Yeast Washing Illustrated

MirImage said:

I just kegged a blonde ale and a cream ale. I screwed up washing the cream ale and only got two jars, but I don't think i'll be doing many more cream ales soon. Thanks for the Thread Bernie. Go Crew!

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You do realize that you can use your washed yeast in types of beer other than the type it came from, right? I'm not trying to be condescending. Just want to make sure you get the full benefit from doing this. Currently, I'm fermenting an amber ale with 1056, which was washed from a blue moon clone, which was washed from a cream ale. And on it goes. Props again to Bernie! This is an awesome thread.

Thanks for the guide. First attempt was a great success; re-pitched one jar straight away and was bubbling within a couple of hours.
In the jar I have in the fridge the water is yellow from the lager picked up in the trub. Should I decent and add cleaner (boiled) water or does a bit of malt not affect storage life at fridge temperates?

michaelsnayd said:

Great information! How long do these keep?

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Palmer says a couple of months and discard when it turns the colour of peanut butter.
I like the idea someone else mentioned about pitching to starter and washing again to "reset the clock", but my only concern is if you rely on this too much you're selecting from a small population of surviving cells and might altar the characteristics of your yeast.
Not relevant, but interesting: Palmer advises against repeatedly washing from secondary because you're effectively breeding the least flocculent cells that are slow to clear. Artificial selection in action!

jwalker1140 said:

You do realize that you can use your washed yeast in types of beer other than the type it came from, right? I'm not trying to be condescending. Just want to make sure you get the full benefit from doing this. Currently, I'm fermenting an amber ale with 1056, which was washed from a blue moon clone, which was washed from a cream ale. And on it goes. Props again to Bernie! This is an awesome thread.

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Yes I do. The Cream ale yeast I used was WLP080 Cream Ale Mix. I don't think many people have used it on other styles of beer. The other one is saf-05 which I use a lot of.

MirImage said:

Yes I do. The Cream ale yeast I used was WLP080 Cream Ale Mix. I don't think many people have used it on other styles of beer. The other one is saf-05 which I use a lot of.

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How did you like the WLP080? Was thinking of trying it on my next cream ale, I used Nottingham and 1956 on my first two attempts and they both were good.

BPhad said:

How did you like the WLP080? Was thinking of trying it on my next cream

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I've used it on two separate batches and thought they came out pretty good.

BPhad said:

How did you like the WLP080? Was thinking of trying it on my next cream ale, I used Nottingham and 1956 on my first two attempts and they both were good.

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I haven't tried it besides tasting samples but it was very clean. I wish I could have fermented it at lower temps but its hard for a low budget, apartment brewer in TX. I fermented in the high 60s.

MirImage said:

I haven't tried it besides tasting samples but it was very clean. I wish I could have fermented it at lower temps but its hard for a low budget, apartment brewer in TX. I fermented in the high 60s.

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MirImage said:

I haven't tried it besides tasting samples but it was very clean. I wish I could have fermented it at lower temps but its hard for a low budget, apartment brewer in TX. I fermented in the high 60s.

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Check out Nordeast's blog on Swamp Coolers. Very cheap and easy. It's what I do too.

So today, I boiled some bottled spring water along with some jars/lids in my boil kettle, put the lid on while I let it cool down a little and when I went to take the jars out of the BK, I noticed some solid particulate floating on the surface of the water. Not 100% certain what it was but figure it's most likely remnant extract from the last brew day this past Saturday. I did clean/scrub the BK after brewing but thinking I just didn't get all the extract cleaned out of it. What ever it is, it was boiled for ~25 minutes and I went ahead and put the sterilized jars of sterile water into the fridge to use when I'm ready to harvest/wash some yeast from a batch that is close to done fermenting.

Think I should use this water or not to harvest/wash yeast with? Appreciate any/all feed back as always.

I would use it, it's been boiled donut should be good.

Fwiw, when I do a wash I just use sanitizer on my jars and lids. It's easier and safer than trying to remove full jars of water from a near boiling vat of water. I just boil the water I need for the wash beforehand and let it cool down, then I always have some sanitizer made up on the day that I transfer.

HollisBT said:

I would use it, it's been boiled donut should be good.

Fwiw, when I do a wash I just use sanitizer on my jars and lids. It's easier and safer than trying to remove full jars of water from a near boiling vat of water. I just boil the water I need for the wash beforehand and let it cool down, then I always have some sanitizer made up on the day that I transfer.

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Thanks HollisBT, I completely agree with you re just sanitizing the jars/lids, after a good cleaning with hot, soapy water and thorough rinse.

Went to Walmart yesterday and bought a pair of cheap ($1.00) scissor tongs and they already have rust on them from putting them in water. So won't be using them any more, and don't want to pay $10-$15 for SS tongs, I too think sanitized jars/lids will be sufficient. THanks again.

Harvested/washed some SafaleUS-05 yesterday. Pretty easy.

I followed the same instructions with a California ale yeast that I had used for an American brown ale and it was in the refrigerator for about two weeks. Yesterday I used it to make a starter and I'm getting nothing. It's been about 18 hours and the room temp is super hot right now so I would have expected it to have a quick fermentation. Should I wait? Perhaps I did something wrong in the process and the yeast are dead. Should I try to pitch this to my next beer? Thanks for the help.

happycymbals said:

I followed the same instructions with a California ale yeast that I had used for an American brown ale and it was in the refrigerator for about two weeks. Yesterday I used it to make a starter and I'm getting nothing. It's been about 18 hours and the room temp is super hot right now so I would have expected it to have a quick fermentation. Should I wait? Perhaps I did something wrong in the process and the yeast are dead. Should I try to pitch this to my next beer? Thanks for the help.

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2 weeks is nothing. Did the yeast layer get thicker? A lot of times starters show no real "activity".

Ok it's now been over 24 hours and I'm seeing some action. I guess I'm used to faster fermentations with the starters I've made from the liquid yeast files. Perhaps it takes longer with repitched yeast? I just assumed the higher temps would speed things along.

explosivebeer said:

Logistically, I guess I don't really want my fridge filled with ten bottles of every yeast strain I try. I was just curious if there was a minimum amount of yeast you'd want in each container. As it is, I think I'll have more than enough with my current process.

If I find some smaller, stackable containers I might split my batches up a bit more but for now I'm happy to have seemingly learned how to wash and store yeast!

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I know this post is 5 years old but thought this would be helpful.
http://www.target.com/p/ball-5ct-pl...&CPNG=kitchen&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=12911517
We have some of these and I think they would be great for washed yeast. I will try it out in a few weeks.

Bernie Brewer said:

All that's left to do is label the jars and put them in the fridge. Then when it's time to make a starter, you just pull one out, let it warm to room temp, and decant most of the liquid out of the jar, give the rest a good shake, and pitch it into your starter..

Hope this helps. Good luck.

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Hi bernie:

i am wondering if you use just one of the starters per batch? I am confused by the statement "give the rest a good shake"...Does this mean the rest of the one container or the rest of all the containers? I expect that you are only talking about one mason jar per batch.

Thanks,

Ryan.

Humbly speaking for Bernie, I'm pretty sure this means give the rest of the contents in the one container a good shake in order to break up and loosen the yeast that's clumped together or clinging to the bottom of the jar.

How much can you bend the rules with this process and what are the consequences? Last week I threw some mason jars in the dishwasher ( on sanitary mode, no soap) with bottles when I was bottling. Instead of boiled water I used bottled water.

A couple days later I added another bottle of water and transferred to another mason jar, sanitized with starsan, because I had wayyy too much trub.

Which of these corners that I cut will have the worst effect? What is the sanitary status of bottled water? Can the dishwasher replace a boil? Would starsan not do the trick? Honestly, ill probably dump this yeast, the risk value reward ratio doesn't pay off. Just curious.

foodplusbeer said:

How much can you bend the rules with this process and what are the consequences? Last week I threw some mason jars in the dishwasher ( on sanitary mode, no soap) with bottles when I was bottling. Instead of boiled water I used bottled water.

A couple days later I added another bottle of water and transferred to another mason jar, sanitized with starsan, because I had wayyy too much trub.

Which of these corners that I cut will have the worst effect? What is the sanitary status of bottled water? Can the dishwasher replace a boil? Would starsan not do the trick? Honestly, ill probably dump this yeast, the risk value reward ratio doesn't pay off. Just curious.

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Starsan can certainly replace the boil for sanitization purposes. The other reason for boiling, though, is to drive off oxygen so that the yeast go dormant more easily. I know lots of people use bottled water during brewing with no problems. I would imagine it would be ok. My guess is that you are fine. If you are worried, just make a starter with your washed yeast and taste the wort after it is done fermenting out. If it tastes fine, you're good to go.

pabloj13 said:

Starsan can certainly replace the boil for sanitization purposes. The other reason for boiling, though, is to drive off oxygen so that the yeast go dormant more easily. I know lots of people use bottled water during brewing with no problems. I would imagine it would be ok. My guess is that you are fine. If you are worried, just make a starter with your washed yeast and taste the wort after it is done fermenting out. If it tastes fine, you're good to go.

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I've been using distilled water with no bad effects so far - about 5 batches of brew some 3rd generation.

BPhad said:

I've been using distilled water with no bad effects so far - about 5 batches of brew some 3rd generation.

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That's what I figured. Although I thought at some point the low ionic strength of that water was bad for the yeast. I guess it must not be enough to really bother them.

I plan on kegging 30 gallons of beer tomorrow and also washing the yeast. I boilled the water today to reduce the O2 but I didn't put it in sealed containers. It is still in the pot with the lid on. Anyone know if the water will reabsorb too much O2 that I should boil it again in the morning?

msa8967 said:

I plan on kegging 30 gallons of beer tomorrow and also washing the yeast. I boilled the water today to reduce the O2 but I didn't put it in sealed containers. It is still in the pot with the lid on. Anyone know if the water will reabsorb too much O2 that I should boil it again in the morning?

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Without agitation I doubt it. Even if it did, many people have washed yeast with regular water and it has worked fine. I'd go for it.

Has anyone stored washed liquid yeast in baby food jars? If so, would boiling and cooling the jars prior to pouring in the yeast be enough to properly sanitize the jars?

msa8967 said:

Has anyone stored washed liquid yeast in baby food jars? If so, would boiling and cooling the jars prior to pouring in the yeast be enough to properly sanitize the jars?

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It should be. I plan on using baby food jars for my next batch and probably just starsan the suckers.

I didn't know about the best way to make sure the lids were absolutely cleaned and sanitized. I agree that Starsan should be enough for the glass.

My baby food jar lids are essentially mason jar lids in one piece. But if you are at all concerned just use your method of choice and put pasteurized juice in them. If they ferment then that method failed.

Another question about yeast washing. Our tap water is not the best for drinking so I have been buying RO water for brewing and washing yeast. Does the water quality affect the outcomes of yeast washing at all? I do boil the water for 15 minutes to drive as much O2 out as possible.

msa8967 said:

I plan on kegging 30 gallons of beer tomorrow and also washing the yeast. I boilled the water today to reduce the O2 but I didn't put it in sealed containers. It is still in the pot with the lid on. Anyone know if the water will reabsorb too much O2 that I should boil it again in the morning?

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O2 will eventually finds it way into the solution, but one night with the lid on, I say wash away

So I have a somewhat interesting idea and want to know what people think about it.

When boiling the jars, what about adding some yeast nutrient to the water? It seems like the yeasties might benefit from having some nutrients in solution when they take their nap. Additionally, when you pitch the yeast into your beer, there would already be a dose of nutrient in solution to help get them going.

Am I missing something here? Would the nutrient go bad after a while, ruining the reclaimed yeast?

Zabuza said:

When boiling the jars, what about adding some yeast nutrient to the water? It seems like the yeasties might benefit from having some nutrients in solution when they take their nap. Additionally, when you pitch the yeast into your beer, there would already be a dose of nutrient in solution to help get them going.

Am I missing something here? Would the nutrient go bad after a while, ruining the reclaimed yeast?

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Couple thoughts:

When I boil my containers, I never end up using all the water I boil, so some of it would go to waste and I wouldn't be sure how much nutrient was in the final solution. In addition, the yeast will be going dormant and not using the nutrients at this point in their life cycle. Plus, most people decant off the top liquid (mostly water or "lite wort") before pitching the washed yeast anyway.

I add yeast nutrient to all of my starters, and I always make a starter with washed yeast, so the little buggers get their food directly.

Other brewers here may have different thoughts.

CastleHollow said:

Couple thoughts:

When I boil my containers, I never end up using all the water I boil, so some of it would go to waste and I wouldn't be sure how much nutrient was in the final solution. In addition, the yeast will be going dormant and not using the nutrients at this point in their life cycle. Plus, most people decant off the top liquid (mostly water or "lite wort") before pitching the washed yeast anyway.

I add yeast nutrient to all of my starters, and I always make a starter with washed yeast, so the little buggers get their food directly.

Other brewers here may have different thoughts.

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Fair enough. I suppose one could add more nutrient than normal, knowing a fair amount was going to be decanted off, but that just seems wasteful. I guess the important thing to consider is whether or not the nutrient would settle to the bottom or remain in solution during those months in the fridge. If it settled, it seems like this would be a good idea because the nutrient would remain with the yeast; otherwise, you're right - decanting that liquid off would pretty much nullify any reason to add nutrient to the boil. I had images of being able to add yeast + nutrient in one fell swoop...

One of the goals in storing yeast is to limit nutrients that would allow the yeast to resume growth. In fact, the survival of yeast in storage is enhanced if they have entered a state called "stationary" prior to storage. The cells actually have some very slow metabolic activity but they are not reliant on nutrients from the outside. That is the state they are in after spending 1-2 weeks in your fermenter. You don't really want to wake them up. That said, there is not much that is easily metabolizable for energy in most yeast nutrient but I still wouldn't recommend it. There may be some trace elements that are beneficial to the wellbeing of the cells but i still think the downsides outweigh the upside. I do recommend adding it to your starter.

Brewitt said:

One of the goals in storing yeast is to limit nutrients that would allow the yeast to resume growth. In fact, the survival of yeast in storage is enhanced if they have entered a state called "stationary" prior to storage. The cells actually have some very slow metabolic activity but they are not reliant on nutrients from the outside. That is the state they are in after spending 1-2 weeks in your fermenter. You don't really want to wake them up. That said, there is not much that is easily metabolizable for energy in most yeast nutrient but I still wouldn't recommend it. There may be some trace elements that are beneficial to the wellbeing of the cells but i still think the downsides outweigh the upside. I do recommend adding it to your starter.

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Alrighty, that makes sense. I guess I'll have to abandon the idea of creating the perfect yeast slurry to pitch all by itself

Back to making starters!

Well I started the process today. Got home from work and in the picture is what I have (they are 1/2 pint jars). I feel there is too much sediment in them, is that correct?

Hulud said:

Well I started the process today. Got home from work and in the picture is what I have (they are 1/2 pint jars). I feel there is too much sediment in them, is that correct?

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It might be hard to tell from my phone but that looks like yeast that settled down.

MirImage said:

It might be hard to tell from my phone but that looks like yeast that settled down.

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That's what I'm hoping for but it just seems like so much

Zabuza said:

Alrighty, that makes sense. I guess I'll have to abandon the idea of creating the perfect yeast slurry to pitch all by itself

Back to making starters!

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I'm not clear on why you say that. Nothing I said precludes a direct pitch. I think it is always best to make a starter but there should be no difference between pitching your washed yeast and pitching a purchased vial of yeast. Besides, isn't it best to add your nutrient to the wort?

Anyone know if the quality of the water used to wash yeast will affect the results? We have tap water that is not suited for drinking so I have been buying RO water for all of my brewing needs.