm


If you need something cheaper, these are less powerful, but also quiet.
http://bayouclassicdepot.com/bg12_cast_iron_burner.htm

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I know this is off topic but, I found something interesting the other day. Burners are rated in BTUs/HR. The first one you posted claims 210,000 BTUs/HR. The thing I found is a 20Lb tank of propane is only capable of delivering 96,000 BTUs/HR at a constant flow rate. I am still trying to figure out if this is true or not. If it is, then unless you have the tank, it isn't going to give you the heat.

Here is the "cheap" link for the bg14:

http://www.agrisupply.com/product.asp?pn=64494&sid=&eid=

wildwest450 said:

Those burners are going to be loud if you brew in a garage/enclosed space.

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I don't recommend that anyone ever use burners in an enclosed space because of the dangers carbon monoxide. Burners should be used in a well-ventilated area.

I used those burners, and they are not loud ever. IF you crank them up all the way, then you can hear them but not in a loud way. However, there's never a need to crank them up that high.

There's nothing wrong with those burners. In fact, I recommend them.

GreenMonti said:

I know this is off topic but, I found something interesting the other day. Burners are rated in BTUs/HR. The first one you posted claims 210,000 BTUs/HR. The thing I found is a 20Lb tank of propane is only capable of delivering 96,000 BTUs/HR at a constant flow rate. I am still trying to figure out if this is true or not. If it is, then unless you have the tank, it isn't going to give you the heat.

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Regardless of the claims they put out a boat load of heat and best of all, they are nearly silent.

EarthBound said:

I don't recommend that anyone ever use burners in an enclosed space because of the dangers carbon monoxide. Burners should be used in a well-ventilated area.

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Enclosed doesn't mean it's not well ventilated. I've done 50+ batches in my garage, with no problems. And if you don't think those burners are noisy, maybe it's time for a hearing test. There's no comparison between the two.

wildwest450 said:

Regardless of the claims they put out a boat load of heat and best of all, they are nearly silent.

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That's good to know. I have thought about buying one of those burners several times. Its hard to justify since I have three of the other style.

I have never been around one of those burners. So I can't say as too the noise level. Maxing out at 10 PSI, I bet it is quiet. I do know that my burner, which is in my flash boiler. I can hardly hear it. You can easily have a conversation or listen to the radio at a comfortable level. Once the flame is tuned in to the firing rate, they quiet down a lot. The jet engine noise goes away. Just a hissing sound.

To the OP,

Here is that thread about weldors.
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/welding-questions-148798/

wildwest450 said:

Enclosed doesn't mean it's not well ventilated. I've done 50+ batches in my garage, with no problems. And if you don't think those burners are noisy, maybe it's time for a hearing test. There's no comparison between the two.

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Enclosed is defined as "surrounded on all sides." I actually just got a hearing test, and I have no damage whatsoever. And if someone thinks those burners are noisy, maybe he's just a puss. You've already pointed out a comparison (the cost) between the two, so yes there is a comparison. Good luck with the CO poisoning.

GreenMonti said:

I know this is off topic but, I found something interesting the other day. Burners are rated in BTUs/HR. The first one you posted claims 210,000 BTUs/HR. The thing I found is a 20Lb tank of propane is only capable of delivering 96,000 BTUs/HR at a constant flow rate. I am still trying to figure out if this is true or not. If it is, then unless you have the tank, it isn't going to give you the heat.

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I looked into this some more and you are correct about tank size effecting BTU/hr. Larger tank = more BTU per hour. So I assume this means the regulator I am looking at is capable of delivering more BTU/hr than my 20 lb (I have a 30lb tank too, but it is less convenient to fill) propane tank is - does this mean my regulator is oversized too?

I can chime in and say that the burners shown in the OP's post are loud when cranked up, like a small jet engine, even at maintaining a boil. The 10" banjo burner shown later is nearly silent when maintaining a boil, and with so many small flames vs a big cone, I think they heat a kettle more evenly and possibly more efficiently. I have both and use both. The small burner's flames lick up the sides of my keg when I'm trying to ramp temperatures.. For GreenMonti's flash boiler the "loud" one is perfect because of the shape of the flame and his lower flow usage. I'd like to build a FB for instant hot water and that's what I'd use, too. For a kettle, I think the 10" banjo is more ideal. The 6" one would probably be a nice compromise. Any of those burners will work fine, some are more suited to certain tasks.

WoweeZowee said:

I looked into this some more and you are correct about tank size effecting BTU/hr. Larger tank = more BTU per hour. So I assume this means the regulator I am looking at is capable of delivering more BTU/hr than my 20 lb (I have a 30lb tank too, but it is less convenient to fill) propane tank is - does this mean my regulator is oversized too?

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I have asked Kladue about this. I guess it is the surface temp of the tank that makes the biggest difference. The larger tanks have more surface area and are able to keep themselves at a warmer temp while the propane is being drawn. As the tank cools it slows down the boiling rate of the liquid in the tank. Since we are after the vapors that hurts us. Keeping the tank warm will help against this issue. IIRC I read somewhere here that keeping the tank in a tub of water will get you the BTUs for a longer period of time.

I don't think any of the gear is over sized. Any of the burners or the regulators are great. I was just mentioning that the size of the tank makes a difference as to what you get in the end. A 200,000 BTU/HR burner isn't going to give you that if you can't supply it. That's where I was coming from. Any one of the burners and a 20lb tank will most definitely do the job and do it very well.

bendavanza said:

I can chime in and say that the burners shown in the OP's post are loud when cranked up, like a small jet engine, even at maintaining a boil.

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Are you guys tuning the flame? I promise you guys, its not loud.

So I don't have the best equipment for video or pics. However here is the latest of my 4" burner running very quietly. Most of the noise is background static from a poor mic. I am speaking at normal level. I do get to run the fire at a little lower rate then the direct firing folks, but if you tune it it isn't loud like the jet engine it can sound like. You can even hear the water boiling in the kettle.




Edit; That gauge is showing my steam pressure, not the propane pressure.

Just picked up the steel today. The supplier did not have the originally specified material, so I went with 14 gauge 3/4" x 1 1/2" tubing. A little on the heavy side, but the stand was already overbuilt anyway...