Environmental friendly brewing...

I got inspired by EdWorts Recirculating Ice Water Chiller and decided to start this thread. I hope that every one would agree with me on the fact that homebrewing can be really resources wasting. Everyone can brew with gallons of waste water, kilowatts of wasted electricity, pounds of burned propane etc. So i would like you guys who try to save $$$ and nature to post your methods of doing so. As i said at the beggining, I really like EdWorts Water Chiller and have been using it ever since i first saw it. And i also use my food freezer to get the ice for it. And i also save the heated water from water chiller for cleaning at the end of brewing day. So if anyone has any other ideas on brewing, fermenting, bottling, kegging etc. techniques that save resources go ahead and post it.
Cheerz

This thread makes me want to dump used oil onto my yard.

Just sayin'...

While it's nice to think that conserving water by using ice to chill saves resources and this in turn makes brewing less damaging to the environment, the reality might be quite different. One needs to consider that the ice was likely made using electrically operated refrigeration equipment. This electricity was probably generated in a fossil fuel burning power located a considerable distance from your point of use. IOW, the ice comes with an environmental price tag of its own. Might be better to use more water and less ice. Can't really say one way or the other without penciling it out in detail. Water is a renewable resource. Fossil fuels are not. I know, fresh water delivered to your tap also has an environmental cost. I'd like to find more ways to make brewing more environmentally friendly, but it's not as easy as we sometimes think.

There are other threads regarding this same sentiment and I apologize that I can not find them right now. They include uses for run off water from chillers (saving the water for cleaning, watering the lawn/garden for example).

Your sentiments are great but like so many situations, may be misguided.

Using ice made by your freezer is less efficient than buying in bulk, thereby using more energy. Running the pump likely uses more energy that using more water. Saving the water after use is good.

An all electric system would be the most efficient because a larger amount of the energy is actually being absorbed by the wort. Not using any refrigeration during fermentation would help.

In general, if you want to feel good about homebrewing, rest assured that you are using less resources that way than buy commercial beer. You have very little shipping and packaging.

I do have to admit, this does kind of make me want to light some tires on fire.

Boerderij_Kabouter said:

I do have to admit, this does kind of make me want to light some tires on fire.

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Mind if I pour my used motor oil on them first?

Boerderij_Kabouter said:

Your sentiments are great but like so many situations, may be misguided.

Using ice made by your freezer is less efficient than buying in bulk, thereby using more energy. Running the pump likely uses more energy that using more water. Saving the water after use is good.

An all electric system would be the most efficient because a larger amount of the energy is actually being absorbed by the wort. Not using any refrigeration during fermentation would help.

In general, if you want to feel good about homebrewing, rest assured that you are using less resources that way than buy commercial beer. You have very little shipping and packaging.

I do have to admit, this does kind of make me want to light some tires on fire.

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So soon after Earthday, it seems a shame!

With the fantastic incentives to buy small scale (residential) systems for renewable energy, it might be worth looking into setting up an electric HLT and brew kettle. From Department of Energy - Tax Breaks

Residential Renewable Energy Tax Credits
Consumers who install solar energy systems (including solar water heating and solar electric systems), small wind systems, geothermal heat pumps, and residential fuel cell and microturbine systems can receive a 30% tax credit for systems placed in service before December 31, 2016; the previous tax credit cap no longer applies.

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As long as you live in a state where you can sell excess energy back onto the grid (usually requires a special meter upgrade as well) the systems don't need to be very complex.



Depending on the type of solar/turbine system you implement and the size of your electric brewing setup it could potentially make a difference. But it probably wouldn't be something to tackle in an effort to save money.

But as many have already said, this hobby isn't very environmentally friendly.

I run a fully electric rig in insualted coolers (efficient)

I also NO CHILL my beer now... so no wasted water/ice

I guess I am "Green Brewing"

I also compost all of my spent grain/hops

I might be wasting a bit of water, but in the middle of Michigan, I'm not too worried about it. I can let it run into the ground where it will end up mostly back in the water supply for the town, filtered through the earth.

I reduce water use by not taking that second shower each week.

I'd love to set up a wind generator, but don't have the $$ to do that right now and I'm not in a great place to take advantage of the wind anyway.

I don't like green beer. Now that I have my pipeline full, I tend to let it age a bit.

My wife and I looked into wind... and deducted all of the govt. money that you can get back.... still, very expensive and you have to deal with zoning issues since most of them require a nearly 100' tall pole to get far enough above the turbulent air left by trees, buildings, homes.

You also need to look at your avg. wind speed in your area too. Our electric bill for our 3000sq ft home is about 50-75 bucks a month depending on whether the central air is on. In our area a residential wind turbine would generate about HALF of our electricity. So, the payoff in $$ would take quite some time.

Thanks, The Pol at least one who understood what this thread was about. Not about being green by all means necessary, but rather about what makes the brewing process more efficient and possibly green. If you are sceptic i don't mind. It wasn't the purpose of this thread to discuss the global warming or things like that. I've just wanted to collect the ideas for good, efficient and not wasteful homebrewing techniques.
That's it. And if you wanna burn tires in your backyard and pour used oil over them i don't mind, it is your backyard, so what.

I also looked into wind. It makes no sense.

Brewing is a water-intensive process, and it's something that commercial breweries struggle with at every step in the process.

If you can repurpose your cooling water, you are doing what many commercials breweries do - the water used in cooling is diverted to the HLT for the next batch.

It's all about common sense on a personal level. I believe the last issue of Zymurgy included a section on green brewing, if memory serves.

- I compost spent grain/hops
- Reserve waste water from cooling to clean equipment or it goes into the washing machine.
- I've been trying to find some rain barrels for the garden.
- I try to brew according to the season.

The Pol said:

So, the payoff in $$ would take quite some time.

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This thread is about being green, not saving green.

We were just teasing you with the burning stuff

If you really do want to limit the impact, go electric and reuse as much material as you can. If you can source ingredients locally, that would make a big difference. Brew with the seasons, i.e., lagers in winter, ales in summer.

Outside of polluting beyond repair, is it possible to end up with less water on earth than before brewing, no matter what you do? It ultimately ends up in the atmosphere over and over again, right?

All my waste water goes into my pool, so I get a biscuit

I am on a well, my waste water turns into my fresh water.

Saving water is a legitimate concern in some places though.

freddyb said:

This thread is about being green, not saving green.

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Yah, but for most families laying down $30K for a wind turbine needs to make fiscal sense.

Which is why there is to much opposition to green technologies... it needs to make $$.

The Pol said:

Yah, but for most families laying down $30K for a wind turbine needs to make fiscal sense.

Which is why there is to much opposition to green technologies... it needs to make $$.

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I agree. Thanks for sharing your experience.

Boerderij_Kabouter said:

I also looked into wind. It makes no sense.

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I pissed into the wind once...That also made no sense



for the OP -> http://cdn1.libsyn.com/basicbrewing...21&nva=20090425192621&t=0467580f540ede6b280f0

Brew in a Bag is very environmental.
less equipment to prep & clean, no chill method no wasted water or power.
I have only done one so far but it seems to be the way to go to save time, labor, money, water & power.

Now that I think about it, be most green way is probably to go to your local micro brewery or brew pub and just drink their beer.

I started this thread a little while ago. Lots of good ideas on how to be more efficient - you just have to weed through the negativity that seems to come from the same three people.

I like most use my chill water to clean with, etc. However when I am totally done instead of poring it down the drain, it goes on the grass, plants, etc. Same thing goes when I am cleaning kegs, bottles, etc.

It also makes $$ sense, because I pay less in sewage that way!

cyberbackpacker said:

I like most use my chill water to clean with, etc. However when I am totally done instead of poring it down the drain, it goes on the grass, plants, etc. Same thing goes when I am cleaning kegs, bottles, etc.

It also makes $$ sense, because I pay less in sewage that way!

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Unless you are being billed differently than most communities, your sewer bill is based on your water consumption, regardless of how much actually goes down the drain. They don't measure the wastewater. That said, you will save on your sewer bill if you use less water.

Catt22 said:

Unless you are being billed differently than most communities, your sewer bill is based on your water consumption, regardless of how much actually goes down the drain. They don't measure the wastewater. That said, you will save on your sewer bill if you use less water.

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Yeah, it is weird, we are billed for what goes down the drain...

cyberbackpacker said:

Yeah, it is weird, we are billed for what goes down the drain...

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I bet you own an out-house

cyberbackpacker said:

Yeah, it is weird, we are billed for what goes down the drain...

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Really? That's the first time I've ever heard of that. How do they measure how much goes down the drain to the sewer? Are you charged by the gallon or what? I'm having trouble visualizing a sewage meter and how it might work.

Catt22 said:

I'm having trouble visualizing a sewage meter and how it might work.

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I just don't want to have to fix it when it breaks.

They figure whatever goes in must come out and charge you accordingly. That is why filling a pool or watering your lawn costs more than it should... They are charging you for it going down the sewer...

planenut said:

They figure whatever goes in must come out and charge you accordingly. That is why filling a pool or watering your lawn costs more than it should... They are charging you for it going down the sewer...

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My sewage is flat rate...

The town next door, they allow you to sign up for a SUMMER watering program where they lock you in at a flat sewage rate so that you dont get penalized when you water the grass.

I agree with the OP about the recirculating CFC / IC pump... It just makes sense not to waste 20 minutes of water flow to cool wort... Now if it was summer time and you just overseeded your lawn, then hook the output to a sprinkler and go back to your regularly scheduled programming...

That being said, I am by know means an environmental guru... Sure I recycle as much as I can, I have a rain barrel (that I don't think I have ever used) and I even started a compost pile for various kitchen scraps / brew leftovers...

I however do not plan on getting rid of any of my 5 cars, stop using my A/C at any point, or replacing all my lightbulbs with CFL's...

I take pride in my size 15 carbon footprint...

I just put my keggle on top one of the burning tires in my backyard. We've all got to do our part.

It seems like kegging your beer is a lot more green than bottling every batch. The keg itself is likely reused (Reduce Reuse Recycle), it takes less sanitizer to sanitize one container, no bottle caps just thrown away (if you don't use flip-top bottles), less material to cool compared to bottles + caps. I don't know how much environmental impact there is from buying the extra equipment, production of liquid CO2 (no extra CO2 released to the atmosphere because I think that is where it was extracted from, but I'm not positive).

You could even look into saving the CO2 produced during fermentation and use it to carbonate the beer. I read somewhere sometime that some German breweries do this.

To my knowledge Star-San is by far the most environmentally friendly sanitizer because it can be stored and reused. It's also probably not too bad for the environment if in small concentrations it's yeast nutrient.

Compost your used grains, hops and trub and use them to fertilize your garden of hop plants. Save your chiller water for watering said plants, laundry, yard etc.

alpo said:

I just put my keggle on top one of the burning tires in my backyard. We've all got to do our part.

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FYI: Recycling jokes does not make you green.

Boerderij_Kabouter said:

I now do my boil over a pile of burning tires. That way I can get rid of the tires and brew at the same time.

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Duckfoot said:

I take pride in my size 15 carbon footprint...

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That is a pretty sh&*%Y attitude. I think that we are pretty far past the "climate change is a myth" stage. Scientists have been screaming about it for Forty years, now finally some people are listening. Has spring snowmelt crept up a few weeks in your neck of the woods? How about the first blossoms of the spring?

Problem with electric is that most of tghe power plants in NA are coal fired. That's why I roll my eyes at these proposed allentirely electric cars.

I recirc chill in the summer as I can get fined for water abuse if it goes down the grain or on the lawn outside of watering hours/days.

Now, if you want a green way of boiling, build a rotating solar boiler.

Another aspect of environmentally-aware brewing is in the ingredients we use. When possible, I like to use organically grown malt, grain and hops. I'm fortunate, because I live in Chicago, I pickup 55 lb. bags of organic malt at Mid Country. Hops I get at Seven Bridges Coop.

Cheers for this thread!