Is 1 gal. headspace in secondary an issue if dryhopping?

I have been fermenting 4 gallons of IIPA in a 6 gallon primary carboy for about 8 days now at a gradual increase of 62-67 F. In another 10 days or so, I wish to transfer this volume to a 5 gallon secondary carboy, but I am worried about oxygenation.

The beer was fermented with a WLP001 starter yet it is still quite cloudy with an active krausen. There is a lot of residual yeast and floaties in this beer, which I don't believe careful racking along with cold crashing will completely quell. I want to be able to see straight through this beer when it's poured and was also considering gelatin in the bottling bucket.

So in summation, I was planning on racking the beer onto 3.5 oz. whole leaf dryhops for 7 days, which will take up some headspace in the secondary. Is this safe?

IMO, leave it in primary. Let it sit. When the yeast have dropped out, add the dry hops, 1 day before bottling add gelatin. You'll have an amazingly clear beer.

Dry hops will most likely add haze to your beer, defeating the point of your secondary.

Also, that is a lot of headspace. I did that for a year with no problems. Then I brewed a rye pale ale, got signed up to work on 8 short films in 2 months, didn't get a chance to bottle it. The beer became so oxidized it was completely undrinkable. If you're making 4 gallon batches get a 5 gallon fermenter, with a 3 and a 1 gallon secondary.

+1 to harry. You could rack it to secondary but you have to have some way of purging the co2 out. I would just DH in primary.

Is 1 gal. head space in secondary an issue if dry hopping?

Not in my experience... though I rarely use a secondary these days...

in my experience it doesn't matter if you are dry hopping or not, you want to reduce the surface area of the beer exposed to air...

I rarely secondary anymore also, but when I did leave some head space on accident the beer did get some oxidation.

harrymanback92 said:

Dry hops will most likely add haze to your beer, defeating the point of your secondary.

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I have been getting somewhat clear beers in the primary, but they are always like a 3.75 out of 5.0 in terms of clarity. Even when using a ton of hops, which I always do, hop oil haze is not an issue for my beers. Rather, the issue is a bit of yeast carryover into the bottles despite giving it time and racking carefully. I want to be able to pour a bottle into my glass without having to worry about too much yeast sediment interfering with the beyond crystal clear clarity.

I have not had a problem with headspace in the primary, so I'm not worried about using a 6 gallon primary even to ferment 2.5 gallons of wort. I know it's completely different to compare 4 gallons in a 6 gallon primary to 4 gallons in a 5 gallon secondary. But I figured the slight extra headspace in the secondary this time around would be taken up by the massive dryhop. I'm using about an oz. dryhops per gallon of beer. And I always bottle without fail in about 3.5 to 4 weeks from the original brewdate.

Hopper5000 said:

you would have to have some way of purging the co2 out.

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You mean purging more C02 "into" the secondary? There's a thick blanket of C02 atop the beer right now protecting it. C02 is heavier than 02. I figure if I rack carefully onto 3.5 oz. leaf dryhops, there should be little headspace, if any, left in the 5 gallon secondary. Those leaf hops swell up quite a bit.

Do you keg your beer? If so, a shot of Co2 into the secondary, before racking, will eliminate the oxygen uptake. There are several ways to dry hop, but ideally, I'd recommend going to the secondary even if you don't have access to Co2. Yes, there will be some uptake, but if you rack gently onto the hops, there will likely be some Co2 forced out of solution by the hops and the simple act of racking, and that Co2 should protect the surface of your beer.

MileHiBrewingSupplies said:

Do you keg your beer? If so, a shot of Co2 into the secondary, before racking, will eliminate the oxygen uptake.

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No, I bottle.

MileHiBrewingSupplies said:

There are several ways to dry hop, but ideally, I'd recommend going to the secondary even if you don't have access to Co2. Yes, there will be some uptake, but it you rack gently onto the hops, there will likely be some Co2 forced out of solution by the hops and the simple act of racking, and that Co2 should protect the surface of your beer.

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Thanks for the alternate viewpoint and explanation. Still looking for others to give advice, whether encouraging or not, because I am still on the fence about this myself.

I am fully aware that 2.5 gallons in a 5 gallon secondary is a no-no, but I thought in my particular case (4 gallons in a 5 gallon secondary with careful racking and a ton of leaf dryhops) might be acceptable.

Yeah we have done it many times with no oxidation issues. I wouldnt recommend it, but ill keep doing it when needed until it gives me a problem.

Well regardless, if yeast carryover is what you've deemed to be the cause of haze in your glass gelatin will be a highly effective solution.

yes i mean purge the oxygen. even if you rack carefully there will still be oxygen in the carboy. I have a co2 tank i use to purge before I do any sort of transfer.

Hopper5000 said:

even if you rack carefully there will still be oxygen in the carboy.

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You're talking about oxygen being in the secondary right? I gather mostly all of the 02 has left the primary after 2-4 weeks of fermenting, conditioning, and being covered with an airlock as well as a dense 2 gallons worth of C02 blanket of in his 6 gallon primary. Just wanted to clarify this for anyone who might be confused.

C02 is much heavier than Air and O2. So if you do your best to cover the carboy opening when racking, then oxygen exposure should be inconsequential for up to an hour, possibly more... and still some of that C02 will push to the secondary with the secondary opening also covered as much as it can be during racking, and more C02 created by racking on top of the dryhops. If the OP gives this 7-10 days in the secondary, I doubt he will have oxygenation issues. Even with 1 gal headspace, most of which will be taken up by the 3.5 oz. dryhops, which expand when wet.

harrymanback92 said:

Well regardless, if yeast carryover is what you've deemed to be the cause of haze in your glass gelatin will be a highly effective solution.

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I've noticed that yeast carryover can still occur if carefully racking from primary to bottling bucket with an autosiphon. Even with an extremely high floc yeast and plenty of conditioning time. You're saying that gelatin will change that in one day? I have a hard time believing gelatin will prevent or limit yeast uptake. The yeast cake is still on the bottom of the primary either way.

What is the best way to use gelatin? I pulled up this, "I've been using gelatin for my last 12 or so batches and they all come out pretty clear. They even get clearer as time goes on. The way I do it is to use a whole tsp instead of the half that the bottle recommends, let bloom in cold water for an hour, heat to 170ish to dissolve. I then cool the solution and add it to my bottling bucket along with the priming solution."

Bob, you do have a point I always just play it safe and don't assume the there will be enough c02 in there to prevent oxidation.

I also think the other caveat with head space in secondary is you are leaving more area in there for nasties to be in there like brett, aceto, etc. It is greatly reduced if you cover the carboy. You have some solid advice there. I was just always told at my LHBS to have as little space as possible in there (secondary), but I have had a bit of headspace in secondary (probably about a gallon) and my beers turned out fine.

I guess I am just trying to say what the best practice should be, but obviously other methods totally work.

As for limiting yeast carryover, you can cold crash which will drop a good amount of yeast out. I do that and usually have a very limited amount carry over. I've never used gelatin.

By all means, correct me if I'm wrong. But leaving as little empty space as possible in the secondary would leave absolutely no room for the leaf dryhops. I've dryhopped the OP's volume in a 5 gallon secondary before and the leaf dryhops fluffed up into the neck of the carboy for a good 7 days. I assume this accounted for some of the protection. The beer tasted great. Using pellet hops would probably be the only way around leaving as little empty space as possible in the secondary yet still dryhopping big. Pellets don't take up too much space.

Even with a cold crash or gelatin, you still have a yeast cake and trub resting on the bottom of the primary, some of which (however minor or not) may still be sucked up and transferred to bottles. I think the OP's whole idea is that he wants to figure out if racking to secondary for the purposes of avoiding the cake/trub altogether is worth it for his clarity goal. It appears he knows how to cold crash and rack carefully already, yet he is still receiving 3.75 out of 5.0 in terms of clarity at best which he attributes to some minor yeast uptake. I say rack in this case. Though if it were 2.5 gallons of beer with 2 oz. dryhops, then I would not advise racking to a 5 gallon secondary.

Bob, not saying your wrong at all. With dry hopping involved I agree with your approach. It usually helps to put them in 1st and then let them hydrate as it fills up. The expansion part does present a challenge on the fill level and since hops are anti-bacterial anything that lands on them in the headspace will probably die...