IPA Citrus flavor: The Next Generation

I know that a strong citrus flavor is a characteristic of a good IPA. It seems to be the flavor that lies underneath the strong hoppy "front-taste". My question is, what would be the effect of adding citrus, perhaps Grapefruit specifically, to the beer during secondary fermentation. I figure you'd have the strong citrus taste brought on by the IPA itself combined with an actual citrus flavor. Is this insane? Have I had a few too many Samuel Waterstons tonight? Perhaps... thoughts?
-Ben

Mmmm, I haven't experimented with that yet considering I'm still pretty new to brewing, but I love IPA's and I think some citrus flavoring might be an interesting addition/complement

i'd like to try one

I wonder what the high acidity would do to yeast health during fermentation?

I wonder if it may be better to add the citrus after secondary fermentation . . . or at bottling. You would hate for a harsh acidic environment to mess with your yeasties. I have no idea.

hmmm... I really want to try this now! I figure I'll wait until my IPA's are ready to drink and see if they have a nice citrus flavor. I want to make sure whatever IPA I take to the next generation already has the correct prerequisites. How much would be reasonable? I don't think I would want it to be as strong as a Blueberry or rasperry beer or whatnot. Oh so many questions!
-Ben

did you ever go through with this? Sounds good...

I was discussing mash hopping Thursday night with someone who has done a lot of experimenting and he finds it really brings out the citrus and grapefruit in certain hops. He's been doing Belgians, so I don't know if it would apply to IPAs. Finally, he says it takes a huge amount of hops 3-4 ounces over and above what you would normally use.

How exactly does mash-hopping work? I add the hops themselves to my mash tun/cooler when mashing?
-Ben

You could try a hop back style container in your serving line.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Hops-in-line-ho...categoryZ38172QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting

Yup, just mix them in.

orfy said:

You could try a hop back style container in your serving line.

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I agree with Orfy! I made one from an undercounter water filter, and they really do work great. I followed the directions from The Hash Back on the Maltose Falcons website. Easy to make, and works great, and allows you to experiment with different hops types on the same beer without having to brew multiple batches. Pack it with Cascades and Centennial and pucker up!!!

Hop-packer-kegging gadget systems aside, I just toss the hops in the mash? Do I then strain them out just as I do with my grains? If I'm mashing at 153 or so, they aren't going to impart any bitterness, will they? I mean those same hop oils will be in the boil as well, if I'm not mistaken. Won't that impart additional IBUs?
-Ben

Sorry man, I get carried away with equipment sometimes.

Mash hopping is simple to do, just mix an amount of hops in with your grains when you mash, and collect your wort as usual. Nothing else. You definately will get a boost in your hop flavor and aroma. Im not really sure about exactly how much it will raise IBU's, but it will add some bitterness.

Some people swear by mash hopping, and many find no difference. I have done it, and like the extra aroma and flavor it gives.

Thanks man! And I like gadgets just as much as the next man... I just don't keg... yet. But when I do, I might just give that idea a try.
-Ben

What hops are you using? Cascade and Magnum might give you the citrusy flavor

My latest IPA hop rates were Galenas 1 oz 75 min, Fuggles 3/4 oz 60 min, east kent goldings 1 oz 30 min and 1/4 oz fuggles dry hop. I have a pleasant underlying citrus flavor...although the wife sez that is all she can taste!

I recently did an APA that is citrus overload. I didn't add any hops until the 30 minute mark and added a bunch at the end along with a dry hop. It has a really nice smooth bitterness, but the flavor and aroma jump out of the glass. :rockin:


Hops
Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
0.75 oz. Amarillo Gold Pellet 9.00 13.7 30 min
0.75 oz. Amarillo Gold Pellet 9.00 7.2 15 min
0.50 oz. Centennial Pellet 8.50 4.5 15 min
0.50 oz. Centennial Pellet 8.50 3.4 10 min
0.50 oz. Cascade Pellet 5.60 1.9 5 min
0.50 oz. Centennial Pellet 8.50 2.8 5 min
1.00 oz. Cascade Pellet 5.60 0.0 0 min
1.00 oz. Centennial Pellet 8.50 0.0 0 min
0.50 oz. Centennial Pellet 8.50 0.0 Dry Hop
0.50 oz. Amarillo Gold Pellet 9.00 0.0 Dry Hop

Those Amarillo should really do it if used right. I tried Monk Madness from Rogue the other day which uses them. To me, there was a lingering Grapefruit characterstic.

Fwiw, I think an IPA would be a good style for it (Grapefruit flavors that is).

From what I've heard, Sorachi Ace is ALL grapefruit. I've yet to try it, but I'm intrigued.

As for adding actual grapefruit, I wouldn't think that it'd be any good. Honestly, think about spoiled citrus fruit. If I were going to add actual citrus in any form, it would be the zest. Maybe you could try adding sanitized grapefruit zest to the secondary. That might work for you. Otherwise, I'm very wary of adding actual citrus juice to beer.

I did make a lemon/lime IPA awhile back. yeeehaw. I didn't actually add lemon or lime though. I added lime-basil leaves (which tasted alot like lime, but not like basil much at all) and some lemon verbena leaves (VERY lemony!) to the end of the boil. Tastes weird, like nothing you've had before, but it's awesome nonetheless. Try Lemon-Lime flavored Orbit gum. It's like that.

This link https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=22022&highlight=limoncello might give you some ideas. Maybe some oil of bergamot, some lemon rind, and some grapefruit rind - all steeped in grain alcohol for extraction, and added in along with the grain alcohol as a "dry hop" type adjunct into the secondary...

(edited to add limoncello thread link that I forgot to paste in there at time of original post)

Or just dry hop with whole leaf cascade and some citrus peel/rind of your liking. :fro:

I had a similar idea. I'm making an SOB


Special Orange Bitter



Maris Otter, a bit of Carapils, Amarillo, and Fuggles with some orange peel. Still working on the details...

Toot said:

I had a similar idea. I'm making an SOB


Special Orange Bitter



Maris Otter, a bit of Carapils, Amarillo, and Fuggles with some orange peel. Still working on the details...

Click to expand...

Post when you brew it!

LouT said:

Post when you brew it!

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Should be wednesday or thursday of this week. Those, I think, are my days off. Will be pitching on a preexisting London Ale/ESB yeast cake so I'm expecting a great ferment!

The tentative recipe is...

9 pounds Maris Otter
3 pounds 2 row
1 pound carapils

4/5 oz Amarillo @ 60
1/2 oz Fuggles @ 30
1/2 oz Fuggles @ 5/4/3/2/1
1/5 oz Amarillo @ Flameout

1/4 oz Amarillo dry hop
1 oz Sweet sweet orange peel zest for some unspecified number of days in secondary

London Ale Yeast

OG 1.055
FG 1.010

IBU's around 40 or so...

Cascade hops are good for getting that underlying grapefruit flavor.
That's actually my favorite part along with the "piney" bitterness of a good IPA.

I'm going for more of a classic British flavour... but with some orange. It should be discernably different from an IPA. It shouldn't taste like a fruit beer, it should taste like a beer with a hint of zest. It should be understated. Nothing like a modern IPA.

How'd it come out -out of primary yet, for a "taste" during racking to secondary?

LouT said:

How'd it come out -out of primary yet, for a "taste" during racking to secondary?

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My ESB was good coming out of primary and should take orange well. I'll be tweaking the recipe before I add the orange though.

Carastan malt has some grapefruit tones in my opinion. Lemon zest would be my addition of choice if I was going for citrus addition.

I tasted my ESB and was unimpressed. It was rather bland. So I decided to add half an ounce of orange peel. I boiled it in some water, then tossed it in. The ESB/SOB has been in secondary for about 2 weeks now.

After 12 hours, I sampled it. I could easily siphon the beer and bottle it right now! The orange is very subtle. I've received plenty of warnings about over-zesting, though, so I will be sampling again tonight and probably racking off to a tertiary... or bottling.. if I have enough bottles.

As for the flavor, it is very nice. I definitely like it with the orange. Ladies and Gents, we have an SOB.

Nice! Please update when it's bottled/kegged/ being consumed.

{removed text to start new thread, text was a bit off topic}

OK Toot, guess you didn't see the last post --- how did this end up coming out in the end?

Ballast point makes a grapefruit version of their sculpin IPA and its out of this world, not sure how they do it though its probably with grapefruit peel. I believe Abita and Shaflay add grapefruit juice as well as peel to their grapefruit ipas.

8 years...

lol

hahahahaha.