Irish moss or not

Hello, just about to start a Chocolate Coffee Stout but didnt see Irish moss in the kit we had put together. Beforehand Irish moss has been a part of all the recipes i've brewed.

Is it critical to include or should i just ommit it for this boil seeing it is a stout, Any pros or cons considering the style???? Thanx

As far as I know Irish moss is only used as a clarifying agent and should have no affect on the taste. Your brew might be a little cloudy but its so dark you wouldn't notice anyway. I'm a pretty new brewer but that's what I read so far.

I have noticed that irish moss affects my head retention on my beers, although that just may be my beers. My assumption is that because the irish moss attracts protiens in the wort, this protien is good for the head retention on beer. I stopped using it except for beers that I want to be crystal clear. Since it is a dark beer I wouldn't use it. Also the longer you let your beer sit in the carboy or fridge the more sediment drops out anyways. Just my two cents.

Probably not needed in a stout. i use irish moss in all of my beers that i want clear. stouts are too dark to see any floaters. Cold crashing would do the same thing.

Yeah don't sweat it especially for a stout. I've also heard (forget where) that it's actually useless or harmful for extract beers. The reasoning being that all the crud has already been removed by the manufacturer when they created the extract. So any proteins you are removing with the moss are the good proteins that create good head and body.

Don't hold me to that but trevorc's post kinda backs that up.

edit: I think it was in How to Brew by Palmer

Docjowles said:

Yeah don't sweat it especially for a stout. I've also heard (forget where) that it's actually useless or harmful for extract beers. The reasoning being that all the crud has already been removed by the manufacturer when they created the extract. So any proteins you are removing with the moss are the good proteins that create good head and body.

Don't hold me to that but trevorc's post kinda backs that up.

edit: I think it was in How to Brew by Palmer

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That makes a lotta sense. I hadn't thought of that before. In the past I've only used it in lighter color beers but if this is true I shouldn't need to use it at all.

I asked the question at our last homebrew club meeting. They said that adding to even extracts wont do any harm. But Palmer does mention that that it does affect head retention as previously mentioned. Don't know for sure as I've used it all my beers. But then again I've yet to have good head retention either. Guess I'll have to whip up another batch to test the theory out.

i brewed for a while without irish moss and everyone commented on the amazing head retention of my brews. i have tried irish moss with my last two batches and there is no head retention whatsoever. btw, all have been extract. i won't be using it on the rest of my extract brews...especially the darker ones.

charlesmartin said:

i brewed for a while without irish moss and everyone commented on the amazing head retention of my brews. i have tried irish moss with my last two batches and there is no head retention whatsoever. btw, all have been extract. i won't be using it on the rest of my extract brews...especially the darker ones.

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I've just bottled a darkish ESB and all I got was a flocky mess. I won't be using it again in extract brews

bikelhelmet said:

all I got was a flocky mess

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Can you describe what that looked like?

Your beer should be clear by the time you bottle.
Did you add the Irish Moss to the boil, or the fermenter, perhaps?

IslandLizard said:

Can you describe what that looked like?

Your beer should be clear by the time you bottle.
Did you add the Irish Moss to the boil, or the fermenter, perhaps?

Click to expand...

It was entirely my fault. Added to boil for 10 mins, then filtered some hoppy gunk through strainer while pouring hot wort into fermenter. Once strainer was blocked I just poured the ENTIRE rest into fermenter.

For some reason in my head I wanted to mix in some more ingredients in with wort being in fermenter and still hot. Next time I may just decant into another boiling kettle first or let the wort settle a bit more and transfer with more care I guess.

Anyway, I sort of sensed the mistake after taking the second sample which had a fair amount of small coagulated nuggets floating around.
Come bottling day the things just kept coming.

I've got a couple of really bad bottles like in the picture. With a bit of luck most will settle & taste stays clean. We shall see.

bikelhelmet said:

I've got a couple of really bad bottles like in the picture. With a bit of luck most will settle & taste stays clean. We shall see.

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Those are big flakes! Is that the Irish Moss from the kettle? Or perhaps flakes from scorching? Hard to tell from the picture.

But your beer looks clear as a bell and beautiful!
Once they're carbonated, those flakes and any yeast should precipitate on the bottom, may take a few weeks. Cold storage (fridge) speeds that up.

When pouring, do it slowly, in a constant stream, without tilting back or glugging. As soon as you see the precipitated stuff reach the neck of the bottle, right before it pours out, tip the bottle back quickly ==> clear beer in your glass, without gunk.

I would take a good look at those flakes and determined where they come from.

bikelhelmet said:

For some reason in my head I wanted to mix in some more ingredients in with wort being in fermenter and still hot.

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What did you add?

bikelhelmet said:

Next time I may just decant into another boiling kettle first or let the wort settle a bit more and transfer with more care I guess.

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Are you not chilling your wort? Doing a no-chill in your fermenter?

You can just let the wort sit in the (covered) kettle for an hour or 2, then siphon the clear wort from the top, leaving the trub on the bottom. Toward the end of the transfer, tilt the kettle slowly (prop a wedge or thick rolled-up towel underneath one side) to keep the siphoning well deep, reducing losses, minimizing the precious wort left behind.

IslandLizard said:

Those are big flakes! Is that the Irish Moss from the kettle? Or perhaps flakes from scorching? Hard to tell from the picture.

But your beer looks clear as a bell and beautiful!
Once they're carbonated, those flakes and any yeast should precipitate on the bottom, may take a few weeks. Cold storage (fridge) speeds that up.

When pouring, do it slowly, in a constant stream, without tilting back or glugging. As soon as you see the precipitated stuff reach the neck of the bottle, right before it pours out, tip the bottle back quickly ==> clear beer in your glass, without gunk.

Click to expand...

IslandLizard said:

I would take a good look at those flakes and determined where they come from.

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Thanks for your tips! Yes I think I will have a look at a bad bottle soon. The odd part is that some flakes settle nicely whilst others seem to just float around a bit more

IslandLizard said:

What did you add?

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Just some more Fuggles hops to steep and DME. In hindsight I think I should just have transferred the wort into another pot, filtering out most of the sediments, then steep in second pot and let the rest settle out? I don't know, my setup is really simplistic.

IslandLizard said:

Are you not chilling your wort? Doing a no-chill in your fermenter?

Click to expand...

I only boil about 2-3 litres as I brew extract, then cool it down with 20 litres of chilled water to make a 5 gallon batch.

IslandLizard said:

You can just let the wort sit in the (covered) kettle for an hour or 2, then siphon the clear wort from the top, leaving the trub on the bottom. Toward the end of the transfer, tilt the kettle slowly (prop a wedge or thick rolled-up towel underneath one side) to keep the siphoning well deep, reducing losses, minimizing the precious wort left behind.

Click to expand...

Thanks again for your tips and time to reply. I appreciate it!